[11:00:19]  Melody Regent: Ok, 2 minute count down to give people a chance for coffee and bathroom
[11:00:26]  Motor Loon: I made two cups myself Silken °͜°
[11:00:31]  Silken Wilder:
[11:01:02]  Melody Regent: I may have to take a couple of very short breaks, I have a kid home sick today but overall should be no interuptions for me
[11:01:16]  Motor Loon: Nice turnout already
[11:01:28]  Melody Regent: This is a hot topic
[11:01:29]  Melody Regent: lol
[11:01:34]  Motor Loon: Apparently °͜°
[11:02:28]  Melody Regent: First I want to say thank you to Silken for being here. She is a fello Atlas member and I am glad she is here to make sure I stay on track.
[11:02:50]  Melody Regent: I want to thank you all for coming today. I know for many months now there have been a lot of questions about the Atlas program and even more rumors. I would like to ask that you send all questions to Trouble Streeter, Lead Manager for Regent Estates. Let me get thru everything I wanted to go over and she will then pass me questions, in open chat, for you all to see and I will reply to them.
[11:03:22]  Melody Regent: Regent Estates has been a member of the program since it was started. We, along with several other estates, were provided with the outline of the program and asked to sign an NDA if we wanted to be in the program. As a company, we felt it was something we wanted to be a part of, so we joined.
[11:03:46]  Melody Regent: The program is nearly the same today as it was when we started with very few changes. I will go over the ‘perks’ of this program step by step so you all know what the TRUTHS are. There are so many rumors and lies out there, that it’s not even funny.
[11:04:01]  Silken Wilder: (sorry was away..welcome Mel)
[11:04:11]  Melody Regent: I will be stating the FACTS about the program. If I do not say it, then consider it a rumor. We can go over the rumors at the end of this. I also want you to understand I am NOT Jack Linden and I will not dance around questions or ask you to bend over and blow smoke up your ass. I will answer questions honestly and clearly as possible and if I simply do not know, well I will actually SAY it.
[11:04:36]  Melody Regent: This conversation is in type for the exclusive reason that I hope there are few misunderstandings. I will also be posting this conversation to the Regent Blog – it will be posted under the LINDEN MEETINGS since this has a lot to do with Lindens and nearly nothing to do with Regent Estates.
[11:04:43]  Silken Wilder snickers
[11:04:45]  Melody Regent: http://regentestatessl.com/wordpress/?cat=6
[11:05:04]  Melody Regent: I will be using Emails from Linden Labs to maintain the accuracy of the program so that there is little misunderstanding. Well, atleast I hope.
[11:05:14]  Melody Regent: OK, lets get started so we can get to your questions and on with our days
[11:05:23]  Melody Regent: The following benefits are effective October 1st, 2010 – Where there have been some changes, I will make a note of the changes and what we ‘got’ before October 1st.
[11:05:41]  Melody Regent: FRE – Full Region Equivalent.
One full region (15K prims) is one FRE
3 homesteads region(3750 prims) is one FRE
4 open space regions (750 prims) is one FRE
[11:06:05]  Melody Regent: To be a member of the Atlas program you must own at least 20 FRE to join. If you have 20 FRE and are not a member, please contact Delby Linden, she is the person to speak to or one of the other account managers, that will be named later. We have nothing to do with who or how people join. I have no idea if there are additional requirements that we are unaware of. We all know how forth coming the Lab is about letting us know things. (brb 60 seconds)
[11:06:27]  SusieQ Ragu is Offline
[11:06:38]  Santabaia Schumsker: sorry
[11:06:41]  Santabaia Schumsker: chat lag
[11:06:50]  Zep Palen is Offline
[11:07:10]  Trouble Streeter: reminder, if you have questions to ask, send them to me and I will put them into open chat when Melody has finished her prepared information
[11:07:32]  Melody Regent: To be a member of the Atlas program you must own at least 20 FRE to join. If you have 20 FRE and are not a member, please contact Delby Linden, she is the person to speak to or one of the other account managers, that will be named later. We have nothing to do with who or how people join. I have no idea if there are additional requirements that we are unaware of. We all know how forth coming the Lab is about letting us know things.
[11:08:08]  Melody Regent: Nearly every company in the world offers savings to people that buy more. Even when you order something online, the more you buy, the cheaper things are. This program really is no different than businesses all over the world.
[11:08:17]  Zebulon Overland: hi all
[11:08:21]  Silken Wilder nods
[11:08:24]  Melody Regent: ***** Direct paste from Linden email*****
o Atlas membership is opt-in and voluntary for both the Atlas member and for Linden lab
o Membership is based on an estate owner having minimum 20 FREs and being in good standing with Linden Lab’s Terms of Service (TOS – http://secondlife.com/corporate/tos.php)
[11:08:35]  Melody Regent: o The purposes of the Atlas terms are to:
** Encourage healthy, responsible revenue growth for your company, as well as for the Lab
** Encourage collaboration among in-world businesses
** Build strong, professional partnerships between those businesses and the Lab.
[11:09:13]  Melody Regent: Perk 1 – For every 5 new FRE we add per quarter, we get 2 $1000usd credit to our account. They call the credit Set up credits. Members are able to buy sims from other residents or at the land store. For every 5 FRE we have new in a quarter, we get 2 set up credits in the land store.
[11:09:39]  Melody Regent: Example: Oct 1st I have 20 FRE to my name. On December 31st, I finish the quarter with 25 FRE to my name. They will then put $2000usd on my account so I can buy from the land store. The “Set up Credit” can ONLY be used for sims in the land store. It cannot be used to pay tier, to buy sims from another resident or anything else. It works ONLY FOR NEW SIMS FROM LL.
[11:10:07]  Melody Regent: **Old Perk, no longer valid. Prior to Oct 1, 2010 we had to ONLY buy sims from Linden Labs for us to be able to get the 2 set up credits. The other perk we no longer have, was we did get 60 days tier included in this purchase. Normally when you buy a sim from LL, you get 30 days tier, for Atlas, we got 60 days. This is NO LONGER a perk we get and this was the closest members got to getting free or reduced tier.
[11:10:52]  Melody Regent: Measured growth is done by the quarter. So if we buy 4 sims from October to December, then buy one in January we do NOT get a set up credit. If you buy 9 FRE in a quarter then you are only going to get 2 set up fees.
[11:11:15]  Melody Regent: Prior to October 1, 2010, we were REQUIRED to grow 5% a quarter or 23% a year. This was, in our minds, a very stupid rule. We are no longer required to grow at all. IF we buy, we get the set up fees, if we don’t… well, we don’t.
[11:11:37]  Melody Regent: Perk 2 – We do get discounts on Renaming sims and moving locations. They are not huge discounts but when you own 200 sims, every little bit counts.
[11:11:41]  Melody Regent: Renames are normally $50us – Atlas members pay $25
Moving sims are normally $150us – Atlas members pay $100
[11:12:15]  Melody Regent: Perk 3 – Account managers. We have account managers who help us keep track of our FRE and are there to handle any needs we may have. They track our growth and make sure that we get the credits we should get, based on the growth.
[11:12:40]  Melody Regent: Linden Account Management Team:
o Betsy Linden, Account Manager.
o Campbell Linden, Account Manager.
o Delby Linden, Director of Sales and Partner Operations
[11:13:04]  Melody Regent: ***** Directly from the email by LL *****
o A key Atlas benefit is that you will have an Account Manager (AM). That relationship is *individual* between you (the estate) and the account manager.
o Your account manager will act as your single point of contact to the Lab.
o Be assured that your AM will escalate your questions and concerns to the appropriate persons at LL, should that be necessary.
o The AM is integrated with all of the other teams at the lab and has the sole responsibility for helping you grow your account.
[11:13:57]  Melody Regent: Perk 4 – Atlas members do have a faster response time to tickets and requests BUT, this is not just part of the Atlas program, this is also part of the extended services program. This is a program open to anyone paying $5000usd a month or more, not just Atlas
[11:14:26]  Melody Regent: Perk 5 – Atlas members do have a different phone number we call to get help. Membership does not, however, entitle us to have access to 24 hour service like we once had. Even when you pay $20,000usd a month in tier, you cant reach a Linden for help at 2am.
[11:14:47]  Melody Regent: ***** DIrect cut and past ****
[11:14:49]  Melody Regent: o In the case of emergencies (including holidays), there is a separate ## for us to call. A member of our team will check that queue regularly. Emergency topics list includes:
** Region Down cases
** Region Rollback cases
** Governance/A-Tracker handling (business critical case types: ageplay, copybot, swarm, etc.
** All other issues will be handled during regular support times.
[11:14:55]  Melody Regent: o The Support team members you interact with are an all-Linden team.
o Support hours for tickets, chat and calls are Mon-Fri 8am to midnight SLT; Sat-Sun 8-8 SLT.
** On the dates that Support is closed, we will be checking the voice mail box hourly in case of emergency.
[11:16:18]  Melody Regent: Perk 6 – Quarterly meetings with the Account managers where they attempt to give us a road map of the future. (Yes, this is a personal note I am making on my own here. So far they have told us NOTHING first. This *insight* we keep hearing about, we hear about from the same blog posts as everyone else. To date, there has been nothing that I can recall *speaking in her best Ronald Regan voice* where we knew anything first)
[11:17:12]  Motor Loon: °͜°
[11:17:22]  Trouble Streeter: (reminder, questions to me in IM and I will put them into local when Mel’s finished)
[11:17:43]  Melody Regent: So let me do a wrap up of benefits so you can see there is not some sort of MASSIVE advantage I think a lot of people are expecting. It boils down to the following:
[11:17:45]  Melody Regent: Buy 5 sims and get 2 free
$25 rename fee
$100 move fee
Separate phone number to call that is not manned 24/7
Account manager who can tell me how many sims I own
Email address for a few Lindens
[11:18:35]  Melody Regent: I will take your questions in a few moments, so if you have not already sent them to Trouble, please do so now. I do want to address one more thing that I know will be coming up.
[11:19:17]  Melody Regent: Many of you know about a group called Federation of Estate Owners (FEO). This is a group of Atlas members that got together to ask for more things from LL. Sadly the group is not what it once was or could have been. Corruption by some of the leaders brought the group down.
[11:19:41]  Melody Regent: One thing that was ask for and DENIED but Linden Labs was allowing us to add Grandfathered homesteads to our estates on an ongoing basis. As of today, we have not heard back from them but I am also no longer a member of that group due to internal issues.
[11:20:19]  Melody Regent: Let me pause here to give you a direct cut and paste from an email I got from them. This way, you are all aware of what we are told and if they do different, the lies are on them, not us.
[11:20:29]  Melody Regent: ***** Direct paste, will pause a few for all to read *****
o Land pricing will not change in 2011 – Please see Nelson’s blog: http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/l … nd-pricing
o The Linden Lab Account Management team will not sell $95 Homesteads.
o User- groups can provide a tremendous opportunity to share best practices, insights, innovations and general support, as well as creating incredibly powerful and constructive ways of working with the Lab. ((Personal note here, the FEO is considered a user group))
o User Groups are not Linden sponsored or managed ((Regent Estates and Wild Islands Estates are personally starting one of these user groups that will not only include Atlas members but help mentor estates to become Atlas members. But more about this after the first of the year))
o All current participants in the Atlas program are eligible for all Atlas benefits whether or not that person is part of a group. To clarify, no Atlas user group is sponsored by Linden Lab and all current, qualified Atl
[11:20:29]  Melody Regent: as participants are eligible for Atlas benefits.
[11:21:26]  Motor Loon: (note the page in the link no longer exists, even if you spell it correctly)
[11:22:55]  Melody Regent: I personally put together a proposal, with another Atlas member, asking for Grandfathered homesteads. Asking to buy them in large numbers. Linden Labs turned down my request saying they do not and will not be offering GF HS to anyone. I was asking for 60 to be added to the grid right away. That is a shit load of money, I am an Atlas member, and I have one of the larger estates on the grid. They said no.
[11:23:22]  Melody Regent: It finally came up for me love – here is that link – http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/land/blog/2010/10/04/two-important-updates-on-2011-land-pricing
[11:23:34]  Motor Loon: ah good
[11:24:15]  Melody Regent: So NO, we are NOT getting free tier and we are NOT getting grandfathered sims and we are NOT getting a huge massive advantage over smaller estate owners. Someone recently asked me “What if I wanted to add 5 new sims right now, do you think LL would let me have 2 free set up fees”. I will say this, ASK THEM!!!!!!!!!! Send them an email and ASK THEM.
[11:24:49]  Melody Regent: Do they do deals with people? Out side the Atlas program? Yes, I can tell you right now that they do deals with people all the time. But you have to put together a REAL business proposal and show to them why it would make a good financial choice to give you this deal. “Cause I am paying you more money” is NOT a business plan. It makes them all warm and fuzzy if you give them something professional and well laid out…and REASONABLE.
[11:25:43]  Melody Regent: Ask them for anything you want, but if you want them to actually work with you and take you seriously, don’t ask for 100 free sims with no tier for a year. Not gonna happen in my personal opinion.
[11:26:07]  Somebody Something: darn. there goes Plan A
[11:26:14]  Melody Regent: Additional Announcements made at this quarterly meeting
***Direct cut and Paste *****
o Land Center
** Test with FedEO that started in August will end on November 30th
** Future plans for the Land Center are under consideration
o Atlas Growth
** LL is opening the program to new members.
** NDAs are no longer required.
[11:26:21]  Melody Regent:
[11:26:57]  Melody Regent: After I had written this up, I got the ‘wrap up’ from LL about the quarterly meeting we had. I want to share what was said that may not be known all around to keep you all ‘in the know’.
[11:27:17]  Melody Regent: Direct cut and paste from the email – should you have questions on how this will work, I really cannot answer those questions at this time, I would advise directing them to the Labs
[11:27:25]  Melody Regent: o Destination Guide & Affiliate Program
** In Q1 2011 we will be make changes to the Destination Guide in order to make Land and Estates easier to find. Participation in this will depend on your interest and be subject to the usual Destination Guide standards. More to come on the details.
** Those estates with websites who are involved with the Destination Guide can also become part of the affiliate program in order to drive more traffic to your estates.
[11:27:49]  Melody Regent: (Two more statements before I start taking the Q’s you have passed to Trouble)
[11:28:19]  Melody Regent: I am glad that I have finally been released from my NDA about the subject so I could clear up some of these rumors and lies. The program is not as horrible as I think a lot of people had in mind. As a business owner, I will also say that I do not think the program is as good as it could be. Regent Estates, on a personal note, has not grown much under the terms of this program and we doubt we will. We do like that we have contact with Linden Labs and that I am considered a “Bulk user”.
[11:28:53]  Melody Regent: As I said before, if I did not mention it above, then it is NOT part of the Atlas program and more than likely is a rumor or misunderstanding. Trouble? If you have some questions we have not answered, please post them in chat and lets start getting you guys the answers you want. I know I have given you all A LOT of information and I will try hard to answer questions honestly. If I cannot only because I do not know the answer as a fact, I will let you know this and refer you to the Labs for more information.
[11:29:01]  Melody Regent: Trouble, Questions please! (that only took 30 minutes, not so bad. Took me hours to put together!)
[11:29:21]  Trouble Streeter: [11:21:29] Joy Canadeo: If I understand this correctly , smaller estates who do not qualift for these Atlas Perks, will not be able to compete with the prices these larger estates will be able to offer?
[11:29:23]  Lillie Sands laughs
[11:30:10]  Joy Canadeo: and the room goes silent..lol
[11:30:17]  Silken Wilder: Mel will answer
[11:30:26]  Melody Regent: Joy? what prices are you asking about. Monthly tier prices? We do NOT get less on our tiers. The only thing we get when it comes to COST is for every FIVE sims we buy, we get TWO sims set up free. We still pay NORMAL tier on those two sims
[11:30:35]  Trouble Streeter: (I’ll post the next when mel says go… so as not to look like Jack’s office hour scrum )
[11:30:57]  Melody Regent: ((Yes, it will take me longer to reply as those will be real answers and not cut and pastes))
[11:31:33]  Melody Regent: Did that answer you Q joy?
[11:31:41]  Joy Canadeo: SO the rumor about buying in bulk and getting a reduction on tier is false
[11:31:59]  Melody Regent: RUMOR, yes maam. Atlas members do NOT get less tier pricing
[11:32:20]  Joy Canadeo: Thank you..yes you answered my questions
[11:32:26]  Melody Regent: if LL makes a ‘special’ deal with someone, I cant speak for that but Atlas does NOT get reduced tier
[11:32:50]  Melody Regent: I asked them to give me 60 GF HS sim and they said no
[11:33:11]  Silken Wilder: just a side note..LL likes everyone to pay full tiers on each sim ..be it a homestead, open space or full prim
[11:33:21]  Trouble Streeter: going to jump out of order to ask a related question to that…
[11:33:21]  Melody Regent: So I saved $5700usd a month
[11:33:32]  Trouble Streeter: [11:26:19] pup Witherspoon: Is Melody in a position to talk about the Anshe stuff.. whether she got 500 sims at the grandfathered tier?
[11:34:32]  Melody Regent: pup? LOL, I have been here over 4 years and that woman spoke to me ONCE in all that time and that was simply to butt into my business. Something that was NOT appreciated nor wanted. I have no idea what she gets and LL will not be telling us either.
[11:34:55]  Silken Wilder: LL is strict on not talking about others accounts to anyone
[11:34:57]  Melody Regent: Oh yeah, I didnt respond to her
[11:35:18]  pup Witherspoon: there’s been quite a bit on the blogs about it.. wondered if you knew anything..
[11:35:38]  Melody Regent: Nope, nothing. They wont tell me
[11:35:46]  Melody Regent: but then they know I have a big mouth *shrugs*
[11:36:01]  Trouble Streeter: [11:18:24] ShadowKnight Falconer: Questions: Are FREs limited to private estates or can they be mainland?
[11:18:49] ShadowKnight Falconer: Are the 2K still limited to just buying from LL?
[11:36:25]  Melody Regent: FRE are ANYTHING. Not just private, from what I understand
[11:37:08]  Melody Regent: the $2k is only able to be used to buy NEW sims from the land store. You cannot buy 3rd party, pay tier with it. Those two sims also will not count to your NEXT 5 sim purchase
[11:37:38]  Trouble Streeter: [11:19:41] Roya Congrejo: Hi, I remind in one of JL’s Office Hours he said – regarding ATLAS – “we are not talking only about setup-fees” So how is it with the tiers?
[11:38:15]  Roya Congrejo: think its answered meanwhile
[11:38:59]  Roya Congrejo: but with that he raised a lot of rumors
[11:39:27]  Melody Regent: I know this has been the worst rumor out there but let me make this very very very clear. We do NOT get reduced tier. Never have and never will, according to LL. On a side note about Jack? He didnt even know that the NDA had been lifted, so he is not a reliable source for alot of things (I can hear him now Jack Linden: Ouch Mel)
[11:40:05]  Trouble Streeter: I have a notecard here that pup asked be put into local chat, then two questions:
[11:40:06]  Roya Congrejo: ok
[11:40:12]  Melody Regent: ok
[11:40:16]  Trouble Streeter: We’ve been trying to get into the Atlas program. At this point our FRE count is 42.

I’ve had nothing useful or substantial in our convo’s with Betsy.. see below.

Notice the veiled threat in the message of Nov 18th.

Milano Ferrentino and Pup Witherspoon – Bonaire Estates.

Right now it doesn’t appear that they’re allowing anyone new into Atlas. We’ve been qualified for it for a year.

=========================

This was the response after she’d ignored my additional request for info for 2 weeks, so I asked Izzy Linden to escalate the ticket:

2010-11-15 08:54:54
Betsy McMullin

Hi Milano,

You will be contacted about Atlas when a spot becomes available in the program. I appreciate your eagerness to join the program, but please do not engage concierge members about the opportunity. I am your contact for this.

Thank you and we will be in contact before the end of Q4 (12/31/2010)

Best regards,

Betsy McMullin
Atlas Account Manager

2010-11-16 14:15:42

===================

This was her response when I s
[11:40:16]  Trouble Streeter: tated that I had a right to request that escalation, since she’d closed the ticket twice without resolving the issue.

2010-11-18 10:03:39
Betsy McMullin

Thank you for your thoughts, Milano.

You will be contacted about membership to the Atlas program when an opportunity becomes available. We are admitting new members at a careful rate, mostly due to the load it would place on an already-taxed concierge staff.

Continuing to dialogue with the concierge staff is using an inappropriate channel and actually slows down the rate at which we could bring you in.

I trust you understand our situation with this and very much understand your desire to have Atlas benefits. Please contact me directly with any further inquiries.

Thank you and we will be in touch,

Betsy McMullin
Atlas Account Manager
[11:40:50]  Trouble Streeter waits til chat catches up, then adds the question…
[11:40:56]  Melody Regent: let me read then I can address some of this
[11:41:11]  Trouble Streeter: ‘k then i’ll put the questions up
[11:42:36]  Melody Regent: OK, I have been told they are not adding new members because they do not have the staff. I can understand this and I am sorry you cannot get in. Personally, I am not sure how much work they are doing. I dont ask much of them, because the program doesnt do much in reality.
[11:42:44]  Melody Regent: However, I will say this
[11:42:55]  Melody Regent: for her to tell you to stop asking was VERY unprofessional
[11:43:11]  Melody Regent: unless they are willing to accept you and help you out, then the only channel you have are those provided
[11:43:23]  Melody Regent: if they want you to use the Atlas channels, then PROVIDE them
[11:43:36]  Melody Regent: if not, the stop making stupid, unprofessional threats about stuff
[11:44:00]  Melody Regent: Her Boss is Delby Linden, and Delby’s boss is Tristen Linden. So you know
[11:44:13]  pup Witherspoon: good.. I wanted that info
[11:44:16]  Motor Loon: (Remember though that entering in ATLAS is not a right or a duty. You can choose not to but LL can also choose not to take you in for whatever reason.)
[11:44:22]  Trouble Streeter: [11:44:03] pup Witherspoon: Comment.. so even if you’re qualified as Atlas, until they let you in the program, there’s no way to get the setup credits?
[11:44:41]  Melody Regent: Nope, they are not set up with everything needed
[11:45:15]  Melody Regent: How often do they implement a progrm and are not able to follow up with the proper support?
[11:45:35]  Trouble Streeter: is this a rehtorical question, Mel?
[11:45:40]  Trouble Streeter:
[11:45:41]  Melody Regent: yeah
[11:45:41]  Thex Lecker: lol I know this one… ummm. every time?
[11:45:41]  Melody Regent:
[11:45:42]  ShadowKnight Falconer: lol
[11:45:44]  Joy Canadeo: lol
[11:45:48]  Silken Wilder: Another side note..Betsy wasn’t the 1st Atlas person we had..it has changed several times and they did just bring on one more to help out..JUST
[11:45:54]  Melody Regent: I will let you be your own guide on that one
[11:46:01]  Melody Regent snorts
[11:46:06]  Melody Regent: not the first
[11:46:08]  Melody Regent: second
[11:46:10]  Melody Regent: or third
[11:46:11]  Silken Wilder: I know LOL
[11:46:31]  Silken Wilder: but we can try to keep it updated on who is the Altas person(s)
[11:46:51]  Trouble Streeter: [11:21:14] pup Witherspoon: Additional question – what are the Magical sims. .that get transferred with 30 days of free tier by some folks who are selling their sims?
[11:47:29]  Melody Regent: Silken? Any idea?
[11:47:31]  pup Witherspoon: may I expand on that Melody?
[11:47:38]  Melody Regent: yes please
[11:47:39]  Silken Wilder: not sure I understand?
[11:48:42]  pup Witherspoon: We’ve purchased groups of sims from estates that are going out of business. In some instances, these transferred to us with 30 days of free tier, even though the sims we bought were already “off the grid”… I was told by the estate owner we bought them from, that LL had cut him a special deal, allowing him to do this
[11:49:16]  Melody Regent: OK, that is what I thought
[11:49:17]  pup Witherspoon: the second time we did this.. all of a sudden, that “magical sim deal” disappeared
[11:49:23]  Silken Wilder: hmmm not sure about that..now I am buying 3 sims tomorrow ..and they all have a months tiers paid on them..due 18th..all 3
[11:49:36]  Melody Regent: This is one of those “ASK THEM” things
[11:49:38]  pup Witherspoon: these were sims that the estate owner had actually abandoned
[11:49:47]  Joy Canadeo: whoa
[11:49:55]  pup Witherspoon: and then LL gave them the ability to sell them with 30 days of free tier
[11:50:06]  pup Witherspoon: I can document this
[11:50:07]  Silken Wilder: are you talking about the GF HS sims from a while back?
[11:50:25]  pup Witherspoon: no, not at all, we got them at 125 a month tier, but got 30 days of free tier
[11:50:27]  Judge Firecaster: ive heard its gone down to 7 days now after abandoning a region
[11:50:34]  Silken Wilder: yes but recently?
[11:50:37]  pup Witherspoon: this was less then a month ago
[11:51:10]  Silken Wilder: ok then I for one am not sure..as stated LL does make deals with individual estates ..but the rest of us are not able to know what those deals are
[11:51:21]  Melody Regent: If you want to puy a group or bulk of sims, then before you do, ask LL about a deal you may want to make. Like I said it before, make sure to give them a presention and let them know what you want to do in detail. LL is happy to do deals with people to keep sims on the grid. They are just making it clear to me and others, that the deals will involve the PURCHASE of the sims but they will not REDUCE the tier
[11:51:27]  pup Witherspoon: thats a violation of the Cartwright act in CA
[11:52:10]  Silken Wilder: correct Melody..not on tiers..only on purchase of bulk IF presented in a way to LL that shows a real business deal for them and you
[11:52:24]  Trouble Streeter: last question so far… so send em if you ahve them…
[11:52:24]  pup Witherspoon: this was 7 HS and a couple of FS
[11:52:26]  Trouble Streeter: [11:34:46] pup Witherspoon: Milano has a question also: (1) how many current members there are in Atlas, and (2) Why it seems such a struggle for qualified estates to gain entry?
[11:35:40] Imagin Illyar: Question for Melody – do you know approximately how many Atlas members there are?
[11:52:41]  Melody Regent: Bulk purchase is very common – consider it like a shipping discount
[11:52:46]  Silken Wilder: correct
[11:53:33]  Melody Regent: I dont know the most recent number Pup. Partly because it is a privacy issue. They will not talk to us about other estates and I understand and actually respect that from them
[11:53:49]  Melody Regent: last count was 48 =/-
[11:53:55]  Melody Regent: as for getting in?
[11:54:01]  Motor Loon: The ‘Atlas information group’ currently holds 48 members in everyone role.
[11:54:35]  Melody Regent: again, this is a staffing issue. I think LL bit off more than it could chew on this. We go back to them jumping in to do something and not being ready to fully deliver
[11:54:59]  Thex Lecker: We should make an ‘Atlas Qualified but waiting on the porch information group’ to count how many of us in that situation.
[11:55:10]  Melody Regent: Ok, I wil open the floor to any questions. No need to filter thru T
[11:55:25]  Trouble Streeter collapses
[11:55:32]  Silken Wilder props her up
[11:55:51]  Melody Regent: OK, let me also say that Silken and I have a group we have formed, much like the FEO group but, we hope, better all around for all Atlas and non Altas
[11:56:01]  Melody Regent: United Estate Owners
[11:56:05]  pup Witherspoon: if we’re qualified as Atlas, we should be able to get the credits, no matter what LL’s issue is with staffing. The reality is that most of us sitting here handle probably 80-90% of the suppport issues for our residents, without contacting LL, that would normally end up in their support cue
[11:56:19]  Melody Regent: I mentioned it before and Silken said to go ahead and let you all know about it.
[11:56:22]  Silken Wilder: we know Pup..believe me we do know that
[11:56:37]  Melody Regent: I agree pup, 100%
[11:56:38]  Silken Wilder: we are just trying to give out what info we have
[11:56:42]  Melody Regent: and what I would suggest?
[11:56:47]  Melody Regent: KEEP TRACK!!!!!!!!
[11:56:50]  Silken Wilder: yes
[11:57:02]  Melody Regent: At the end of the quarter, then tell them what you did and ASK for the credits
[11:57:42]  Silken Wilder: remember its 1/4 to 1/4…you must purchase 5FRE to get the 2FRE per 1/4..keep track and at least you can contact LL if you meet the 5 FRE and see what they say even if not in Atlas
[11:58:29]  Silken Wilder: if it were up to us we’d invite all who meet the requirements but only the LIndens in Atlas have that abiility
[11:58:50]  Melody Regent: I think it is very wrong for them not to take ANYONE that qualifies into the group
[11:58:57]  Silken Wilder: I agree with that
[11:59:05]  Melody Regent: but then, I seem to have a differnt idea on how to run a business
[11:59:11]  Judge Firecaster: ive been contacted by lindon labs about the atlas program but stil need couple more sims but its stil no garentee ill get in rite?
[11:59:22]  Melody Regent: Correct
[11:59:24]  Melody Regent: We will be accepting members but we are not fully up and going with all we want to do. You can ask her, or myself, for membership. We will be taking Atlans and non atlas members becuase we both agree in Mentoring the smaller estates and helping the larger ones get in the group.
[11:59:33]  pup Witherspoon: may I ask when you were contacted Judge?
[11:59:44]  Judge Firecaster: 3 weeks ago
[11:59:47]  Melody Regent: Silken? Maybe this needs to be our first order of business? Working to get qualified members in?
[11:59:51]  Milano Ferrentino: But unless I missed something earlier, Atlas members get the reduced fees on renames, transfers, etc., even if they don’t add 5 FREs per quarter. Correct?
[11:59:56]  Judge Firecaster: they sent me a email
[12:00:04]  pup Witherspoon: and you’re not qualified as an Atlas level estate yet?
[12:00:10]  Silken Wilder: I agree Melody
[12:00:20]  Judge Firecaster: no but ive expanded a bit latly
[12:00:26]  Melody Regent: Yes Milano, and when you file a ticket ASK them for it
[12:00:28]  Silken Wilder: correct Milano..
[12:00:35]  Illyria Illyar: I was qualified during the origiinal invitation – and fell through the cracks
[12:00:37]  pup Witherspoon: that’s unbelievable.. since we’ve been beating on the door trying to get in and we have 42 FRE
[12:01:02]  Illyria Illyar: I have been trying to get in since August
[12:01:05]  Melody Regent: agreed pup, they ….. *sighs*
[12:02:11]  Melody Regent: OK all, any other Q? rumors? needs? wants?
[12:02:33]  Melody Regent: Was this meeting helpful to everyone?
[12:02:34]  Roya Congrejo: no, thanks a lot for thes infos Melody
[12:02:37]  pup Witherspoon: I want a dozen cream pies and Betsy standing in front of me.. real life
[12:02:43]  Joy Canadeo: lol
[12:02:51]  Aizur Zessinthal: Kinky….
[12:02:51]  Judge Firecaster: myes maam
[12:02:53]  Thex Lecker: Will you put the transcript of this somewhere, Melody? I came in late.
[12:02:58]  Silken Wilder: If you do wish to be a part of the group just IM Melody or myself..we do not have ALL the answers but will not lead you around blindly either
[12:03:03]  Melody Regent: I will put it on the blog, under the Linden meeting
[12:03:10]  Melody Regent: where I do jacks hours
[12:03:13]  Trouble Streeter: http://regentestatessl.com/wordpress/
[12:03:14]  Thex Lecker: ty thanks.
[12:03:17]  Santabaia Schumsker: well, If you are a very smaller estate owner like me, can you dream with someday to be a Atlas partner? Or just after they increase the account managers? I don’t want to waste money for 20 FR and discover I cannot get in.
[12:03:21]  Silken Wilder: we will add one estate owner and one estate manager..atlas or not..
[12:03:27]  Joy Canadeo: Ty Melody
[12:03:28]  Silken Wilder: *per estate*
[12:03:36]  Melody Regent: I think they will get enough people, eventaully
[12:03:43]  Melody Regent: I hope atleast
[12:03:49]  Santabaia Schumsker: And thank you for all the informations.
[12:03:58]  Melody Regent: personally, its stupid to deny qualified members
[12:04:04]  Silken Wilder nods
[12:04:08]  Milano Ferrentino: The meeting was excellent, Melody, and very enlightening. It is so refreshing to see the “transparency” that lhat has been lacking for so long in commun ications from the Lindens.
[12:04:23]  Roya Congrejo: yes
[12:04:29]  Melody Regent: I have been asking to get out the that NDA for a VERY long time
[12:04:46]  Imagin Illyar: Thanks for taking the time not only to do this but to prepare it. Very well organized.
[12:05:09]  Melody Regent: You are all very welcome and feel free to IM me if you have questions later
[12:05:10]  Trouble Streeter: mel…
[12:05:10]  ShadowKnight Falconer: Excellent information, Melody, thank you.
[12:05:14]  Trouble Streeter: i apparently left a question out
[12:05:19]  Foxxy Hynes: Thank you
[12:05:22]  Trouble Streeter: Illyria ask please
[12:05:24]  pup Witherspoon: yes Melody.. we thank you and your staff. very well run meeting!
[12:06:00]  Trouble Streeter: [12:05:49] Illyria Illyar: I mentioned that I qwas qualified in the original invitation list and was totally overlooked
[12:06:18]  Melody Regent: I would say both of you should move up to Delby
[12:06:18]  Illyria Illyar: why are they keeping me out
[12:06:20]  Shhh!! NIghtclub: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.
[12:06:29]  Roya Congrejo: ok, time for dinner here , thx to Mel and cu
[12:06:51]  Melody Regent: Enjoy and thank you all for coming!! I will stay and talk for a while for those that want to
[12:07:12]  Silken Wilder: Thanks Melody..well put together..:) I will be inviting the ones to the group who have IMed..please feel free to IM if you want to join
[12:07:13]  Melody Regent: delby@lindenlab.com
[12:07:17]  Spicy Braveheart: Thank youfor the information mel.
[12:07:45]  Greywolf Moonlight: Have a good day, all
[12:07:53]  Lillie Sands: Have a great afternoon all
[12:08:04]  Trouble Streeter: good weekend, all
[12:08:04]  Judge Firecaster: • Spank you very much •
[12:08:11]  Judge Firecaster: bye ㋡
[12:08:12]  Motor Loon: Thanks all for comming… my two cups of coffee has mysteriously gone empty
[12:08:59]  Imagin Illyar: Very glad I came, much more informative than any Linden meeting I’ve attended
[12:09:17]  Melody Regent: I dont smoke
[12:09:18]  Melody Regent:
[12:09:45]  Motor Loon: hm… /me knows thats not 100% true °͜°
[12:09:56]  pup Witherspoon: you’re a jewel Melody.. can’t thank you enough for all this info
[12:10:13]  Joy Canadeo: Thank you for a very informative meeting..
[12:10:15]  Trouble Streeter murmurs agreement w MOtor
[12:10:25]  Joy Canadeo: Bye all enjoy your day
[12:10:30]  Motor Loon: lol… I had put out JUST enough chairs eh °͜° suppricingly nice turnout.
[12:10:44]  Melody Regent glares sideways at her people
[12:10:54]  Motor Loon covers eyes
[12:11:28]  Melody Regent: OK, I will work on getting this up on my blog next and send it out
[12:11:40]  Zebulon Overland: thank you very much for these good info
[12:11:53]  Somebody Something: thanks bye folks
[12:11:55]  Zebulon Overland: have a nice day
[12:12:03]  Milano Ferrentino: Yes, Melody. It was great of you and your staff to put this meeting together and to run it so efficiently. It was extremely informative and helpful.
[12:12:07]  Zebulon Overland: see you soon
[12:12:36]  Neuntoter Davidov: very thanks, see you
[12:12:46]  pup Witherspoon: thank you again.. waves to all and ports out
[12:13:01]  ShadowKnight Falconer: Excellent information. Thank you again, Melody. Afternoon, everyone
[12:13:12]  Motor Loon: tc guys if you are leaving
[12:13:12]  Milano Ferrentino: Goodbye all. And thanks again.
[12:13:18]  Trouble Streeter: later milano

Atlas information meeting:
November 19th
11am

http://slurl.com/secondlife/Staten%20Island%20NYC/111/76/150

[11:01:58]  Motor Loon: well, now all we need is a Jack
[11:02:07]  Lamorna Proctor: ok, please touch the banner above the little frog
[11:02:14]  Motor Loon: Hope he comes, I wore my very best partyhat today
[11:02:22]  Trouble Streeter: heh Motor
[11:02:32]  Lamorna Proctor: i put my best dress on
[11:02:34]  Aargle Zymurgy starts humming “Hit the Road Jack”
[11:02:59]  Aargle Zymurgy: damn… now I just got that tune stuck in my head
[11:03:07]  Motor Loon: dont that one go “and don’t you come back…”
[11:03:15]  Lamorna Proctor: yes, i wish you hadn’t said that Aargle
[11:03:16]  Aargle Zymurgy: that’s the one
[11:03:19]  Trouble Streeter glares at Aargle and wonders if she should mention her guaranteed earworm chaser
[11:03:21]  Aargle Zymurgy: Ray Charles at his finest
[11:03:39]  Milano Ferrentino: after waiting for 2 weeks from a response from Betsy, I finally asked Izzy Linden to escalate the matter.. this is the response I got “Hi Milano,

You will be contacted about Atlas when a spot becomes available in the program. I appreciate your eagerness to join the program, but please do not engage concierge members about the opportunity. I am your contact for this.

Thank you and we will be in contact before the end of Q4 (12/31/2010)

Best regards,

Betsy McMullin
Atlas Account Manager

”
[11:03:51]  Argus Collingwood: then we lose a Linden that at least has open office hours
[11:04:28]  Lamorna Proctor starts wondering if Jack will show up
[11:04:39]  Melody Regent: Everyone send him a TP
[11:04:43]  Lamorna Proctor: he’s probably been tipped off
[11:05:13]  clayjn Hancroft: incoming
[11:05:25]  Qie Niangao: greetings Jack
[11:05:31]  Jack Linden: hey folks!
[11:05:35]  Trouble Streeter: heya Jack
[11:05:36]  Argus Collingwood: hihi
[11:05:38]  Jean Swashbuckler: Lab Rat…cute JAck lol
[11:05:39]  Marianne McCann: Hey Jack
[11:05:39]  Jack Linden: sorry for tardyness – hectic day!
[11:05:42]  Driftwood Miles: Hello Jack
[11:05:42]  Motor Loon: fashionably late Jack °͜°
[11:05:45]  Jayson Dorn: Hi Jack
[11:05:48]  Lamorna Proctor: Hey Lab Rat, where’s Jack?
[11:05:51]  Aargle Zymurgy: cute smiley, Motor
[11:06:14]  Jack Linden: wow Motor, awesome smiley.
[11:06:18]  Daniel Voyager: Hey Jack Linden
[11:06:21]  Motor Loon: really Auto frog… couldn’t find a bigger sign?
[11:06:35]  Marianne McCann: Motor – must have been out of megaprims
[11:06:39]  Lamorna Proctor: hes only little, it makes him feel more adequate
[11:06:39]  Motor Loon: Thanks Jack… worked many hours on that one
[11:06:40]  Sassy Romano: Jack before you get busy, how do the rest of the merchants get promoted as a single advert like the Ozimals were? We’d love to know
[11:06:58]  Marianne McCann: Hey Jack! I see that Terrance has posted about additional TSL integration stuff, including that all the land would be ported to the MG. Will it be staying contigious (sp.), or being added to other land masses?
[11:07:00]  Lamorna Proctor: he’s also EXPRESSING HIMSELF
[11:07:06]  Aargle Zymurgy would like to know the answer to Sassy’s question
[11:07:10]  Milano Ferrentino: aren’t those the people who gave us the breeding chickens ?
[11:07:16]  Lamorna Proctor: rabbits
[11:07:19]  Aargle Zymurgy: rabbits
[11:07:24]  Melody Regent: same concept, differnt company
[11:07:31]  Lamorna Proctor: and it’s not the 1st of the month
[11:07:32]  Milano Ferrentino: hmmm..
[11:07:38]  Jack Linden: Hey Sassy.. it’s something we’re open to doing for merchants that are especially successful or high profile and where the proposal has business for both them and the Lab
[11:07:40]  Milano Ferrentino: we’ve banned them
[11:07:47]  Marianne McCann: ((someone has an open mic))
[11:07:52]  Argus Collingwood: open mic?
[11:07:54]  Jack Linden: open mic
[11:07:56]  Aargle Zymurgy waves to Jack
[11:07:58]  Automaton Frog: yes next to me
[11:07:59]  MissMissy Moonbeam: Jayson, i think
[11:08:04]  Aargle Zymurgy: I might be a candidate for that.
[11:08:10]  Melody Regent: Jayson your mic is coming open again
[11:08:13]  Jack Linden: Jayson, your mic is open
[11:08:15]  Marianne McCann: And a bad cough too
[11:08:24]  Jayson Dorn: wooops
[11:08:28]  Jayson Dorn: sorry about that
[11:08:28]  Jack Linden:
[11:08:30]  MissMissy Moonbeam: and a bark-y dawg
[11:08:32]  Sassy Romano: it’s very one sided and detrimental to the other competing merchants, can you clarify “proposal” please and why did LL use our email for purposes we hadn’t signed up to?
[11:08:36]  Aargle Zymurgy: I have a bad cough, but my mic is in IM
[11:09:06]  Lamorna Proctor wants to take a picture of this
[11:09:24]  Lamorna Proctor took a snapshot
[11:09:33]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Jack, didn’t notice this earlier in the beta but like the detachable chat window in 2.3
[11:09:44]  Lamorna Proctor took a snapshot
[11:09:51]  Marianne McCann: Handy, isnt it Jean?
[11:09:57]  Jack Linden: Sassy – I’m not sure about the email piece specifically, but i expect we will from time to time feature a merchant or landowner or event in some way when it makes sense. In something like the Newsletter for example
[11:10:08]  Lamorna Proctor: there is a lot that is better in 2.3.0
[11:10:12]  Jack Linden: Jean, yeah it’s cool
[11:10:14]  Sassy Romano: I’d like to see the method of engagement published please
[11:10:21]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Mari
[11:10:21]  Marianne McCann: I wish it could be merged up with the tabbed IMs again, but wishes and horses
[11:10:26]  Jack Linden: Sassy, I’ll mention that to the team
[11:10:29]  Lamorna Proctor: I am happy to bestow praise when it’s due
[11:10:47]  Sassy Romano: I’ve asked in several places, everyone ignored everybody that asked, very poor actually
[11:10:58]  Sassy Romano: but thank you, i’ve had my say
[11:11:04]  clayjn Hancroft: My Main sim “Tangled” is part of the Magnum server program. this sim is where we receive our tier payments and do business with our new clients. After MANY not able to TP to the sim and to many resets to count where the sim would not come back at all for more then 5 hours! My partner has requested on many many tickets to be removed form this program we DID NOT ASK TO BE IN. how/ whom to i have to bribe / beg to get out of it please HELP its killing our business and customer service.
[11:11:46]  Automaton Frog: Don’t forget to touch my BanClone sign, folks
[11:11:51]  Jack Linden: clayjn, they should be able to call the Concierge service and make that request by phone
[11:12:02]  Milano Ferrentino: that’s interesting Clay.. we have half a dozen sims in the magnum program and we’ve had few problems outside of the inventory issue
[11:12:29]  Adamburp Adamczyk: onigokko
[11:12:32]  Milano Ferrentino: we’ve been stress testing them.. 70-90 avatars at a time. .with stellar results
[11:12:35]  Jack Linden: clayjn, I’m not sure how they defined which regions fall into which channel, but they should be able to advise
[11:12:38]  Melody Regent: Jack, why would clayjn TICKETS not work? One would think a ticket would work better than a phone call to a limited staff
[11:12:49]  Automaton Frog: I wouldn’t pay any attention to Lab Rat, I am the real Jack Linden
[11:13:06]  Jack Linden: Melody, I was just saying that phoning is obviously more direct than a ticket
[11:13:16]  Jack Linden: But a ticket should work too!
[11:13:18]  Adamburp Adamczyk: rid of*&
[11:13:20]  clayjn Hancroft: That would be helpful of the Con service line tell me to do a ticket. so .. which track on this customer service 8 track to i believe ?
[11:13:20]  Marianne McCann: Ooh, staff impersonation is your friend
[11:13:23]  Adamburp Adamczyk: Jack – wd to you guys getting rod if the ontynes
[11:13:40]  Adamburp Adamczyk: dealt with the new guys – a vast improvement
[11:13:46]  Automaton Frog: Yes, I am using the wonderful Display Names to “express myself”
[11:13:52]  Aargle Zymurgy: oh, yes to Adam’s comment… the Scouts have been a great improvement.
[11:14:39]  Jack Linden: clayjn, as folks that attend this office hours regularly know, I’m not part of the support organisation any more, so I cannot really speak to support issues. I pass on feedback but I’m not going to be able to give you detailed answers to support problems
[11:15:14]  Jack Linden: hi automaton. fun!
[11:15:16]  Milano Ferrentino: Can we talk about the Marketplace and what upcoming plans might be in place to make it work better for selling land?
[11:15:21]  Fly-Bangle de Lux 2.1: All Go
[11:15:25]  Adamburp Adamczyk: please pass on about hte ontynes going bye-bye – yeehaw!
[11:15:27]  Argus Collingwood: Jack, how is SLM staffing ging?
[11:15:31]  Lamorna Proctor: OK Jack, on to Display Names. Are you going to have an option to show Usernames in the Friends’ List?
[11:15:35]  Milano Ferrentino: we were previously told many things, but we’re still struggling
[11:15:51]  Lamorna Proctor: at present, if a friend changes their name, you don’t know who they are
[11:15:58]  clayjn Hancroft: Well Jack im sorry but the fact that your part of Linden labs MAKES you part of customer service. no matter which dept you are in. you the face of the “linden crew” right now in front of us.
[11:16:12]  State Of Libery: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.
[11:16:35]  Automaton Frog: Thanks, Lab Rat
[11:16:40]  Jack Linden: Milano, moving land more into the marketplace is definitely something we’re eager to do. But it’s not a quick piece of work and I don’t have any specifics i can give you.
[11:17:18]  BanClone Sensor V2.1.5: Hello! These premises are protected by BanClone, a system that protects against Identity Theft that may occur because of the use of the Display Names feature
For more information, please visit http://www.slysense.com/banclone
This is not spam. You have been sent this message by a Greeter owned by Something Something because you are visiting Linden Estate Services, Linden Estate Services
[11:17:20]  BanClone Sensor V2.1.5: You have not registered your name with BanClone. Please visit our web site at http://www.slysense.com/banclone to find out how and learn more about the benefits of doing so
[11:17:25]  Lamorna Proctor: nice one, Somebody
[11:17:35]  Marianne McCann: Oh lord an lady
[11:17:38]  Marianne McCann: Have fun all
[11:17:38]  Melody Regent: something SOmething, your ban clone is spamming us
[11:17:43]  Jack Linden: Argus, the team is strong, and we have a new product manager starting soon too. I’m also paying more attention to the project now
[11:17:50]  clayjn Hancroft: Jack do i have your permission per the tos to copy your comments to my partner to use in her ticket?
[11:17:51]  Something Something: oops, sorry, I thought that was using llOwnerSay…
[11:17:53]  Argus Collingwood: great
[11:18:00]  Lamorna Proctor: hahaha
[11:18:03]  Milano Ferrentino: If I may remind you.. there were committments made that the land issue was to be resolved before the Marketplace went live. It wasn’t.. So I think perhaps a timeline for some of these corrections might be in order.. when would you be able to put one together please?
[11:18:25]  Loving Clarity: Jack, is there a possiblity of either putting up a disclaimer or disabling shopping carts until the bugs are fixed?
[11:18:49]  Aargle Zymurgy: oh, and “waived” is still spelled wrong in the cart. yes, there’s a jira
[11:19:02]  Jack Linden: clayjn, you’re right that I’m representing the company; i’m just letting you know that I literally don’t know the details of how support is handling stuff like that so I can’t answer the question
[11:19:31]  Qie Niangao: (( Jack… wouldn’t you really rather have one of your Marketplace folks hold their own office hour?)
[11:20:05]  Daniel Voyager: Hey CJ
[11:20:21]  Daniel Voyager: CG*
[11:20:22]  clayjn Hancroft: Might a recommend adding a support person to the meetings so as to help with issues and to get 1/3 of the monkeys off your back? ?
[11:20:27]  Jack Linden: Milano, we said we would give folks a way to list land which we did ahead of the launch. We’d love to do more, and make it much cleaner as a user experience but that isn’t a trivial piece of work.
[11:20:29]  Adamburp Adamczyk: i think if we gave ~Jack a chance to breathe, we’d get our answers
[11:20:53]  Jack Linden: Qie, that may well be the case at some point.
[11:21:03]  Lamorna Proctor holds back for a minute
[11:21:07]  Sweet Valentine: i second that Clay we need more support people that know answers and that can really help us when needed
[11:21:24]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, any comment please on what I asked about Display Name in the Friends List, both on the 2.3.0 Viewer and on the web site?
[11:21:47]  Lamorna Proctor: it ONLY shows Display Names, regardless of preferences
[11:22:06]  Jack Linden: Loving, the fail rate that we see is pretty low on the cart. It’s not zero though which sucks so we know we have to keep driving that effort to fix bugs
[11:22:06]  Milano Ferrentino: we had a functioning system.. it’s no longer available. Since the large estate owners represent a significant portion of the monthly revenue Linden Labs receives, it would be good business practices to provide some sort of time line, a list of the fixes planned, and a procedure for getting it done in a timely fashion, so again, when might we expect some type of management planning on this?
[11:22:54]  Sweet Valentine: jack i had many failures yesterday as did most people so its really not low as you think i can count at least 2 a day on mine which is 2 to many
[11:23:01]  Lamorna Proctor took a snapshot
[11:23:06]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, yeah we do have a story on the backlog to address that. We have a couple of spots actually where we didn’t get usernames in
[11:23:15]  Lamorna Proctor: ok thanks
[11:23:31]  Mericatherine Quinnell: When your first item is 0L they always fail
[11:23:34]  Loving Clarity: from everyone I’ve talked to, the fail rate is much lower (possibly zero) when making singular purchases. So why not warn customers? As it stands, they come to the merchant first demanding time, attention, satisfaction, refunds, etc. When the fault lies with LL and it’s preventable!
[11:23:36]  BaileyAnn Birdsong paid you L$2500 for a parcel of land.
[11:23:36]  Gem island Lot 3: HEY!! GUESS WHAT?!  The land on Venus Gem (Gem Island Lot 3 – 2000L$/week) has been sold. The new buyer may be : BaileyAnn Birdsong (if no name shown, a group now owns it). http://slurl.com/secondlife/Venus%20Gem/50/70/23
[11:23:59]  Automaton Frog: Touch my banner, folks. I really am the real Jack
[11:24:03]  Milano Ferrentino: all land owners have 0L items… it’s our only option
[11:24:20]  Loving Clarity: I just don’t think it’s so much to ask to warn the shoppers that there’s an issue and they’ll have more success with singular purchases until the problem is fixed
[11:24:24]  Jack Linden: Milano, we’re becoming ever more open over time.. snowstorm being the most open team but other teams are starting to have more of their backlog and bugs visible to the residents through pjira. So the kind of transparency you’re asking for is coming..
[11:24:44]  Jack Linden: ..I doubt we’ll ever be able to be 100% transparent though. But we will try hard to be as open as we can
[11:24:52]  Motor Loon: frog… wouldnt be much room here if we all came with big ad signs for our products and services… perhaps go outside with your sign?
[11:25:16]  Jean Swashbuckler nods and agrees with Motor
[11:25:24]  Loving Clarity: I won’t even go into the effects that a shopping cart can have on a customer’s behavior but sticker shock at a full cart probably isn’t helping anyone’s sales.
[11:25:31]  Milano Ferrentino: I’m specifically asking about the Marketplace Jack.. You made commmittments in these meetings that we would have a viable system. What has been provided does not meet the definition of a viable system. I would like to see a list of the planned enhancements and a time line for getting it done. Is that something that Linden Labs does?
[11:26:02]  Milano Ferrentino: or are you still stuck in the “programmers pick what they want to work on” mode?
[11:26:26]  Lamorna Proctor: ohh, that’s a low bloe, Milano
[11:26:30]  Lamorna Proctor: *blow
[11:26:43]  Milano Ferrentino: it’s on their website as part of their corporate culture concpet Lamorna
[11:27:03]  Motor Loon: oh I tried the webviewer yesterday Jack… grandes kudos on that thing, ran really great and was easy to use
[11:27:20]  Argus Collingwood: yes Skylight is super
[11:27:23]  Something Something: Jack, can you maybe say a few words about the future of scripting in SL? Since Kelly Linden went on leave recently, if I’m not mistaken there’s no one left at LL currently working on LSL. Is there any chance of reviving the C# scripting project?
[11:27:27]  Bronson Blackadder: yes the beta browser worked a treat
[11:27:30]  Lamorna Proctor couldn’t get it to work
[11:27:37]  Alexxa Despres: I tried it as well , Jack..i was impressed
[11:27:43]  Jack Linden: Milano, we haven’t worked that way in a long time. No, I don’t have a full roadmap to give you I’m afraid.
[11:27:43]  Bronson Blackadder: good introduction to SL for all the tire kickers
[11:27:59]  Qie Niangao: yes… the web viewer is a Really Big Deal… encouraging, even.
[11:28:02]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Jack, would be great if they can expand the number of people trying webviewer…wanted to try it on iPad yesterday but didn’t make the cut
[11:28:07]  Lamorna Proctor tires of kickers
[11:28:17]  Driftwood Miles: A VERY nice shiny that one…and has HUGE potential
[11:28:20]  Jayson Dorn: yeah I have to agree, it was much better then I expected it to be
[11:28:20]  Milano Ferrentino: so essentially there’s no immediate plans for fixing the Marketplace for landowners?
[11:28:21]  Something Something: yes, the webviewer was a very cool idea
[11:28:31]  clayjn Hancroft: Partner is on the PHONE as we speab Jack.. waiting…………. and comment on the last old ticket. waiting………….
[11:28:38]  Jack Linden: Motor, glad you liked it! We’re pretty excited about the possibilities there
[11:28:38]  Loving Clarity: or the 8000 other problems we’re having with MP
[11:29:14]  Melody Regent: stop kissing ass baby
[11:29:19]  Melody Regent: you will ruin my rep
[11:29:33]  Motor Loon: Ofcause, we’re assume the webviewer is a sign of plan within LL to really start doing some PR work to get more people here? °͜°
[11:29:50]  clayjn Hancroft: or your pants melody
[11:30:02]  Milano Ferrentino: speaking of marketplace issues.. it’s new code Jack, it would be nice if you could have the programmers start using standard subroutine calls so we don’t end up with the same spaghetti code we have in SL
[11:30:12]  Jack Linden: Hehe Motor, yeah.. it’s absolutely about driving more people to enjoy Second Life
[11:30:33]  Motor Loon: ..they gotta hear about it first though °͜°
[11:30:53]  Lamorna Proctor: Has anyone outside the US managed to get the web-based viewer to work?
[11:30:53]  MissMissy Moonbeam: and “qualify” for a test-drive …
[11:31:04]  Motor Loon: yes, im in europe Lamorna
[11:31:16]  Motor Loon: and it ran perfectly in firefox btw
[11:31:16]  Driftwood Miles: UK here and I got the browser viewer to work
[11:31:19]  Something Something: Lamorna, in the blog forum comments many people outside the US said that they had successfully used it
[11:31:20]  Lamorna Proctor: oh, I’m in the Uk with a fast connection, but it wouldn’t work for me
[11:31:31]  Attica Bekkers: please keep your currentuser base as target audience tho, you havenowhere reached saturation, hardly reached surface
[11:31:39]  Argus Collingwood: works best in Chrome
[11:31:42]  Qie Niangao: Here’s an idea: spin-off Marketplace to an outside buyer (it’s nothing but trouble anyway) and use the proceeds to market Second Life.
[11:31:50]  Argus Collingwood: open mic
[11:31:51]  Lamorna Proctor: oh ok…
[11:31:52]  Jack Linden: It does a bunch of tests to decide whether to offer the web viewer; some folks don’t pass those tests (bandwidth, latency etc)
[11:31:54]  clayjn Hancroft: I tested the browser viewer the other night not bad limited video quality but interesting
[11:31:58]  Lamorna Proctor ditches her crappy old IE
[11:32:04]  Loving Clarity: Jack, my first (and possibly only) kudos to your MP team. Today I woke up to an update on progress. Magic Box synching is fixed. (it’s not true… but it was nice that they finally posted something for us to know they’re still alive)
[11:32:20]  Aargle Zymurgy reads Qie’s comment and chuckles
[11:32:21]  Master Kane: Qie, thats to easy
[11:32:21]  Something Something: Meri, you have an open mic
[11:32:30]  MissMissy Moonbeam: Mericatherine, mic’s open
[11:32:32]  Aargle Zymurgy: Qie, LL BOUGHT it off Anshe
[11:32:34]  Attica Bekkers: ihad afailed deliverythata rrived after about anhour,never everhad the magic boxes be rechecked before
[11:32:36]  Jack Linden: Qie, we see the Marketplace as a core piece of the experience so we’re unlikely to do anything like that
[11:32:49]  Melody Regent: about the webview, once of the avi is loaded with weapons, or so I am told. Since they are limitined in where they can go, you should take into consideration that some sims do not allow weapons and you are giving them to them. THis will make the experienceless than favoable. – something to consider
[11:32:53]  Shhh!! NIghtclub: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.
[11:33:00]  Jack Linden: Argle, no we didn’t.
[11:33:03]  Milano Ferrentino: I’m getting significant reports that the SLURL to create a TP to the inworld site has been broken for a week for many individuals.. particularly if they’re using the old standard viewer
[11:33:10]  Aargle Zymurgy: well, I thought Xstreet was bought
[11:33:13]  Qie Niangao: well, then how about integrating Marketplace with in-world parcel contents and search?
[11:33:26]  Loving Clarity: if MP is a core piece, why does it feel like the neglected redheaded step child?
[11:33:26]  Aargle Zymurgy: then converted to the marketplace, but what do I know?
[11:33:27]  Lamorna Proctor: Marketplace is great, but it’s full of holes at the moment, and the migration from XStreet was a mess
[11:33:27]  Attica Bekkers: oldviewer and firefox-cant use slurl from webpage, have to paste inworld
[11:33:33]  Attica Bekkers: that proly jira
[11:33:43]  Jack Linden: Aargle, the new Marketplace is something we developed in house.
[11:34:03]  Lamorna Proctor: yes, but you bought XStreet to shut it down
[11:34:04]  Milano Ferrentino: the old viewer worked to do that 10 days ago.. direct TP from a marketplace page to the inworld location, but that’s now broken
[11:34:08]  MissMissy Moonbeam: Mel, at least 2 of the male avis have weapons
[11:34:19]  Master Kane: Seen a anshe puppet handing out notecards to people… giving 25000 L$ if you refer someone from your land to hers… LOL what a bunch of sh*t
[11:34:28]  Argus 22009  Dance Sphere v2.0 whispers: Abranimations Dance Sphere Ready …
[11:34:30]  Attica Bekkers: then why doesnt it have intuitive category search like xstreet ?
[11:34:31]  Sweet Valentine: well Jack the failures to deliver do not make our customers very trustful of us and this will directly effect the use of MP with word of mouth if it fails all the time no one will use it its isa first priority to fix it i would think
[11:34:42]  Qie Niangao: Aargle, they bought both OnRez (nee SL Boutique) and Xstreet… it just took longer to finally kill-off Xstreet.
[11:35:04]  Lamorna Proctor: Another big problem with the Marketplace is that it doesn’t have hooks to our own servers which monitor and act on sales
[11:35:23]  Lamorna Proctor: e.g, to give out our own licenses from our server
[11:35:37]  Loving Clarity: if LL insists on holding a monopoly on SL online shopping, is it too much to ask you give us a working product to use?
[11:35:44]  Master Kane: MP is worthtless now, since it has undergone the new makeover.. looking like onrez and worthless to use too or search for things
[11:36:03]  Jack Linden: Sweet, I totally agree that reliable delivery is crucial. We’re investing a lot in building a direct database based delivery service at the moment that will ultimately replace the magic boxes
[11:36:09]  Jack Linden: That’s really the right solution
[11:36:28]  Loving Clarity: so drop the carts until that system works!
[11:36:28]  Sweet Valentine: it should have been done before this went live
[11:36:34]  Lamorna Proctor: ok Jack, but please pay heed to what I said about oyur external servers
[11:36:38]  Loving Clarity: why put it there, knowing it fails and leaving the merchants to clean up the mess?
[11:36:46]  Sweet Valentine: done tested retested before any kind of public release
[11:36:53]  Milano Ferrentino: Linden Labs is blessed that their credit card application to collect our tier seems to function quite well..
[11:36:53]  Melody Regent: drop the cart till it works Jack, why screw the residents over with broken carts
[11:36:54]  Lamorna Proctor: we need to have a way of tracking sales on our own database
[11:37:04]  Loving Clarity: or you could have left xstreets up until MP was actually useful
[11:37:05]  Sassy Romano: If that’s the right solution, assuming you’re refering to selling from inventory, what guarantee do we have that our inventory assets won’t be lost?
[11:37:06]  Master Kane: lol mil
[11:37:10]  Master Kane: aint that the truth
[11:37:19]  Lamorna Proctor: at present, many of my products can’t be sold on the Marketplace for that reason
[11:37:34]  Loving Clarity: I’m with Sassy. I know three people right now with missing inventory items. one has been waiting TWO WEEKS to have it restored
[11:37:37]  Attica Bekkers: I enjoy its look and feel, andwas blissful my pruchases arrived (tho after id gone and bought one in world) just the search
[11:37:38]  Sweet Valentine: this is the downfall of SL you guys always release your cart before your horse it hurts your reputation
[11:37:43]  Loving Clarity: what do we do when out MP items go missing from inventory?
[11:37:44]  Ann Otoole: except direct database delivery is subject to ther forever present asset system issues. The magic boxes are rezzed in world and thus are backed up with the sim.
[11:38:12]  Attica Bekkers: lvinglog intoaqua,inventory always always comes back
[11:38:21]  Ann Otoole: Is LL going to give us local hard drive backups of inventory?
[11:38:27]  Vilandra Miles: I don’t know what kind of problems you have there, Loving. Carts work fine with me. Both ways, buying and selling. I have only very seldom a non delivery and I truly don’t get why you keep on stamping your foot kinda literally. I for one want the carts to stay!
[11:38:28]  Attica Bekkers: it cantale a while,butit always comes home lol
[11:38:44]  Automaton Frog: one last chance to touch my banner
[11:38:56]  Automaton Frog: the BanClone banner
[11:39:02]  Sassy Romano: Vilandra, what happens if someone puts 30 items in their cart and buys them while offline?
[11:39:08]  Automaton Frog: before I’m a bannee
[11:39:15]  clayjn Hancroft: Auto drop me the info i have been donkey punching it the whole time
[11:39:20]  Vilandra Miles: not possible. cart has a max of 10. see, you’re missing information
[11:39:24]  Motor Loon: I must admit I haven’t had a single issue with marketplace – besides from a customer who accidently bought the same copyable item twice °͜°
[11:39:25]  Loving Clarity: because they Fail, Vil. I have yet to hear anyone complain of a failed delivery of a single item but soon as they fill a cart, they get failures.
[11:39:27]  Master Kane: you cannot gift more than on person as well.. whats up with that?
[11:39:31]  Sassy Romano: they can repeat it 3 times then
[11:39:31]  Milano Ferrentino: If we can’t get the marketplace working for landowners Jack,.. when will Linden Labs open up the Land Center for the rest of the Atlas level estate owners/
[11:39:33]  Aargle Zymurgy: I’m trying to understand the MP issues…. I’ve had some good success selling there lately.
[11:39:37]  Aargle Zymurgy: perhaps better than in the past.
[11:39:59]  Loving Clarity: I’ve tested it myself twice with an alt and one time she got six items. the other time she got 8
[11:40:25]  Jack Linden: Okays, well I’ll talk again to the team about the cart but we’re not going to simply remove the cart as a device. As I said, the fail rate is very low (though still too high of course).
[11:40:26]  Aargle Zymurgy: in fact, I never had people buy more than 1 item from me on the old system. now I’m getting multiples
[11:40:26]  Sassy Romano: point being that due to message capping, large numbers of items will fail delivery
[11:40:57]  Sweet Valentine: and purchase throttles
[11:41:04]  Milano Ferrentino: we’re seeing close to 30% failure rate on the notecards. .testing with alts
[11:41:05]  Lamorna Proctor: it’s a fundamental problem. our own warehouse objects have no way of knowing something’s been delivered
[11:41:09]  Trouble Streeter: seems that if we need to keep talking about it here, the fail rate is too high Jack
[11:41:10]  Attica Bekkers: isually order two andhave togo and change it lol
[11:41:13]  Bronson Blackadder: wont AIS cure this?
[11:41:15]  Lamorna Proctor: e.g. because a user is in busy mode
[11:41:19]  Vilandra Miles: which means, it’s not the delivery that fails, but the message cap that is the real problem
[11:41:41]  Loving Clarity: Vil, both of my alts were online when I tested it
[11:41:45]  Loving Clarity: and both had failures
[11:41:46]  Melody Regent: what fail rate is acceptable?
[11:41:49]  Melody Regent: 2%?
[11:41:51]  Melody Regent: 5%?
[11:41:52]  Lamorna Proctor: i proposed a new feature YEARS ago, an inventory_given event in scripts
[11:41:53]  Melody Regent: 50%
[11:41:54]  Melody Regent: ?
[11:42:07]  Qie Niangao: +1 Lamorna
[11:42:11]  Lamorna Proctor: nothing has ever been done
[11:42:16]  Jack Linden: Trouble, we measure the performance in minute detail, so we know how much it fails and for which residents. We use that data to decide where to spend dev resource. We obviously will keep pushing to get it better
[11:42:18]  Lamorna Proctor: and a money_given event
[11:42:18]  Master Kane: Mel.. short IM coming… check when you get time
[11:42:19]  Vilandra Miles: I often bought 10 items on cart at once. got them all. no problems at all.
[11:42:35]  Loving Clarity: you don’t have to lose the cart (though I think in the long run it hurts sales) but why not put up something so the shoppers know there’s an issue?
[11:42:45]  Milano Ferrentino: Land Center Jack – when will it be opened for the rest of the Atlas Level Estates?
[11:42:50]  Loving Clarity: what’s more inconvenient? having to buy things seperately or not getting them at all?
[11:42:57]  Sweet Valentine: jack how can the fail rate be to low every one and i mean everyone i know and talk to and read on forums has had a failure on MP
[11:43:21]  Jack Linden: the large majority of people have no issues at all with multi-item carts. but some people do have failed deliveries, and even 1 fail is too many really so we get how important it is
[11:43:23]  Aargle Zymurgy: my only real concern about the MP is moving away from the magic boxes… unless, of course, there’s an automated way you can handle sales for licensing, group invites, etc.
[11:43:42]  Jack Linden: Milano, do you mean the land store itself?
[11:43:48]  Lamorna Proctor agrees 100% with Aargle
[11:44:19]  Milano Ferrentino: I mean the Land Center. the full sim Linden Labs gave to the group, and had Patch build through Frolic Mills.. it was set up for 40 .. there are 20 there
[11:44:26]  Sassy Romano: The bigger issue for me is the timeout, if it fails, refund within 15 minutes, not several hours
[11:44:28]  Aargle Zymurgy: right now my magic box is tweaked so I can license purchase, then have my bot give a group join to the owner’s support group (which is invite only)
[11:44:48]  Attica Bekkers: will marketplace have its own folder?
[11:44:50]  Melody Regent: Milano, Jack has no clue what is going on with Atlas, he made that clear last week.
[11:44:52]  Loving Clarity: my worry with that is asset server issues. Will LL improve the inventory support system before losing the boxes? or will there be an option to use the boxes anyhow? Even as a back up?
[11:44:55]  Vilandra Miles: 2md Sassy: timeout is too long
[11:45:03]  Melody Regent: land center had nothing to do with Atlsa, that was a differnt project
[11:45:14]  Jack Linden: Ahh Milano, I see. That is something the Atlas folks are handling – so you’d need to speak to them. I don’t know what the long term plan is there or how effective it’s been
[11:45:17]  Milano Ferrentino: I’ve been in discussion with Betsy McMullin. .. who’s supervisor will be getting a letter from me shortly, with no success and what I consider to be rather inappropriate language and comment
[11:45:28]  Melody Regent: but since Jack has no idea and those that do, refuse to talk about it, I will be holdint a meeting about it tomorrow at 11am
[11:45:39]  Attica Bekkers: today whenmydeliveryfailed iwas charged afterthe things arrived
[11:45:57]  Attica Bekkers: quite odd, thatdelay then itall happeneing, but pleasing
[11:46:06]  Jack Linden: Loving, we believe we can do it in a way that has extremely high succes (transacting between database tables – not inworld at all)
[11:46:18]  Milano Ferrentino: yes, I’m looking forward to that Melody, both pup and I cleared our calendar for that.. and thank you for having it
[11:46:25]  Argus Collingwood: that is very good Jack
[11:46:27]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, there needs to be a reliable delivery mechanism with feedback. Please can you talk to the tech folks about this
[11:46:32]  Melody Regent: You are welcome
[11:46:44]  Driftwood Miles: Jack, is there any news on mesh file size , restrictions etc
[11:46:46]  Loving Clarity: so even if my items go missing in inventory, MP will still deliver them?
[11:47:06]  Loving Clarity: you’re willing to go on record with that, Jack?
[11:47:16]  Ann Otoole: so is LL going to use a real transaction manager that makes sure nothing can disappear from the asset system without a logged command to remove it? And to roll back failed transactions?
[11:47:29]  Lamorna Proctor: yes Ann, that’s what’s needed
[11:47:32]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, no not yet. We will need *some* contraints. We’ve already seen some pretty extreme examples on the beta grid
[11:47:34]  Sassy Romano: Jack, you haven’t addressed the robustness of the asset database and what happens with that around the boxless method
[11:48:15]  Jack Linden: So we’re talking about what limits make sense because we don’t want to make it too restrictive for those that really do want to use their entire region for a single very complex mesh build
[11:48:29]  Driftwood Miles: extreme in the sublime.
[11:48:49]  Motor Loon: 256x256xsomething would be a good max. size °͜°
[11:49:04]  Master Kane: hahaha JAck… and to think that you all pushed script limits back for mesh to come in.. haha
[11:49:51]  Jack Linden: The asset server (and how robust it is or isn’t) is a separate piece but obviously ties in with how we delivery content. I’m sure the team responsible is working to ensure it’s also as solid as possible
[11:49:54]  Master Kane: just seems backwards to me , is all
[11:50:02]  Zidonuke’s PDA: Yoz Linden has a meeting at 12:00 for Web Technology on http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Grasmere/174/112/27
[11:50:13]  Marianne McCann: Jack – what are the current limit of full regions/homsteads/openspaces on a single sim? Has that been upped recently? Heard some chatter that it might have been.
[11:50:29]  Jack Linden: Marianne, no change there.
[11:51:04]  Attica Bekkers: ihave found inventory when not rezzed in world very robust and i do test its limits
[11:51:19]  Loving Clarity: solid as possible? MP isn’t even “solid” why should we have faith in the boxless system? did they make sure MP was solid first too or did you guys just fling it out all willy nilly?
[11:51:38]  Argus 22009  Dance Sphere v2.0 whispers: Abranimations Dance Sphere Ready …
[11:51:44]  Milano Ferrentino: Melody, have you done any research yet on the Cartwright Act in California (CA version of the Sherman Anti-trust and restraint of trade laws)?
[11:51:58]  Jack Linden: Loving, I get that you’re concerned. As I’ve said – we’re taking that piece very seriously. I’m not sure what more I can tell you.
[11:52:13]  Driftwood Miles: are you looking at possibly linking pricing to data Jack?
[11:52:20]  Melody Regent: No I have not, not yet. Want to send me the information and I can
[11:52:29]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, in terms of Mesh you mean?
[11:52:32]  Driftwood Miles: yes
[11:52:47]  clayjn Hancroft: Thank YOU Jack the person on the phone was helpful and very pleasant .. It helped that I Referenced you.. Sim should be removed from magnum in a day or two !!!
[11:52:57]  Marianne McCann: Okay I thought it was four full regions to a sim, but I’ve seen more than that
[11:53:04]  Jack Linden: Yeah we have. One of the open questions we have is whether it makes sense to have a L$ fee that is higher to upload a very complex Mesh than to upload a simple one.
[11:53:04]  Marianne McCann: I may have to just ticket that
[11:53:19]  Driftwood Miles: ok, thanks
[11:53:23]  Jack Linden: So we’re watching how the content imports on the Beta grid work and will make a call soon
[11:53:29]  Master Kane: Jack >> I would like to say, within the last month or so, I have noticed rather good perofrmances coming out of these rolls (3 channels).. What ever they are doing seems to be working and am very happy thus far!
[11:53:30]  Milano Ferrentino: nodding.. I have a couple former students of mine with Kirkland and Ellis in SF doing some research now
[11:53:45]  Cinder Roxley: i agree, master.
[11:54:02]  Attica Bekkers: updates arent as scary now:)
[11:54:06]  Jack Linden: Master, yeah our stats show good performance improvements on the simulators. TPs seem to be much better too
[11:54:07]  Master Kane:
[11:54:12]  Milano Ferrentino: K&L is the world’s largest IP law firm
[11:54:33]  Master Kane: Jack >> Yes, indeed! And a stable sim for more than a week too. thus is great!
[11:54:35]  Argus Collingwood: check your fireworks though the new code might have not been good to them
[11:54:49]  Argus Collingwood: and weather systems
[11:54:55]  Drongle McMahon: Jack. You can’t use behaviour in the absence of upload costs to model behaviour in their presence.
[11:55:05]  Qie Niangao: (Mari, I think you mean regions per *server*… not per “sim”… and so I wonder if what’s remained constant is regions per *core*, with more cores per server host now.)
[11:55:29]  Marianne McCann nods
[11:55:40]  Jack Linden: Drongle, we wouldn’t – agreed that would make no sense. But we *can* see the relative size and complexity of the things people are working with
[11:55:42]  Milano Ferrentino: we’re sharing what. .1 server for 8 homesteads now?
[11:56:19]  Drongle McMahon: Yes. But changes in costs will change the choices we make about what complexity to upload,
[11:56:21]  Jack Linden: Qie, to your point, the regions per core ratio hasn’t changed.
[11:56:22]  Master Kane: Jack >> Also.. I was in live chat talking to Robert Linden. Spoke about how v2 makes me physically sick and he was very surprised( supposedly). I think you might need to check into this as I am sure I am not the only one. Also. Some may have long term effects. Just a point of interest.
[11:56:28]  clayjn Hancroft: if thats the case why wouldnt the person just do a sculpty map instead then apply it to a 256×256 mega prim and be done ..
[11:57:10]  Jack Linden: Master, what is it about v2.x that makes you feel ill? The sliding sidepanel?
[11:57:12]  Milano Ferrentino: Jack.. at one time it was supposed to be 3 homesteads per server, 4 open sims per server. it’s now 8 Homesteads per server.. what are the new plans?
[11:57:21]  clayjn Hancroft: It makes me sick to Master.. but for other reasons. (ease of use simple controler interface. the popups.
[11:57:23]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Master…could be your monitor as well
[11:57:29]  Qie Niangao: (right, that’s what I thought… and current datacenter hardware should be ramping up the number of cores per server, I’d think.)
[11:57:32]  Lamorna Proctor: the sliding side panel has been fixed. it’;s an option
[11:57:35]  Alexxa Despres: Bye all I have to scoot…bye Jack…ty
[11:57:35]  Master Kane: Jack > No… i think it has to do with the whole layout. I shut the sliding off
[11:57:50]  Master Kane: No Jean.
[11:57:51]  Argus Collingwood: color scheme?
[11:57:55]  Jack Linden: Milano, servers that we buy may have different CPU counts (and hence core count), but I believe the ratio of regions to cores is the same
[11:58:04]  Attica Bekkers: I havebeenable to explore more of the dept of works stuff,its great
[11:58:20]  Marianne McCann: THe light on dark is unpleasant, especially for long period. Not been phyically ill from it, though
[11:58:32]  Milano Ferrentino: where can I get exact info on that please Jack?
[11:58:33]  Marianne McCann: Attica – the DPW rocks. They really do.
[11:58:33]  Lamorna Proctor: cursors in script windows are horrible
[11:58:45]  Master Kane: I have played my share of online and console games (40ish here) and nothing has made me sick like v2 has.. and no.. its not old age neither
[11:58:48]  Lamorna Proctor: i mean scrollbars
[11:58:54]  Jack Linden: Master, interesting. I haven’t heard much about that so i don’t know if support have sseen that as an issue or not
[11:59:04]  Aargle Zymurgy: yeah, I’ve encountered too many cursers in the….. oh, nevermind, I see what you mean.
[11:59:05]  Qie Niangao: Oh, yeah, much kudos to Michael… the LDPW builds are going to be important to marketing this world with the web-viewer experience, too.
[11:59:18]  Loving Clarity: v2 doesn’t have skins?
[11:59:19]  Loving Clarity: wow
[11:59:42]  Vickijo Rivera agrees with Master on that.
[11:59:43]  clayjn Hancroft: just black death
[11:59:44]  Jack Linden: Okay folks, I have to scoot. More meetings! Thanks all for coming along!
[11:59:46]  Argus Collingwood is waiting for silver
[11:59:46]  Master Kane: There are skin hacks on the wiki… I tried a few of those as well.. nada
[11:59:50]  Attica Bekkers: thanks jack
[11:59:52]  Lamorna Proctor: thanks Jack
[11:59:52]  Qie Niangao: thanks Jack.
[11:59:52]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Qie. Theyre a big part of the public user experience, IMO
[11:59:53]  Trouble Streeter: bye jack
[11:59:57]  Master Kane: thanks jack!
[11:59:57]  Jack Linden: bye all!!
[11:59:59]  Cinder Roxley: it would be great to have a skinnable v2. i remember when the original viewer got the second theme.
[12:00:03]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!
[12:00:03]  Jean Swashbuckler: cya Jack
[12:00:09]  Driftwood Miles: Bye Jack, ty
[12:00:10]  clayjn Hancroft: bye jack.. no meeting next qweek i assume?
[12:00:10]  Argus Collingwood: ttfn
[12:00:20]  Marianne McCann: Cinder – yes. I loved the lighter theme
[12:00:27]  Master Kane: Qie.., we still sitting at 4 regions per? or has that changed?
[12:00:28]  Milano Ferrentino: they don’t have thanksgiving in the Uk.. why wouldn’t there be a meeting?
[12:00:30]  Cinder Roxley: i remember the howling about it though. lol
[12:00:35]  Attica Bekkers: iwish photos had a date on
[12:00:38]  Cinder Roxley: people were angry, i don’t remember what over.
[12:00:46]  Milano Ferrentino: I consistently see 8 homesteads on a server
[12:00:56]  Qie Niangao: MK, I would think it should be more, per *server*, but the same per *core*
[12:01:02]  Attica Bekkers: the new skin? people dontlike change, theyfixed whatever it was tho

[10:59:43]  Cummere Mayo hopes jack hurries up and gets here…. she’s anxious to roast his worthless ass

[10:59:50]  BizTutor Magic: Hi, all!

[10:59:50]  Argus Collingwood: ahhaha

[10:59:56]  Alexxa Despres: Hi ya Biz

[10:59:59]  Ashasekayi Ra waves to the new arrivals.

[11:00:04]  Melody Regent: if its worthless, why waste your time?

[11:01:03]  Pamela Galli: Oh Zikis avi looks like her RL self today!

[11:01:14]  Loving Clarity: yep

[11:01:15]  Charlene Trudeau: ok, I gotta switch viewers, I was trying display names and half the people come up as ??? – ???

[11:01:26]  Ziki Questi blows a puff of dark smoke into pamela’s eyes

[11:01:28]  Pamela Galli: heehee

[11:01:30]  Loving Clarity: apparently that’s common Charlene

[11:01:31]  Cummere Mayo: turn off display names

[11:01:33]  Trouble Streeter: are we donna do this in voice, sigh?

[11:01:38]  Cummere Mayo: the user names will show up

[11:01:39]  BizTutor Magic: That’s due to rolling restars and such.

[11:01:41]  Argus Collingwood: I hope not

[11:01:44]  Trouble Streeter: me too argus

[11:01:51]  Ashasekayi Ra: It wasn’t in voice last time.

[11:01:52]  Argus Collingwood: only if Vyrl shows

[11:01:52]  Pamela Galli: Melody will not allow that

[11:01:57]  Pamela Galli: hahaha

[11:02:02]  Cummere Mayo: no the ???-??? is due to server overloads…

[11:02:03]  Loving Clarity: lmfao Argus

[11:02:08]  Trouble Streeter: last 10 minutes were asha, i never did get a transcript of the last question asked

[11:02:10]  Liisa Runo: not going to be voice

[11:02:15]  Cummere Mayo: it happened from before they brough display names to the main grid

[11:02:36]  Loving Clarity: well, I hadn’t heard anyone complain about it till display names went live

[11:02:37]  Ashasekayi Ra: Oh really? That’s weird.

[11:02:44]  Trouble Streeter: yes, yes it was

[11:02:48]  Qie Niangao: They seemed to think they fixed it yesterday, on the jira… but that was wishful thinking

[11:03:09]  Trouble Streeter: but I am *SURE* Jack is NOT going to hold this week’s office hours using voice, are we Jack?

[11:03:10]  Marianne McCann: Hiya

[11:03:10]  Argus Collingwood: hihi Mari

[11:03:16]  Trouble Streeter: oh hi Jack

[11:03:16]  Loving Clarity: I wish LL would start a wiki on what “Fixed” means in Labonese

[11:03:17]  Chaley May: hello jack

[11:03:17]  Cummere Mayo: even with display names off the viewer still logs allot of names to the wrong file

[11:03:31]  Qie Niangao: greetings Jack

[11:03:32]  Trouble Streeter: BizTutor, could you mute your mic please?

[11:03:35]  Argus Collingwood: hihi Jack

[11:03:36]  Trouble Streeter: the typing is very loud

[11:03:38]  Marianne McCann: Trouble – I hear if we use voice, we can dominate the meeting for like 10 minutes!

[11:03:39]  Loving Clarity: hi Jack

[11:03:43]  A2Z LABS Flight Helper Gadget 1.0: Ready to FLY!

[11:03:45]  Trouble Streeter: yes, yes we can marianne

[11:03:46]  BizTutor Magic: Hi, Jack!

[11:03:51]  Jack Linden: hi folks.. one sec.. things still rezzing in

[11:03:51]  Ashasekayi Ra: Oi

[11:03:56]  Trouble Streeter: my theory is is your question is longer than a TWEET, you shouldn’t ask it

[11:03:59]  Jack Linden: someone has an open mic

[11:04:01]  Argus Collingwood: text only meeting Jack?

[11:04:06]  Ashasekayi Ra: lol Trouble

[11:04:09]  Trouble Streeter: that’s bizturor magic, jack

[11:04:12]  Trouble Streeter: and he is turning it off

[11:04:13]  Jack Linden: yes please! thanks

[11:04:20]  Cummere Mayo: so jack…. hate to break it but the ???-??? aint fixed…

[11:04:26]  Pamela Galli: Jack I had 25,000L in failed SLM deliveries yesterday, and lost hours dealing with customers about it — SLM takes their money and neither pays it to me OR returns it for several hours. It is a widespread problem.

[11:04:30]  BizTutor Magic: ‘k. It’s off.

[11:05:08]  Jack Linden: Cummere, yeah we know. We’re making some changes at the back end to address it

[11:05:14]  Cummere Mayo: and that fraud you swore werent gonna happen…. is all over the place. so when are you gonna etiehr fix display names right or disable them till you can ?

[11:05:30]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Y’all’s make me glad I never use the marketplace. Joint sounds like a disaster. (^_^)

[11:06:12]  Qie Niangao: Heh. Well, the bright side of widespread fraud is that it must mean Viewer 2 is wildly popular all of a sudden. :p

[11:06:17]  BizTutor Magic prepares to play “Angels’ Advocate”, given that the Devil’s OBVIOUSLY lawyered up for this one…. LOL

[11:06:20]  Jack Linden: Cummere, which fraud is that?

[11:06:29]  Loving Clarity: It’s a nightmare right now Imn… but supposedly they’re “working on it”

[11:06:40]  Cummere Mayo: people trying to use display names to immitate business owners, roleplay gms, and lindens

[11:06:51]  Imnotgoing Sideways: What’s Workingonit Linden’s display name? (^_^)

[11:06:53]  Liisa Runo: We were promised that we get new AR field for mimicked display name. Now we have display names. Whre is the AR field?

[11:06:54]  Cummere Mayo: (they use unicode to impersonate linden)

[11:07:02]  Jack Linden: Immy

[11:07:05]  Loving Clarity: no the MP Imn

[11:07:43]  Charlene Trudeau: oh cool, the snowstorm current daily has the display names in it

[11:07:43]  BizTutor Magic: Liisa: Submit it as “Linden fraud” given the pecuniary interest everyone has in their own display name.

[11:08:00]  Jack Linden: Liisa, Display Names is beta right now – not fully launched. Also, if someone is harrassing with their name, use the harrassment Abuse category

[11:08:06]  Cummere Mayo: one of my close friends rezed to her shop to find someone with a copybot machine and her name as the display name… giving people “discounts”

[11:08:10]  Jack Linden: Or whichever seems most appropriate

[11:08:21]  Pamela Galli: yikes

[11:08:23]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Oi! Shenanigans! If we can’t have a “Linden” surname, teh Lindenz gotta stick with theirs… I smells a moot point about copyright here. (=_=)

[11:08:24]  Cummere Mayo: gteam as usual ignored the ticket

[11:08:26]  Loving Clarity: omg!

[11:08:30]  Cummere Mayo: she closed

[11:08:33]  Ashasekayi Ra: Good grief

[11:08:34]  Techwolf Lupindo: dispaly has been launched Jack. Its is enabled grid wide now. So it been fully launched.

[11:08:38]  Marianne McCann: Lovely, Cummere

[11:08:41]  Cummere Mayo: that was her sole source of income too

[11:08:43]  Trouble Streeter: gee, I thought none of these issues was ever gonna come to pass, based on previous comments here </snark>

[11:08:46]  Ciaran Laval: Jack what’s the idea with reducung classifieds to 256 characters inworld?

[11:08:49]  Chaley May: The feature is Beta but SL is not Beta.. they need the ability to report display names right away

[11:09:34]  Cummere Mayo: Ive seen the owner of sn@tch, a big well known store have someone imitate her too. fortuneately, most of her customers dont seem to use viewer 2

[11:09:47]  Jack Linden: Trouble, I don’t think we ever said there would no issues. What we said was that we recognised that some people could abuse it but we’d make some changes to make it harder to confuse people

[11:10:11]  BizTutor Magic: I have plenty of kudos to hand out, and only 2 complaints.

[11:10:13]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Such as culling your own administrative surname? (=_=)

[11:10:15]  Trouble Streeter: I wish we’d made the changes first, Jack, that’s all. Since we KNEW this would be an issue

[11:10:20]  Cummere Mayo: easiest change, that has been requested over and over… disable the ability to clone existing user names

[11:10:36]  Melody Regent: Yes, harder, now EVERYONE is named ?? ??

[11:10:38]  Chaley May: LL seems to wait till stuff happens.. not very good at anticipating peoples needs

[11:10:43]  Jack Linden: There is always going to be a small number of people who want to abuse a new feature.

[11:10:47]  Trouble Streeter: hey, that’s MY name Mel!

[11:10:51]  Qie Niangao: Actually, Jack, you probably do also need to have a chat with whoever handles the relevant ARs

[11:10:58]  Cummere Mayo: how many more lives you want to ruin jack? allot fo the designers on sl this si their ONLY income

[11:11:00]  Jack Linden: As I said earlier Melody, we’re working on the ??? issue

[11:11:12]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Profit? (^_^)

[11:11:16]  Marianne McCann: I agree, Jack but with that in mind, we need ways to appropriately deal with those who do.

[11:11:26]  Techwolf Lupindo: LL set themselves up for a lawsuit for blocking Linden but not anyone else. Linden is a proper last name and can not be discrimated against.

[11:11:38]  Cummere Mayo: LL doesnt care

[11:11:46]  BizTutor Magic: Appropriate, Marianne? Or effective?

[11:11:47]  Techwolf Lupindo: LL legilly admitted display name can be abused.

[11:11:54]  Cummere Mayo: jack certainly doesnt care

[11:11:55]  Techwolf Lupindo: by blocking Linden

[11:12:08]  Loving Clarity: I wish I got a $L every time I heard “Linden doesn’t care” I wouldn’t need to run a business anymore! *laughs*

[11:12:20]  Jack Linden: The AR system already has many categories that cover possible name violations.. such as L$ fraud if they are impersonating a seller, or harrassment.. etc

[11:12:35]  Marianne McCann: Loving – I want some of that action. Can you add “It’s the end of SL” to that?

[11:12:41]  Cummere Mayo: and gteam just ignores them all anyways

[11:12:48]  Ziki Questi: jack, do you have any updates you want to share with us on the Marketplace, including your plans for replacing staff?

[11:12:53]  Pamela Galli: Jack I had 25,000L in failed SLM deliveries yesterday, and lost hours dealing with customers about it — SLM takes their money and neither pays it to me OR returns it for several hours. It is a widespread problem.

[11:12:55]  BizTutor Magic: I’ll start your collection off with a bang, Loving. LOL

[11:13:02]  Lisa – Regent Land Bot: LandMark giver at MLCC (Regent Estates Home Office) has just been used by Andrea81 Neox !

[11:13:13]  Loving Clarity: sure thing. we’ll start a community lottery. Every time it’s said, the person has to put on $L into a pot then once a week it’s raffled off hahahahaha

[11:13:18]  BizTutor Magic: Marianne: LMFAO!

[11:13:48]  BizTutor Magic chuckles at Loving.

[11:13:52]  Jack Linden: Ziki, those on the marketplace email list will have seen Galen intro himself, he’s the lead engineer. I’m also on that list now and will likewise send an intro and be more involved. Also, we have a new hire set to start in a few weeks who you’ll see

[11:14:10]  Imnotgoing Sideways: So, what’s to say I bring an alt in right now, name him “Lab Rat Jack” and futz up the meeting. Will that adress the same concern over the Linden surname and impersonation? (=_=)

[11:14:15]  Pamela Galli: How do we get on that list????

[11:14:20]  Marianne McCann: Loving – a lottery? but gambling….

[11:14:27]  BizTutor Magic: Jack: To where will Galen move once the SLM no longer has its exchange? Or will he move?

[11:14:31]  Argus Collingwood: was that the Beta list?

[11:14:38]  Jack Linden: Hey Pamela, yeah I got your email and should be able to reply today

[11:14:45]  Pamela Galli: ty

[11:14:50]  Loving Clarity: you’re right. with the amount of money it’ll make we’ll just divide it between all residents equally

[11:14:55]  Jack Linden: Still digging into that. The fail rate generally is nowhere near as high as you seem to be seeing

[11:14:58]  Ashasekayi Ra: Where is the marketplace mailing list?

[11:14:59]  Jack Linden: So we’ll look into it

[11:15:18]  Loving Clarity: did you do your homework, Jack?

[11:15:28]  Pamela Galli: ty’

[11:15:38]  Jack Linden: BizTutor, that’s the same team – the Marketplace team. So no moves

[11:15:41]  Cummere Mayo: on marketplace? im a low volume seller, and ive had at least a 5th of my sales fail to deliver… and a fourth fail to pay me

[11:15:51]  Marianne McCann: Aside still in the Battery St. Offices, or back across the pond?

[11:16:01]  Cummere Mayo: i dont even care… I want to be able to disable my marketplace, buit that ability got disabled

[11:16:15]  Marianne McCann hunts in the couch sushions for her missing “:”

[11:16:31]  Jack Linden: Marianne, you mean me or the Marketplace team?

[11:16:33]  Charlene Trudeau: I’ve had to repurchase a number of items declared successfully delivered. I don’t have the patience to contact the sellers. NOtably they have ALL been using the cart check out rather than individual purchases.

[11:16:35]  Marianne McCann: you

[11:16:43]  Jack Linden: Oh, I’m currently in SF

[11:16:49]  BizTutor Magic: ‘k. Given that, can you please tell me who’s currently charged with management of the LindEx?

[11:16:52]  Cummere Mayo: charlene thats something i noticed as well.

[11:16:55]  Jack Linden: I’ll be back in the UK for winter holidays

[11:17:00]  BizTutor Magic: And whether that will be changing?

[11:17:10]  Cummere Mayo: every failure ive had or seen as a merchant or a customer its been using the cart

[11:17:22]  Loving Clarity: same here.

[11:17:29]  Argus Collingwood: mhm

[11:17:45]  Loving Clarity: and how does one get ON the MP mailing list as I somehow don’t seem to be.

[11:17:58]  Ashasekayi Ra: I was wondering the same.

[11:18:05]  Cummere Mayo: i even pointed that out to brodesky or whatever his name is… and got politely told to mind my own business

[11:18:14]  Pamela Galli: If anyone knows how to get on that mailing list, please let me know — have wondered why there is no communication from commerce team

[11:18:23]  Ziki Questi: ditto

[11:18:29]  Jack Linden: Loving, it was a list of merchants that helped us beta test as we moved over from xstreet

[11:18:34]  Argus Collingwood: we would all like to be part of said list

[11:18:45]  Ashasekayi Ra: First time I’ve heard of the commerce mailing list.

[11:18:45]  Cummere Mayo: Ild love to be on it too.. since i cant fricken get my shit OFF the marketplace

[11:18:48]  Pamela Galli: ???

[11:19:11]  Jack Linden: I’ll talk to the team about how the members are chosen and what we can do to add folks in

[11:19:19]  Jack Linden: [action on Jack]

[11:19:23]  Ashasekayi Ra: So the mailing list is only for beta testers?

[11:19:26]  Loving Clarity: oh. then that leads me back to my previous question… last week I asked you to bring with you a list of what the MP team is ACTIVELY working on since we, the merchants, are no longer kept in the loop. Did you bring your homework?

[11:19:34]  Argus Collingwood: that would be lovely in lieu of Commerce Meetings

[11:19:49]  Jack Linden: Ashasekayi – that’s how the list began, that’s all I meanty

[11:19:52]  Jack Linden: *meant

[11:19:56]  Ziki Questi: jack, if that’s who essential communications such as galen’s introduction are being handled, shouldn’t they go out to the broader constituency of marketplace stakeholders?

[11:19:59]  Ashasekayi Ra: Ah ok

[11:20:03]  Ziki Questi: er, how rather

[11:20:05]  BizTutor Magic: On the plus side, Jack, I’m getting better response as to Live Chat, along with genuine indication that my ideas and requests are being passed up the Chain of Command.

[11:21:02]  Ashasekayi Ra: Agreed Ziki

[11:21:04]  Cummere Mayo: meh hold times for me have ONLY been 90 minutes as of late… thats an improvement i guess, though some “helpful” ontyne disabled my adult verification

[11:21:08]  Jack Linden: Loving, the marketplace team have a ferw large pieces and many small fixes/improvements. The key ones are AIS (automating delivery of items with an API, so no more fails).. that’s top of the list..

[11:21:11]  Jack Linden: ..also..

[11:21:18]  Cummere Mayo: and now im getting static trying to get it back

[11:21:48]  BizTutor Magic: Cummere: The Ontynes are GONE from SL Live Chat, last time I checked.

[11:21:50]  Jack Linden: ..from last we week we’re looking at how we can allow merchants tocontrol the order of items that show on their Merchant pages

[11:22:04]  Cummere Mayo: no their jsut renamed scout…

[11:22:05]  Jack Linden: ..we have some ideas so we’re going to see if we can do that

[11:22:09]  Loving Clarity: so fixing search is still at the bottom of the list?

[11:22:25]  Jack Linden: We also have some work around xstreet exchange to get done.

[11:22:28]  Ziki Questi: that would be nice … even better would be to allow us to have categories within our stores

[11:22:33]  Marianne McCann: Any news on the TSL integration?

[11:22:37]  BizTutor Magic: Jack: What ideas have been proposed to bring back value to non-Adult land after the first of the year?

[11:22:39]  Jack Linden: I think those are the main things we’re focussed on

[11:22:44]  Ashasekayi Ra: I thought the exchange was closing?

[11:22:48]  Ciaran Laval: Categories would be great

[11:22:51]  Cummere Mayo: jonb and stuartm are still answering… (suspects it was stuart that killed my av)

[11:22:57]  Charlene Trudeau: categories within the stores would be awesome. An advanced search where we can search subcategories not just categories would help too

[11:23:13]  Loving Clarity: I hope they don’t close the exchange. I never buy through LL and always did through xstreet

[11:23:14]  Ziki Questi: yes, otherwise there are just hundreds of items per store sometimes

[11:23:17]  Pamela Galli: Xstreet had categories of course

[11:23:18]  Argus Collingwood: even an option to search only our own items would be good

[11:23:26]  Jack Linden: BizTutor – actually.. I’ve had a few ideas come to me from the new support folks. It does seem to be really turning around well

[11:23:51]  Ashasekayi Ra: Yea, I liked the exchange. But, I could have sworn they said it was closing and to use Lindex.

[11:24:03]  BizTutor Magic: Loving: It closes 11/30/10, so far as know, and I’ve already detrimentally changed position as a result of the annoucement.

[11:24:07]  Jack Linden: Marianne, the TSL stuff is impacting lots of teams as you’d expect.. search, marketplace etc. It’s well underway though.

[11:24:13]  Cummere Mayo: jack why not simply bring back the old linden team tha ran support? they did a better job, knew the system, and didnt mess with peoples accounts without permission

[11:24:17]  BizTutor Magic: announcement*

[11:24:51]  BizTutor Magic: TSL = Teen Invasion?

[11:24:51]  Pamela Galli: We really need Brodesky back

[11:24:55]  Cummere Mayo: and i want to knwo who can fix my damn av status since support messed it up (without my authorization!)

[11:25:01]  Jack Linden: Cummere, I’m no longer involved with Support but we have some super bright guys there building a support org that can better scale

[11:25:32]  gwampa Lomu is Online

[11:25:35]  Drongle McMahon: Zero scales very well.

[11:25:40]  Marianne McCann: I’d love to see more public about it, Jack. More of a sense out there that it’s still happening and here’s what we’re working on. I know it will impact me and other, so I’d like a little firmer ground. Maybe a brief blog post about the TSL integration efforts underway would be nice, maybe?

[11:25:45]  Jack Linden: Charlene.. agreed re categories

[11:26:11]  BizTutor Magic: Jack, can you please explain what the hell scaleability is relative to SL generally and Support specifically? I hear the term all the time, and consider it a fluffy buzzword.

[11:26:14]  Ziki Questi: what is the possibility of seeing categories in the near future then, jack?

[11:26:27]  Jack Linden: Marianne.. i’ll ask the folks on that effort, but honestly I’m not sure what the comms planning is for it

[11:26:29]  Argus Collingwood: changing categories is not working in a timely manner either

[11:26:41]  Pamela Galli: slm has around 300 jiras now

[11:26:41]  Marianne McCann: Thanks, Jack

[11:27:06]  Ashasekayi Ra: Oi

[11:27:18]  Loving Clarity: only 300? wow! I’d have thought more… but the real question is are any marked “reviewed” other than the ones that say “fixed” but aren’t? lol

[11:27:34]  Ranee Naxos: is there any plans to run adds on tv like the sims3 game console is doing to promote SL ? any where in the near future ? wonders….

[11:27:36]  BizTutor Magic: Maybe my lack of understanding of scaleabilty is due to my being a “technodolt”.

[11:27:37]  Jack Linden: BizTutor, I guess it is a buzzword, yeah. We had a pretty large support org at one stage and i think the view was that we could be more efficient in some key ways to make sure that we don’t simply end up with hundreds of support folks

[11:27:56]  Ciaran Laval: Jack, inworld classifieds, why are you reducing the character limit?

[11:27:57]  Jack Linden: So it’s about being more efficient, having better tools (like the new live chat) etc

[11:27:59]  Cummere Mayo: what linden is yeah well that idea FAILED jack

[11:28:01]  Pamela Galli: support is a sink

[11:28:27]  Trouble Streeter: charlene, mic is on

[11:28:31]  Jack Linden: open mic

[11:28:38]  BizTutor Magic: ‘k. So scaling it down from 1 support for every alleged resident to 1 support to every resident who might need one at any given time of day?

[11:28:40]  Cummere Mayo: 90 minute hold times, support people that put the wrong account under maintenace, support people that take it upon themselves to decide you dont need things like the adult verification?

[11:28:49]  Qie Niangao: lol… Charlene has the noisiest mouse wheel! :p

[11:29:20]  Jack Linden: As I’ve said many times Cummere, I’m not involved in the support side so I really can’t comment on it I’m afraid.

[11:29:22]  Cummere Mayo: ild really like to knwo which linden to talk to to get my accounts fixed, and the 8 month old tickets addressed!

[11:29:33]  Jack Linden: Qie, i think charlene has a hamster.

[11:29:37]  Jack Linden:

[11:29:41]  Charlene Trudeau: sorry

[11:29:41]  Argus Collingwood: lol

[11:29:49]  Ashasekayi Ra snorts

[11:29:50]  Cummere Mayo: so give em the name of someone that can jack

[11:29:52]  Charlene Trudeau: middle mouse button toggles it and I didn’t realize lol

[11:30:23]  Jack Linden: Cummere, you’d have to just contact support through the normal channels. I don’t have a name to give you, support doesn’t operate that way

[11:30:41]  Cummere Mayo: ive asked to speak to a supervisor… theres “never one availible”

[11:30:50]  Cummere Mayo: and every time they have fucked up major

[11:31:03]  Trouble Streeter: LOL, “support doesn’t operate that way” says an awful lot about “support”

[11:31:09]  BizTutor Magic: Jack: It should. If there’s a support department, then there should be one person on whom responsibility for it falls.

[11:31:16]  Jack Linden: oop, lots og direct IMs and notecards. if folks could wait until the end, that would help me!

[11:31:31]  Jack Linden: I’m a serial mono-tasker you see.

[11:31:31]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Spam’im! XD

[11:31:40]  Cummere Mayo: the way support operates now there is NO accountability

[11:31:54]  Motor Loon: That’s us men in general Jack…

[11:31:57]  Pamela Galli: Jack is not on the support team

[11:32:07]  Melody Regent: [11:31:31] Jack Linden: I’m a serial mono-tasker you see. <<<—- explains alot

[11:32:07]  Loving Clarity giggles “sorry Jack”

[11:32:09]  Cummere Mayo: so he should give me the name of the linden in charge of it

[11:32:14]  Qie Niangao: So, Jack, you have the viewer product, right? So… any general timeframe in mind for Mesh? Any hints for how long before 1.x won’t work?

[11:32:29]  Trouble Streeter: hi^5 Mel

[11:32:30]  Jack Linden: Ouch Melody! So mean!

[11:32:56]  BizTutor Magic: Cummere: In general, you’re correct there, and Jack, that issue DOES affect commerce. Example: Every time Cummere wants to buy time with an escort, or to enjoy a party on adult land and tip while there, moneyflow w/in SL is HINDERED.

[11:33:21]  Jack Linden: Qie, no news on 1.23s lifespan, but for Mesh our next focus is going to be cleaning up the import UI which is kinda rough right now.

[11:33:24]  Cummere Mayo: avtually i can get to zhindra i cant get to my OWN lands

[11:33:32]  Cummere Mayo: cause they are adult verified only

[11:33:42]  Pari Edenflower: Jack… Could you ask one of the support related people to host their own Office Hour if they are not doing already? That should solve a lot of issues…

[11:33:44]  BizTutor Magic: So is Zindra.

[11:33:47]  Jack Linden: Qie, I think we need some more time in beta before we can start to talk about exactly when it will launch

[11:33:53]  Qie Niangao: no timeline for when Mesh hits Agni, yet then?

[11:33:56]  Imnotgoing Sideways << Has Zindra land now. =^-^=

[11:34:00]  Cummere Mayo: its a differant system biz

[11:34:29]  BizTutor Magic: The other way to do it is to phone the billing office during non-peak hours.

[11:34:33]  Pamela Galli: Commerce will never have an OH — they don’t even want merchants to know who they are, lest someone contact them

[11:34:48]  Qie Niangao: (ah, messages crossed in the aether) Thanks Jack.

[11:34:51]  Argus Collingwood: Jack, who is in charge of the Forums/Blogs?

[11:34:54]  Cummere Mayo: i can access adult land so long as it doesnt have the age verrified thing clicked. but my own lands are verified so i could keep out the fricken munchkins

[11:35:02]  World Trade Center: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.

[11:35:03]  Jack Linden: No Qie, no defined timeline. We’re more working in an agile way these days so it’ll be the quality of the experience that dictates when it goes out rather than a date we set far in advance.

[11:35:10]  Pamela Galli: Argus, Yoz I think

[11:35:13]  Jack Linden: But you’ll see it improve and develop on the Beta as we go

[11:35:14]  Qie Niangao: Cool, Thanks.

[11:35:14]  Loving Clarity: Jack, is there some indication when the issues with MP search will be addressed?

[11:35:31]  Argus Collingwood: thanks Pam

[11:35:42]  Imnotgoing Sideways: The munchkins already used mommy’s driver’s license to sign up to SL… They’re in already. You’ve protected yourself from nothing. (^_^)

[11:35:42]  Loving Clarity: or when carts will work as they’re intended?

[11:35:46]  Jack Linden: Loving, I don’t have any specifics on that sadly.

[11:36:08]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Why bother with the “cart” at all? (=_=)

[11:36:12]  Pamela Galli: Agile = launch in barely beta

[11:36:34]  Loving Clarity: I don’t lol. Never use it. but you have to admit going through three pages after clicking “buy now” is ridiculous

[11:36:42]  BizTutor Magic: Imnot: Let me guess. You’re another doomsayer?

[11:36:45]  Loving Clarity: I clicked buy NOW not buy EVENTUALLY

[11:36:50]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Frankly, the ONLY reason ontline retailers use a cart system is so that the customer can consolidate a multi-item order in order to properly arrange for the most efficient shipping. (=_=)

[11:37:11]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Last time I checked… Second Life™ don’t use UPS to deliver my pixelshoes. (=_=)

[11:37:11]  BizTutor Magic: LOL, Loving! Sorry, but that’s a GREAT line!

[11:37:17]  Carla Collazo agrees

[11:37:36]  Marianne McCann: No, Immy, they use DHL.

[11:37:49]  Loving Clarity: oh THAT’S why it never gets there!

[11:37:54]  Motor Loon: lol

[11:38:33]  Pari Edenflower: Jack do we have a definite date for TSL integration? If so…. Are we going to be able to fix parcel maturity ratings and the inworld search before then?

[11:38:35]  Charlene Trudeau: I like the cart because I can review the items before purchase, esp when I’m searching for something specific and want to find all the options that appeal to me, then I can review to see if any are ‘lesser’ than ones I found later. Its saving me tons of money because I haven’t already purchased three of something by the time I find the ULTIMATE

[11:38:50]  Loving Clarity: Jack, is there a possibility of placing a warning to shoppers that the carts are unreliable and it might be best to purchase singly until it’s resolved?

[11:39:08]  Ashasekayi Ra: That would be great.

[11:39:17]  Chaley May: on amazon i have 1 click purchase.. i use that all the time

[11:39:32]  Jack Linden: Carts are generally very useful for buyers, but they do have to work well. s we know we have to resolve the issues around delivery etc. Also, we may well move to allow selling of both inworld and real world items, or event tickets, or land..

[11:39:35]  BizTutor Magic: Loving: Offering solutions helps. Thank you for doing that kind of thing, and doing it often.

[11:39:40]  Jack Linden: ..where a single Cart would make it much more convenient

[11:39:57]  Melody Regent: Jack, over the last few months you have been asked MANY times about the Atlas program. This program is no longer under NDA and many people would like to know what it is. I think the one thing besides letting everyone know about the program is, that needs to be done is to clarify that this was never a program designed to give away GF sims to members. That you are not giving GF sims to people, under any program and what are the basic terms of becoming a member of the Atlas program.

[11:39:58]  Ziki Questi: “real world items”? meaning what?

[11:40:00]  Argus Collingwood: hmmm

[11:40:04]  Carla Collazo: real world items? on the marketplace?

[11:40:36]  BizTutor Magic: GF Sims?

[11:40:39]  Argus Collingwood: cat, bag, out

[11:40:41]  Cummere Mayo: … this is a virtual world. don’t mix real world items on it

[11:40:52]  Charlene Trudeau: in this case 95 a month hhomesteads, Biz

[11:41:02]  Chaley May: people dont trust LL enough for real item delivery when they cant stop thinkgs going missing allready in a virtual world

[11:41:04]  Carla Collazo: people already try to buy boots for their human beings on the marketplace

[11:41:07]  BizTutor Magic: Thanks, Charlene.

[11:41:13]  Charlene Trudeau: welcome

[11:41:32]  Loving Clarity: ok, well you promised us bulk uploads and dropped those off the map. THen brought in carts which don’t work… Now maybe I”m odd, but personally, I’d rather have a failed bulk upload than a failed delivery where I have to tell the customer “yeah, it’s messed up. wait 8 hours if you get a refund, just purchase again, if you don’t contact me, I’ll see if I got your money, and if neither of us has it, you’ll have to file a ticket”

[11:41:39]  Jack Linden: Ziki, so for example.. if you wanted to sell a Photoshop template for inworld content – like clothing, you could sell that

[11:42:03]  Carla Collazo: ah, ok, that would be great, jack

[11:42:04]  Jack Linden: We may, at some point, want to allow that kind of thing.

[11:42:11]  Carla Collazo: I thought about real world boots

[11:42:11]  Driftwood Miles: Mesh Models Jack?

[11:42:13]  Argus Collingwood: Jack they already do that

[11:42:14]  Chaley May: that wouldnt be so bad

[11:42:18]  Jack Linden: Yeah drift, like Mesh models

[11:42:30]  Cummere Mayo: we already have people in world trying to sell rl prints of artwork they don’t own. making rl goods for sale on the marketplace seems likust begging “sue us sue us”

[11:42:33]  Jack Linden: Argus, i know.. but it’s kinda clunky the way it works now

[11:42:41]  Argus Collingwood: true

[11:42:43]  BizTutor Magic: There is no WAY I’d buy something of substantial expense through a private company if I could POSSIBLY avoid it. Has LL thought about an IPO yet?

[11:42:47]  Loving Clarity: the shoppers just aren’t AWARE there’s an issue, Jack. And I think it would place a lot more faith in the MP and in the merchants if they knew that singular purchases were more successful. Because there wouldn’t be so many screw ups

[11:42:49]  Driftwood Miles: Second Liferosity

[11:42:55]  Pamela Galli: That is hardly a priority

[11:43:15]  Pamela Galli: Fixing broken and missing functionality should be the focus

[11:43:17]  Cummere Mayo: jack.. you already can sell photoshop template through the marketsystem as it is now

[11:43:26]  Cummere Mayo: you dont need to change anything to do that

[11:43:27]  Ziki Questi has to agree with pamela on that one

[11:43:41]  Jack Linden: Pamela, i’m not suggesting we’d do it in preference to fixing core pieces. Was just mentioning that it plays well with the idea of a single cart.

[11:43:58]  Cummere Mayo notes the viewer can still export any full perm image

[11:44:01]  Ziki Questi: yes, i’ve bought photoshop templates before on the marketplace as it is, no problems

[11:44:03]  Pamela Galli: Like I no longer have a way to search orders by item

[11:44:28]  Argus Collingwood: getting a whole outfit together is easier on SLM *if* delivery works

[11:44:39]  Chaley May: so the cart is functionality we dont really need yet?

[11:45:16]  Cummere Mayo: and its really frustrating to have to use the cart to send a gift. and if you wnat to send the same item to multiple people you still have to do it one at a time

[11:45:22]  Argus Collingwood: it;s perfgect when it works

[11:45:23]  Sim Crossing: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.

[11:45:24]  Cummere Mayo: so whats the point of the cart?

[11:45:46]  Jack Linden: Cummere, I think gifting is something we need to make much easier

[11:45:58]  Marianne McCann: I’ll take one, wheat, with marmalade, Daniel

[11:46:23]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Jack. It’s kinda jumping through hoops.

[11:46:29]  Cummere Mayo: okay well oen thing you could do is take a variation of what you did on slx for gifts

[11:46:30]  Loving Clarity: Jack, if you refuse to post a warning to the customers that there are flaws in the cart system, and refuse to remove the option until it works properly than I suggest you open up some direct channel to LL when deliveries fail; as well as a wiki as to the proper procedure to handle the issue until it is resolved. Because right now, the merchants are paying the price.

[11:46:36]  BizTutor Magic: The solution to the Marketplace hassles is to have people shop inworld, is it not?

[11:46:39]  Trouble Streeter: amen Jack. I don’t buy stuff for friends on the marketplace anymore, the one and only time i tried it took a half freakin hour to figure out HOW

[11:46:52]  Cummere Mayo: make it from the product page, but make one link for one person, and one link to send to multiple

[11:47:19]  Jack Linden: Trouble, i know. And gifting should be sooo easy, and possible through profiles too

[11:47:45]  Carla Collazo: you mean inworld through profiles?

[11:47:51]  Trouble Streeter glances to Busy Holiday Gifting Season ahead and suggests commerce get it’s butt in gear making it easy

[11:47:54]  BizTutor Magic: One last question, Jack. Who is “Governor Linden”, ’til the end of the year?

[11:47:59]  Carla Collazo: the point of xstreetsl was you could gift no trans items

[11:48:06]  Argus Collingwood: mhm in 2.2 it still is difficult to gift/transfer stuff even for long time residents

[11:48:09]  Jack Linden: Carla. yeah. It ought to be possible to gift someone something from their profile.

[11:48:22]  Cummere Mayo: i dont like that idea jack

[11:48:23]  Imnotgoing Sideways: To anyone who noticed my *ahem*… Wardrobe malfunction… “Thanks” for letting me know (and remember to send me the pictures). =^-^=

[11:48:24]  Carla Collazo: yes, but only transfer items

[11:48:30]  Marianne McCann: Who isn’t Governor Linden

[11:48:34]  Marianne McCann winks

[11:48:36]  Carla Collazo: the point of xstreetsl was you could gift no trans items

[11:48:39]  Cummere Mayo: profiles are already cluttered with too much crap as it is

[11:48:41]  Unable to send your message to the chat session with [RECIPIENT], However the server might send it again anyway. Error making request, please try again later.

[11:49:15]  BizTutor Magic: Jack: One last question. Who is “Governor Linden”, ’til the end of the year?

[11:49:29]  Ashasekayi Ra: Some people would find that feature helpful though.

[11:49:30]  Jack Linden: Gov Linden isn’t a specific person

[11:49:40]  Ciaran Laval: Shhh Jack, don’t ruin the mystery!

[11:49:41]  Liisa Runo: Governor is no one, and every one, all lindens can log in as governor

[11:49:42]  Chaley May: ive met Governer Linden

[11:49:44]  Melody Regent: @Jack, I have chosen to ask one questions today, but I do have lots more if this one will be ignored a second time. SHould I get my list out?

[11:49:45]  Melody Regent: [11:39:57] Melody Regent: Jack, over the last few months you have been asked MANY times about the Atlas program. This program is no longer under NDA and many people would like to know what it is. I think the one thing besides letting everyone know about the program is, that needs to be done is to clarify that this was never a program designed to give away GF sims to members. That you are not giving GF sims to people, under any program and what are the basic terms of becoming a member of the Atlas program.

[11:49:48]  Cummere Mayo: yeah residents arent allowed to sahre accounts…. lindens can

[11:49:58]  Marianne McCann: The governor is spartacus

[11:50:02]  Jack Linden: Gov Linden is a spirit, and entity.. an all powerful force of virtual nature

[11:50:20]  Pamela Galli: heehhe

[11:50:22]  Ciaran Laval: That’s better!

[11:50:23]  Daniel Voyager: I once saw Governer Linden on the top of this building. lol

[11:50:25]  Marielle Caerndow: Jack, what willbethe next big thing after mesh ?

[11:50:28]  Jack Linden: In a sense, we’re all part of Gov Linden. *looks solemn*

[11:50:36]  Pari Edenflower chuckles

[11:50:40]  BizTutor Magic: Then, Jack, SUGGESTION: Make Governor Linden a political and politically accountable officeholder within SL.

[11:50:44]  Jack Linden: (that better ciaran?)

[11:50:49]  Chaley May: hopefully the next big thing is LL will start building tools into their client

[11:50:50]  Driftwood Miles: chips I reckon

[11:50:53]  Ziki Questi must run … thanks, jack, bye all

[11:50:54]  Chaley May: to make meshes

[11:50:56]  Alexxa Despres: LOL

[11:50:58]  Cummere Mayo: heh i was hit on by gov linden my frist few weeks on this avi

[11:50:59]  Cummere Mayo: lol

[11:51:01]  Trouble Streeter bats her eyes and wonders if Jack will answer it if it comes from a blonde and not a redhead… [11:49:43] Melody Regent: [11:39:57] Melody Regent: Jack, over the last few months you have been asked MANY times about the Atlas program. This program is no longer under NDA and many people would like to know what it is. I think the one thing besides letting everyone know about the program is, that needs to be done is to clarify that this was never a program designed to give away GF sims to members. That you are not giving GF sims to people, under any program and what are the basic terms of becoming a member of the Atlas program.

[11:51:03]  Pamela Galli: Maybe we should pray to Gov Linden

[11:51:03]  Ciaran Laval: Governor Linden being an entity

[11:51:05]  Marianne McCann: I’ve spotted the Gov a time r two. Now Magellane. He’s elusive

[11:51:16]  Ashasekayi Ra: lol Trouble

[11:51:17]  Drongle McMahon: Govenor Linden is a very untidy land owner.

[11:51:33]  Marianne McCann: Magellan*

[11:51:38]  Cummere Mayo: so jack whats atlas?

[11:51:42]  Liisa Runo: she*

[11:51:56]  Charlene Trudeau: Jack, can you at least acknowledge that those of us in Atlas are no longer under NDA and the basic paramaters of the program?

[11:52:03]  Trouble Streeter: and if not, maybe Motor can ask it. he’s bald.

[11:52:06]  Ciaran Laval: Is anyone here on the latest beta release of viewer 2? The download keeps complaining it’s not complete for me

[11:52:10]  Jack Linden: Trouble/Melody, I don’t know if/when Atlas will be blogged in that way

[11:52:19]  Marianne McCann: Biz – A political figure, oh, please no. Glad to avoid political partieshere

[11:52:23]  Charlene Trudeau: there’s been so much misinformation that negatively can affect those of us in the program

[11:52:24]  Trouble Streeter: can you find out for us and let us know, Jack?

[11:52:24]  Melody Regent: Delby said no blog

[11:52:31]  Melody Regent: that is why I am asking you about it

[11:52:35]  Melody Regent: it has come up lots here

[11:52:36]  Cummere Mayo: i dont use the beta very often… im on one of this weeks dev builds

[11:52:50]  Something Something: Lord of Dee, yes, it downloaded for me

[11:52:56]  Melody Regent: Or did you not know the NDA was lifted?

[11:52:59]  Charlene Trudeau: the problem for us, Jack, is that if we state things, they could claim we

[11:53:01]  Jack Linden: Am checking with delby now

[11:53:06]  Charlene Trudeau: ‘re still trying to hide things etc

[11:53:12]  Charlene Trudeau: we need that info public and Linden verified

[11:53:20]  Ciaran Laval: Cheers Something Something, I’ve had to switch back to 1.23 and I’m lost!

[11:53:35]  Jack Linden: okay, delby confirms that atlas members are free to discuss the program

[11:53:39]  Melody Regent: She said in a meeting yesterday, NDA lifted private emails sent out to a few people but no blogs

[11:53:44]  Marianne McCann: Ciaran – I know that feeling. Last time I tried to run 1.23 I could not find a thing.

[11:53:49]  Charlene Trudeau: what the minimum FRE’s are, how they are calculated, what few benefits we can get for being in the program, and above all else, what we AREN’T getting that its rumoured we are

[11:53:51]  Ashasekayi Ra: What is Atlas?

[11:53:59]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Ciaran – I loaded it before coming over

[11:54:01]  Melody Regent: So tell us about the program and confirmt aht there are NO Grandfathered deals in palce

[11:54:04]  Marielle Caerndow: same for advertising options: How can business owners buy ads like the Linden-newsletter with the bunnies ? Secret deals ?

[11:54:05]  Melody Regent: confirm

[11:54:12]  BizTutor Magic: Anyway, I’m happy SL’s still among the living. We came too close for comfort to losing it recently.

[11:54:32]  Cummere Mayo: okay so what is atlas? and why is that Ll has so many secret beta programs they only allow certain pet residents into?

[11:54:36]  Ciaran Laval: Mari it’s odd isn’t it! I’ve forgotten where things are, Jean thank you, it’s just me I’ll find a way around it.

[11:54:36]  Marianne McCann: Indeed

[11:54:58]  Charlene Trudeau: lol, Biz, the end of SL has been in the next major change since the grid opened

[11:55:06]  Chaley May: I think SLs death would probably turn out to be a good thing

[11:55:12]  Marianne McCann: Ciaran – what it taught me is that many of the 2.x issues are similar. It’s about finding one’s cheese

[11:55:16]  Charlene Trudeau: I know I’ve been witness to 5 years of it. I won’t believe its ending til I can no longer log in

[11:55:25]  Trouble Streeter: we have 5′ left of jack, can we let him talk about atlas please?

[11:55:29]  Trouble Streeter: I know he wants to ))))

[11:55:47]  Jack Linden: Trouble.. I already replied above. Atlas members are free to discuss the program as they wish

[11:55:48]  Chaley May: we want information on Atlas

[11:55:55]  Liisa Runo: exept with v2, you need to eat the same cheese 5 times before it actually goes to your belly

[11:55:58]  Trouble Streeter: any info on GF homestead deals?

[11:56:01]  Cummere Mayo: Ild like to knwo what atlas even is…

[11:56:04]  Marianne McCann: Charlene – ya. I’ve been through so many “deaths” now it feels like a columbarium

[11:56:09]  Jack Linden: Marianne, cheese? really?

[11:56:09]  Melody Regent: @Jack, thank you for dancing around the issue. I will make sure to bring it up again next week and maybe not remain so quiet about the other questions I had. I was trying very hard to make it easy to answer only one question from me. So that we got a very clear and honest answer on it. I am sorry we were not able to. But there is always next week, and many many Thursdays after that.

[11:56:10]  Ashasekayi Ra: Same here Cummere

[11:56:18]  Melody Regent: Its ok Trouble, let it go, we can come back to it

[11:56:23]  Driftwood Miles: There are no GF deals for Atlas members and never have been

[11:56:30]  Trouble Streeter goes back to arranging the Unicorns

[11:56:34]  Jack Linden: Melody, I thought I just answered you.

[11:56:35]  Melody Regent: Maybe they will actually get Delby to come over like he has said many times before

[11:56:38]  Cummere Mayo: whatthe hell IS atlas?

[11:56:41]  Melody Regent shugs

[11:56:57]  Charlene Trudeau: In other words, we can talk, Jack, but we can’t get Linden confirmation of what we relay

[11:56:57]  Melody Regent: not even close Jack

[11:56:59]  Chaley May: Jack where do i have to look so i can get some Atlas deals?

[11:57:00]  Subway: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.

[11:57:01]  Charlene Trudeau: that doesn’t help us

[11:57:01]  Marianne McCann: Jack, as in “who moved my cheese?”

[11:57:12]  Argus Collingwood: would that be Atlas Shrugged, Melody

[11:57:14]  Loving Clarity: lmfao atlas/shrugs…. god I’m a geek

[11:57:22]  Charlene Trudeau: because we could say we get the sun the sky and the moon for being in atlas and there’s no one to say yes or no

[11:57:22]  Ashasekayi Ra: heh

[11:57:33]  Jean Swashbuckler: @ Liisa, I disagree, each iteration gets better and in the OH’s the developers are listening to people in attendance, as you know

[11:57:35]  Marianne McCann: V2 moved a lot of it, and I think people felt a bit at sea when it happened. But that’s a talk f’r another time

[11:57:45]  Charlene Trudeau: My interest is in clearing up the falsehoods about the program

[11:57:52]  Charlene Trudeau: like we do NOT get monthly tier breaks

[11:58:16]  Liisa Runo: yea, v2 will be fine, in year or 3

[11:58:21]  Charlene Trudeau: and the smaller estate holders have LITTLE to fear from the program, we don’t have enough offered to give us unfair playing advantage

[11:58:23]  Cummere Mayo: well ive heard abotu atlas only once beofre

[11:58:42]  Melody Regent: OK, we will host a meeting that talks about Atlas, one that talks abotu the truth and doesnt do tango around it. I will announce a time and place later. Hmmm? would that be me doing something LL *should* do? Nothing new

[11:58:48]  Ashasekayi Ra: So Atlas is a program for large estate owners?

[11:58:51]  Charlene Trudeau: (btw, for those listening, I still consider myself a smaller estate holder even if I do qualify for Atlas by the skin of my teeth)

[11:58:55]  Cummere Mayo: could someone im me and tell me what atlas is?

[11:58:56]  Marianne McCann: Liisa – I think it’s pretty fine now. A couple things could stll need some rethinking, though, but it’s a far cry from the original beta release.

[11:58:56]  Charlene Trudeau: yes

[11:59:03]  Chaley May: how can we know if atlas will benefit us or not if we cant see it

[11:59:11]  Charlene Trudeau: anyone with 20 FRE’s, if I’m not mistaken (Full Region Equivalents)

[11:59:28]  Charlene Trudeau: there is math involved to know how your homesteads and OS’s become full region equivs

[11:59:29]  Melody Regent: its seems to be something LL still wont talk about. Interesting

[11:59:40]  Jack Linden: I’m kinda in the middle on this one, but am passing onthe feedback

[11:59:44]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Mari, agree and with what’s in the pipeline for builders will make it more useable for them

[11:59:52]  Pari Edenflower: Since Jack cannot answer this question can we move on to a question he can?

[11:59:53]  BizTutor Magic: Well, that’s all I’ve got for today. Good seeing everyone. Thanks for the time and attention, Jack.

[12:00:01]  BizTutor Magic: Bye for now…

[12:00:04]  Melody Regent: A week from tomorrow at 11am in my New York NYC sim I will have something prepared and leave it open to questions.

[12:00:15]  Melody Regent: T? will you make a note to remind me

[12:00:26]  Marianne McCann: “In a sense, we’re all Atlas. *looks solemn*”

[12:00:29]  Trouble Streeter: yes I will

[12:00:32]  Trouble Streeter: )

[12:00:33]  Melody Regent: Thank you

[12:00:36]  Jack Linden: I have to run too. Thanks folks! Take care all!

[12:00:42]  Melody Regent: LOL

[12:00:42]  Argus Collingwood: “Goodbye!!”

[12:00:43]  Qie Niangao: thanks Jack

[12:00:43]  Pari Edenflower: Take care !

[12:00:44]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Bai you guyz! Xd

[12:00:45]  Driftwood Miles: thanks Jack

[12:00:45]  Ciaran Laval: cheers Jack

[12:00:46]  Chaley May: guy is over there

[12:00:46]  Trouble Streeter: bye jack

[12:00:48]  Loving Clarity sighs and doodles a disclaimer to MP shoppers explaining that carts are failing and requesting they use singular purchase for the time being. draws a little heard in the corner and tapes it to her monitor over mozilla

[12:00:49]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!

[12:00:54]  Melody Regent: [12:00:36] Jack Linden: I have to run too. <<, Run Jack Run

[12:00:54]  Jean Swashbuckler: ty Jack

[12:00:59]  Melody Regent sighs

[12:01:00]  Alexxa Despres: Bye Jack

[12:01:00]  Loving Clarity: bye jack

[12:01:02]  Chaley May: ask Guy Linden about Atlas

[12:01:09]  Ciaran Laval: Guy often sneaks into the building

[12:01:24]  Alexxa Despres: Bye all…nice weekend to you all

[12:01:26]  Ciaran Laval: Does he have an office here still?

[12:01:26]  Trouble Streeter: dang, he ran REALLY fast

[12:01:27]  Imnotgoing Sideways: If anyone was able to nab any snapshots of me during the first half hour… Deliver! XD

*****  If you still want to know what ATLAS is, please join Regent Estates to speak about it on November 19th at 11am SLT @ http://slurl.com/secondlife/New%20York%20NYC/184/209/22 *****

I was absent, thank you to Trouble Streeter, my lead Manager for filling in for me

[2010-11-04 10:58:28]  Qie Niangao checks his Linden detector. “no sign of Jack being in-world yet”
[2010-11-04 10:58:34]  Trouble Streeter: wow
[2010-11-04 10:58:38]  Trouble Streeter: that worked, Qje
[2010-11-04 10:58:38]  Qie Niangao: oh
[2010-11-04 10:58:44]  Qie Niangao: he just came inworld!
[2010-11-04 10:58:45]  Carla Collazo: maybe he is already here as his alt
[2010-11-04 10:58:50]  Phil Deakins: meybe he heard I was coming and decided to stay away )
[2010-11-04 10:58:59]  Argus Collingwood: lol
[2010-11-04 10:58:59]  Marianne McCann: Maybe Carla is really Jack in disguise
[2010-11-04 10:59:12]  Seattle LeShelle: Maybe he cant log in LOL
[2010-11-04 10:59:15]  Carla Collazo: I would not tell
[2010-11-04 10:59:39]  Foxy Petunia: On his way:)
[2010-11-04 10:59:40]  Jack Linden has entered the sim.
[2010-11-04 10:59:40]  Mericatherine Quinnell: when was the last time you saw an avatar with “crappy cat” as a name
[2010-11-04 10:59:42]  Marianne McCann: Hey Talarus
[2010-11-04 10:59:48]  Dytska Vieria: He’s chatting in the concierge group right now
[2010-11-04 10:59:57]  Talarus Luan: Greetings
[2010-11-04 10:59:57]  Foxy Petunia: yep
[2010-11-04 11:00:07]  Marianne McCann: Mericatherine – apparently, right now
[2010-11-04 11:00:08]  Marianne McCann grins
[2010-11-04 11:00:10]  Carla Collazo: hiya
[2010-11-04 11:00:32]  Argus Collingwood: hihi Mari
[2010-11-04 11:00:40]  Marianne McCann: Hey-lo!
[2010-11-04 11:00:58]  Drongle McMahon: Hello Talarus. Long time since you were here.
[2010-11-04 11:00:59]  Jack Linden has entered chat range.
[2010-11-04 11:01:00]  Marianne McCann: Here he comes now
[2010-11-04 11:01:06]  Qie Niangao: would it be bad to ask Jack why he’s using “Prokofy Neva” as his display name?
[2010-11-04 11:01:15]  Qie Niangao: Oh…heh… Hi Jack. ;P
[2010-11-04 11:01:19]  Seattle LeShelle: Hello jack
[2010-11-04 11:01:21]  Argus Collingwood: hihi Jack
[2010-11-04 11:01:30]  Marianne McCann: Welcome, Jack
[2010-11-04 11:01:31]  Talarus Luan: Yeah.. been a bit busy, though I have tried to come a couple of times when Jack wasn’t here. <.<
[2010-11-04 11:01:41]  Carla Collazo: hiya
[2010-11-04 11:01:43]  Jean Swashbuckler: hiya Jack
[2010-11-04 11:01:47]  Loving Clarity: hello again, Jack
[2010-11-04 11:02:00]  Jack Linden: whoa hang on, Phil is looming a bit. Let me move
[2010-11-04 11:02:04]  Jayson Dorn: hi Jack
[2010-11-04 11:02:07]  Foxy Petunia: Hiya Jack
[2010-11-04 11:02:07]  Phil Deakins: Jack is smaller than me so if he says something that someone doesn’t like, IM me and I’ll bash him
[2010-11-04 11:02:18]  Argus Collingwood: lol
[2010-11-04 11:02:21]  Loving Clarity: sooooooooooo tempting!
[2010-11-04 11:02:33]  Dytska Vieria whispers: It wouldn’t be the first time!
[2010-11-04 11:02:38]  Jack Linden: Phil, dude, i thought we were friends?
[2010-11-04 11:02:47]  Talarus Luan: You should be more worried about me looming.
[2010-11-04 11:02:53]  Phil Deakins: we are. I like bashing frinds )
[2010-11-04 11:03:02]  Phil Deakins: other people would fiught back
[2010-11-04 11:03:03]  Argus Collingwood: you must be friends Phil he mapped ya
[2010-11-04 11:03:08]  Argus Collingwood: lol
[2010-11-04 11:03:11]  Bronson Blackadder: HiJack
[2010-11-04 11:03:25]  Jack Linden: hello everyone. how are we all this week?
[2010-11-04 11:03:33]  Marianne McCann: Hangin in there!
[2010-11-04 11:03:38]  Talarus Luan: Tired. Busy.
[2010-11-04 11:03:39]  Cinder Roxley: great!
[2010-11-04 11:03:44]  Baller Projects: your special
[2010-11-04 11:03:46]  Argus Collingwood: well Spam on Forum…
[2010-11-04 11:03:51]  Jack Linden: as someone currently in SF, I can tell you that baseball fever is still rife here.
[2010-11-04 11:03:56]  Foxy Petunia: yeah lots of it
[2010-11-04 11:04:03]  Talarus Luan: I’m sorry.
[2010-11-04 11:04:07]  Marianne McCann: Hey Jack? What is the state of Governance nowadays?
[2010-11-04 11:04:11]  Argus Collingwood: was great to have them win huh
[2010-11-04 11:04:13]  Marianne McCann: We had a masive ol griefer cube attack last night in the Bay City/Nova Albion/Ahern areas. Two hours later, most of them were finally attended to.
[2010-11-04 11:04:20]  Marianne McCann: Some are still over in Darkwood some 12 hours later
[2010-11-04 11:04:24]  Jack Linden: Hey marianne, what do you mean? It still lives in support
[2010-11-04 11:04:31]  Jack Linden: Ah i see
[2010-11-04 11:04:36]  Talarus Luan: Two hours, eh?
[2010-11-04 11:04:41]  Drongle McMahon: What’s baseball?
[2010-11-04 11:04:42]  jrenslow Bach: some notorious griefers here funnyi just have 1 question but i think is a good 1.How are all the freebie stores and zyngo places allowed to use 30 accounts or more to be at the top of the search places but a top selling merchant like me trys to compete and gets a email from linden labs that i will be banned for using 7 accounts?
[2010-11-04 11:04:43]  Jack Linden: Yeah, I’m not sure what the team size is etc these days.
[2010-11-04 11:04:57]  Marianne McCann: It just seems like the response is pretty slow nowadays
[2010-11-04 11:05:06]  Drongle McMahon: Is that some sort of cricket?
[2010-11-04 11:05:07]  Argus Collingwood: a flow chart would be nice
[2010-11-04 11:05:36]  Talarus Luan: Isn’t Governance within your purview>
[2010-11-04 11:05:38]  Loving Clarity: Baseball is a good nap interrupted by crowds cheering
[2010-11-04 11:05:39]  Cinder Roxley: drongle, cricket is watchable, baseball is a snore. lol
[2010-11-04 11:05:39]  Marianne McCann: And welcome back to SF, Jack. Yes, we’re orange and black, it seems
[2010-11-04 11:05:39]  Foxy Petunia: Rumor has it that Grant is leaving today, who is going to over see the MP now?
[2010-11-04 11:06:02]  Carla Collazo: /wants to know that too
[2010-11-04 11:06:09]  Jack Linden: jrenslow – hard for me to know without digging into the situation. if you can drop me the details I can pass it on
[2010-11-04 11:06:26]  jrenslow Bach: do i need o repet
[2010-11-04 11:06:29]  Jack Linden: Tal, no – I haven’t been involved with support since the start of the year.
[2010-11-04 11:06:39]  Talarus Luan: Ahh OK.
[2010-11-04 11:06:39]  jrenslow Bach: sorry chat lag
[2010-11-04 11:07:12]  jrenslow Bach: well typ gamesor scripts insearchplacesgo thee lookat anytime
[2010-11-04 11:07:12]  Jack Linden: Marianne, you’re not kidding. I wish I had shares in whoever makes orange dye.
[2010-11-04 11:07:28]  Phil Deakins: Jack. Will you please give us a simple yes or no answer to this question. In search, has LL implemented a positive bias/boost for larger parcels?
[2010-11-04 11:07:36]  Marianne McCann: ‘s true! And as we’ve never had the Giants do it here, well… ya, a bit excitable
[2010-11-04 11:07:36]  Luci Koenkamp: the dutch ofcourse *grins
[2010-11-04 11:07:50]  jrenslow Bach: i will m you n thismatter
[2010-11-04 11:07:59]  Carla Collazo: a boost for the dutch in search?
[2010-11-04 11:08:13]  Luci Koenkamp: no, they make everything orange dude
[2010-11-04 11:08:14]  Marianne McCann: Well, all I know is I can’t use my land product when I can’t get Governance support to clean up the massive influx of racist-textured cubes with air raid siren sounds coming out of ‘em
[2010-11-04 11:08:14]  Marielle Caerndow: lol
[2010-11-04 11:08:16]  Jack Linden: Foxy – the team is still full steam ahead and still shipping changes.
[2010-11-04 11:08:38]  Foxy Petunia: Is Grant gone though or is it just rumor?
[2010-11-04 11:08:59]  Carla Collazo: and who is in charge of the marketplace, we have not seen any improvements since oct13th
[2010-11-04 11:09:01]  Foxy Petunia: He was the only one that seemed to answer any questions
[2010-11-04 11:09:08]  Carla Collazo: and it is still not finished
[2010-11-04 11:09:12]  Jack Linden: Marianne, understood. I don’t know any more about level of governance i’m afraid
[2010-11-04 11:09:21]  Loving Clarity: what changes, Jack? What is the MP team changing? They’ve stopped posting updates on our merchant storefronts, JIRAs go unreviewed and unassigned… so what exactly are they working on?
[2010-11-04 11:09:25]  Marianne McCann: Thanks, Jack
[2010-11-04 11:09:27]  Argus Collingwood: Jack if we observe any strange SLM issues we should still write JIRAs correct?
[2010-11-04 11:10:25]  Jack Linden: Foxy – we don’t generally talk about staff changes; when we do lose folks from roles that are needed then we’ll hire in.
[2010-11-04 11:10:26]  Foxy Petunia: If no one is answering them what is the use in writing them
[2010-11-04 11:10:30]  Roya Congrejo: I would like to know how is the situation with the support team… heared it changed… and we have unopened tickets now for longer … still waiting
[2010-11-04 11:10:50]  Carla Collazo: months
[2010-11-04 11:11:15]  Talarus Luan: Yep, I have a ticket in for a 16sqm since 09/24 Not even touched by anyone at LL yet.
[2010-11-04 11:11:23]  Foxy Petunia: That’s understandable but would be nice to know whois replacing him so that we know who to ask questions to
[2010-11-04 11:11:23]  Jack Linden: Loving, I think we have taken a breath after the launch – let the team have a bit of time off etc. I’m sure normal service will resume soon.
[2010-11-04 11:11:39]  Marianne McCann: How are things coming on mesh and related projects? Still on track?
[2010-11-04 11:11:50]  Loving Clarity: Last I heard, they just got back from vacation… they’re on another break already?
[2010-11-04 11:11:51]  Cinder Roxley: talarus, that’s not uncommon, land team is always that busy.
[2010-11-04 11:11:53]  Carla Collazo: jack, its not so easy, it is months now and some issues are severe
[2010-11-04 11:12:12]  Jack Linden: Roya – yes, support has been making some important changes to its service to better scale it I believe. I think they blogged a short while ago about some of that
[2010-11-04 11:12:17]  Talarus Luan: Yeah, I know. Just keep hoping service would get better… someday.
[2010-11-04 11:12:18]  Argus Collingwood: we have seen some strange stuff like prices not updating which might be due to cart issues
[2010-11-04 11:12:21]  Cinder Roxley: it was three months for me and that was two years ago.
[2010-11-04 11:12:37]  Loving Clarity: let’s not forget the failed deliveries issue
[2010-11-04 11:13:09]  Jack Linden: Marianne, absolutely. Mesh team are making very rapid progress and getting a ton of good feedback from residents. Some of the stuff we’ve seen on the Beta have been gorgeous.
[2010-11-04 11:13:18]  Phil Deakins: Jack. Will you please give us a simple yes or no answer to this question. In search, has LL implemented a positive bias/boost for larger parcels?
[2010-11-04 11:13:40]  Marianne McCann: Agreed. Most keen to do more with it on the MG, let alone larger than 10m prims, et.
[2010-11-04 11:14:09]  jrenslow Bach: wouldntbe fai
[2010-11-04 11:14:16]  Jack Linden: Phil, we don’t discuss the details of how search relevance works. Just as any other search provider wouldn’t either. We have a guidance page on the wiki that gives some pointers to good search results
[2010-11-04 11:14:23]  Foxy Petunia: Yes mesh is working out good on the beta
[2010-11-04 11:14:34]  jrenslow Bach: fair
[2010-11-04 11:14:38]  Phil Deakins: Jack: We are paying customers, Jack, and we pay for each parcel to be in search. We do not pay for our parcels to biased against, so has LL implemented a positive bias/boost for larger parcels?
[2010-11-04 11:14:43]  Chaley May: Thats crazy.. other search providers have competitors.. LL does not
[2010-11-04 11:14:58]  Drongle McMahon: Are you going to allow megaprim meshes (>64m) Jack?
[2010-11-04 11:15:01]  Marielle Caerndow: Any rough date when mesh will come to the main grid ? Rough ?
[2010-11-04 11:15:15]  Talarus Luan: They don’t do it necessarily because of competitors, but to stop seach gaming.
[2010-11-04 11:15:40]  Carla Collazo: search is gamed terribly
[2010-11-04 11:15:41]  Jack Linden: Drongle – we haven’t decided yet. We may stick with the 64m size for mesh and normal prims for launch but there is no final call on that yet
[2010-11-04 11:15:49]  Loving Clarity: Chaley has a point… it’s not like there’s a Yellow Pages alternative in here.
[2010-11-04 11:16:13]  Chaley May: gaming will happen
[2010-11-04 11:16:17]  Cinder Roxley: there is loving, but ll doesn’t operate it.
[2010-11-04 11:16:33]  Loving Clarity: Problem is, Tal, for those who figure it out, they can game it while everyone else is at a disadvantage. If there was transparency, then everyone’s on a level playing field.
[2010-11-04 11:16:33]  Marianne McCann: Fingers crossed for that. a 64m limit seems reasonable to me, and especially useful for mesh
[2010-11-04 11:16:34]  Jack Linden: Marielle, it’s tough to give dates because we’re still in development and have some way to go to get the UI right. I would say it’ll be after the winter break.
[2010-11-04 11:16:35]  Talarus Luan: Aye, it will, that’s why search parameters are kept secret and constantly changing.
[2010-11-04 11:16:41]  Phil Deakins: Jack: We are paying customers and we pay for each parcel to be in search. We do not pay for our parcels to biased against, so has LL implemented a positive bias/boost for larger parcels – yes or no?
[2010-11-04 11:16:47]  Chaley May: stopping us from knowing exactly how people game search only means those who dont game them lose
[2010-11-04 11:17:18]  Marianne McCann: Any insight on where things stand on the Teen Second Life integration? Still on track? Any news? This has been awful quiet lately.
[2010-11-04 11:17:21]  Talarus Luan: No, if they are managed well, there won’t be much point in gaming them, as it won’t give consistent results.
[2010-11-04 11:17:32]  Talarus Luan: Take Google, for example.
[2010-11-04 11:17:42]  Phil Deakins: Jack doesn’t know how the GSA ranks pages but he does know what external influences LL implement and, since we pay to be ins earch, we have a right to know what they are
[2010-11-04 11:17:44]  Talarus Luan: Gaming Google search is damn hard.
[2010-11-04 11:18:04]  Marielle Caerndow: Hm, that’s indeed still a while
[2010-11-04 11:18:10]  Loving Clarity: but if google gives you a bunch of crap as a return, you just go to Bing or Ask. What do you do when SL search gives you a bunch of junk?
[2010-11-04 11:18:12]  Carla Collazo: gaming sl search is damn easy
[2010-11-04 11:18:14]  Marielle Caerndow: But thanks
[2010-11-04 11:18:16]  Jack Linden: Phil, as i’ve said – we don’t discuss the fine details of how search calculates relevance. It’s also true that as is normal for search, we’re always evolving to make it as fair and accurate as possible.
[2010-11-04 11:18:19]  Chaley May: google doesnt give very good results either lol
[2010-11-04 11:18:32]  Cinder Roxley: lol
[2010-11-04 11:18:51]  Talarus Luan shrugs. “I get awesome results with Google, but my Google-fu is strong. ”
[2010-11-04 11:18:51]  Arawn Spitteler: Google always sends me to Wikipedia
[2010-11-04 11:18:57]  paeoti’s belt whispers: paeoti’s T&T-Belt is unlocked
[2010-11-04 11:19:08]  Loving Clarity: hahahaha Arawn
[2010-11-04 11:19:18]  Foxy Petunia: No don’t think there is a set way to make search work as it should know matter how big a company is
[2010-11-04 11:19:22]  Phil Deakins: I’m not interested in fine details Jack – you don’ty know any as they are inside the GSA. I want to know a major detail – has LL implemented a positive bias/boost for larger parcels
[2010-11-04 11:19:22]  Jack Linden: Wikipedia is often very very relevant Arawn.
[2010-11-04 11:19:51]  Techwolf Lupindo: The biggest problem with search is that LL uses a google app that was design for web pages with content, due to a jira bug, I found out they are feeding the search app the actuall web pages of the parcel info. The problem with that is all the data is metadata that is ignore by the googgle app by defauilt. LL is shoehorning it to work instead of using a proven open source soluction that was geared for indexing metadata. http://lucene.apache.org/
[2010-11-04 11:19:52]  Chaley May: so search no longer provides exactly what you are looking for because that which you look for cant game them good enough
[2010-11-04 11:20:08]  Phil Deakins: If you have implemented such a bias/nboost and you still take money for sdmaller parcels to show in search, it’s tantamount to fraud and I want to know
[2010-11-04 11:20:33]  jrenslow Bach: how are some allowed a chance to advertise on the newmarketplace way but i dont get the same chance
[2010-11-04 11:20:40]  Techwolf Lupindo: Phil, file a discovery lawsuit.
[2010-11-04 11:20:50]  Arawn Spitteler: Don’t smaller parcels still show in search?
[2010-11-04 11:20:56]  Talarus Luan: They do
[2010-11-04 11:20:56]  Foxy Petunia: They do
[2010-11-04 11:21:11]  Chaley May: google is only good for finding popular stuff or rare stuff… anything inbetween gets lost
[2010-11-04 11:21:19]  Jack Linden: Techwolf, it’s true that we’re looking long term at whether GSAs are the right choice. They are more suited to hierarchical data that is very strongly linked, like web pages, more than for flatter data structures like objects and content
[2010-11-04 11:21:28]  Phil Deakins: yes but iuf LL has implemented a positive larger parcel bias/boost, smaller ones are arbitrarily pushed down, regardless of theoir relevenace
[2010-11-04 11:21:30]  Arawn Spitteler: So, whack them into microparcels, for multiple listings?
[2010-11-04 11:21:43]  Jack Linden: The marketplace uses Solr, which we’re learning a lot about
[2010-11-04 11:21:44]  jrenslow Bach: and i hope you dont do search by parcel size i have small peice of land but yet im top seller
[2010-11-04 11:21:50]  Phil Deakins: Answer the question please, Jack, or are you afraid to answer it?
[2010-11-04 11:22:10]  Phil Deakins: a simp,e yes or no will suffice
[2010-11-04 11:22:15]  jrenslow Bach: so that would be retarded to say the least
[2010-11-04 11:22:15]  Luci Koenkamp: he just answered it
[2010-11-04 11:22:18]  Jack Linden: Phil, I have answered. We’re not going to discuss how search calculates relevance.
[2010-11-04 11:22:24]  Dytska Vieria: Jack, when are the migration issues for SLM going to be fixed! For example, all but one of my items were migrated over WITHOUT the ratings and reviews! I opened a Jira and nothing goes on.
[2010-11-04 11:22:29]  Phil Deakins: he answered it? what did he say that was an answer?
[2010-11-04 11:22:49]  Carla Collazo: not answering can be pretty much an answer
[2010-11-04 11:22:51]  Arawn Spitteler: He said it’s a secret
[2010-11-04 11:22:55]  Foxy Petunia: He has given you an explanation twice
[2010-11-04 11:22:56]  jrenslow Bach: well im sure cant be true would be grounds for many lawsuits
[2010-11-04 11:23:02]  Loving Clarity: I don’t know, Phil… after some hard work, I moved my store from page 16 of all search to number three when searching “silks” and I’m number one for “camisks” or at least I was yesterday. And I actually sectioned off a section to open a new store so my parcel is smaller than it was…
[2010-11-04 11:23:06]  Talarus Luan: he answered it with the third unlisted answer from your list “no comment”.
[2010-11-04 11:23:07]  Luci Koenkamp: it’s true that we’re looking long term at whether GSAs are the right choice.
[2010-11-04 11:23:22]  Jack Linden: Dytska, can’t speak to the specific ones that are yours but I’ll talk to the team about where we’re at.
[2010-11-04 11:23:26]  Cinder Roxley: he gave it more than twice, and he gave the same answer a few weeks ago here to someone else for almost a half hour straight.
[2010-11-04 11:23:27]  Phil Deakins: that’s true. but I want him to own up and eother admit that they are penalising less than large parcels or say they are not. the former is fraud
[2010-11-04 11:24:09]  Talarus Luan: Well, he apparently isn’t going to do that, so you’ll have to either find him in SF and take a lead pipe to his kneecap, or lawyer up and sue LL to find out.
[2010-11-04 11:24:13]  Phil Deakins: all parcels pay the same amount to be in search so it would be fraud to bias against some of them without telling us
[2010-11-04 11:24:15]  Arawn Spitteler wants Jack in trouble with the Corporate Counsel
[2010-11-04 11:24:42]  Jack Linden: Tal, I have pretty strong knees. Just saying.
[2010-11-04 11:24:54]  Foxy Petunia: Seems it only matters to you since all parcels are listed
[2010-11-04 11:25:04]  Carla Collazo: matters to me as well
[2010-11-04 11:25:06]  Phil Deakins: and a pretty sdtring line in waffle, Jack. Mau-up and answer the question please
[2010-11-04 11:25:09]  jrenslow Bach: and would not help mpeople find what their looking for at all
[2010-11-04 11:25:12]  Phil Deakins: *Man-up
[2010-11-04 11:25:14]  Argus Collingwood: get yer hockey gear on Jack
[2010-11-04 11:25:26]  Loving Clarity: Jack, is there any way you could talk to the MP team and get a list of what they are actively working on so you have some info for us next week? The JIRAs go untouched, we get no postings on our storefronts and there are a LOT of issues plaguing MP
[2010-11-04 11:25:41]  Talarus Luan: Also, considering the source of the question, I would be disinclined to answer, just from a personal perspective.
[2010-11-04 11:25:51]  Jack Linden: Loving, sure i can do that.
2010-11-04 11:26:13]  Loving Clarity: thank you, Jack!
[2010-11-04 11:26:14]  Luci Koenkamp: Jach will it be possible in the future to have more than 1 store on the new marketplace?
[2010-11-04 11:26:17]  Phil Deakins: you’re going to be a wimp, Jack?
[2010-11-04 11:26:24]  Carla Collazo: I understand the mp team would need a break, (if there still was one), but please consider, we do not get a brak in tier
[2010-11-04 11:26:28]  Loving Clarity: supposedly that’s a “coming soon” Luci
[2010-11-04 11:26:36]  jrenslow Bach: you dont need a island to be the top sellers
[2010-11-04 11:26:49]  Loving Clarity: but considering all the promised features that just up and disappeared when SLX went down, who knows.
[2010-11-04 11:26:50]  Luci Koenkamp: I hope so
[2010-11-04 11:26:55]  Jack Linden: Luci, you know – we’ve talked about that a little. And yeah – we would like to add that kind of functionality (plus the ability for a merchant to have ‘staff’).
[2010-11-04 11:27:07]  Cinder Roxley: nice.
[2010-11-04 11:27:13]  Arawn Spitteler looks over Jack’s Hockey Gear: Knee Pads; Ice Skates; Goalie Mask; Chain Saw…
[2010-11-04 11:27:20]  Jack Linden: It would be nice if a single brand on the marketplace could contain multiple merchants too.
[2010-11-04 11:27:25]  Argus Collingwood: Shark Jersey
[2010-11-04 11:27:33]  Jack Linden: Lots of options, but yeah – better merchant tools are always a win
[2010-11-04 11:27:35]  Luci Koenkamp: I dont need staff personaly but I have 3 diffrent stores and I´ld like to keep it all under my name
[2010-11-04 11:27:41]  Cinder Roxley: speaking on marketplace, what’s all that stuff at wishlist.secondlife.com
[2010-11-04 11:27:45]  Loving Clarity: I’d settle for being able to “arrange” my storefront.
[2010-11-04 11:28:00]  Dytska Vieria: I just want my ratings back
[2010-11-04 11:28:02]  Talarus Luan: Reminds me of a line from Blade: “Some ****** is always trying to ice skate uphill.”
[2010-11-04 11:28:07]  Carla Collazo: I wish it would work properly, especially MP search
[2010-11-04 11:28:30]  Phil Deakins: Alright, so LL are guilty of fraud according to Jack’s silence. I’ll leave you all to it.
[2010-11-04 11:28:33]  Loving Clarity: lol Carla… last time I asked Grant when it would be fixed, he implied it wasn’t broken!
[2010-11-04 11:28:46]  Talarus Luan: So sayith Judge judy
[2010-11-04 11:28:52]  Carla Collazo: tahts even worse, loving
[2010-11-04 11:28:55]  Jack Linden: Loving, what do you mean by ‘arrange’?
[2010-11-04 11:29:07]  Carla Collazo: if you get boots when searching for butterflies
[2010-11-04 11:29:26]  Luci Koenkamp: I got sex
[2010-11-04 11:29:29]  Luci Koenkamp: beds
[2010-11-04 11:29:33]  Cinder Roxley: oh, loving that’s a good idea, i was saying something like that on twitter.
[2010-11-04 11:29:47]  Argus Collingwood is just hoping that the cart cleanup is automatic every night
[2010-11-04 11:29:55]  Cinder Roxley: jack, it would be cool if we could pick which items show on the front page of the storefront.
[2010-11-04 11:29:58]  Cinder Roxley: of our own store.
[2010-11-04 11:30:11]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Cinder
[2010-11-04 11:30:11]  jrenslow Bach: can wesee demo
[2010-11-04 11:30:14]  Luci Koenkamp: that would be really nice
[2010-11-04 11:30:30]  Loving Clarity: well, if someone clicks “visit the store” they’re guided to my storefront where my product is arrange by whatever arbitrary order LL has decided makes sense. I sell everything from clothing to furniture and RLV toys… so it would be nice to feature certain items rather than some random order. And stores that do seasonal items would benefit from being able to feature seasonal items first thing rather than wherever LL shoves them in. There’s an untouched JIRA on that as well.
[2010-11-04 11:30:38]  Cinder Roxley: right
[2010-11-04 11:30:40]  Luci Koenkamp: Its our store front anyway
[2010-11-04 11:30:41]  Jack Linden: Ah right Cinder, got it. yeah that would be good.
[2010-11-04 11:30:53]  Cinder Roxley: you could put you new items up front.
[2010-11-04 11:30:59]  Cinder Roxley: or your best of the best.
[2010-11-04 11:31:05]  Luci Koenkamp: exactly
[2010-11-04 11:31:06]  Cinder Roxley: on your page.
[2010-11-04 11:31:07]  Jack Linden: Loving, is it random or is it in date order of when it was added?
[2010-11-04 11:31:16]  Marianne McCann: Ya, Cinder. I wish I could a made sure hte Hallowe’en stuff was first paged
[2010-11-04 11:31:22]  Luci Koenkamp: I think its best selling on top
[2010-11-04 11:31:23]  Carla Collazo: it is some kind of the last sold items
[2010-11-04 11:31:40]  Foxy Petunia: date order it seems
[2010-11-04 11:31:45]  Luci Koenkamp: but I dont want my freebies on top
[2010-11-04 11:31:57]  Loving Clarity: well, MP auto defaults any new item to “last” of relevance search. if you list an item right now and search the keyword (by relevance) it’ll be the last item listed. as for store fronts, I haven’t figured out the default yet
[2010-11-04 11:31:58]  Jack Linden: hmm, interesting. would you always want to manually control it or would you still sometimes want it to list most popular or most recently sold first?
[2010-11-04 11:32:01]  Carla Collazo: so freebies always first, what I would not chose
[2010-11-04 11:32:14]  Argus Collingwood: saved search format per customer would be good
[2010-11-04 11:32:19]  Luci Koenkamp: alwaya manually please
[2010-11-04 11:32:20]  Foxy Petunia: I would like a manuel control
[2010-11-04 11:32:27]  Cinder Roxley: in my rl storefront on another website, i can pick which items i feature up front on the page.
[2010-11-04 11:32:36]  Jack Linden nods
[2010-11-04 11:32:44]  Jack Linden: it does seem reasonable that you control it.
[2010-11-04 11:32:45]  Carla Collazo: manual please
[2010-11-04 11:32:47]  Marianne McCann: I wojld like to be able to dort as desired — but I would want my customers to be able to further sort (cost, new, etc).
[2010-11-04 11:32:54]  Marianne McCann: Roughly akin to an eBay store
[2010-11-04 11:33:00]  Loving Clarity: mine is random. I have two top sellers followed by an item I’ve never sold on MP
[2010-11-04 11:33:07]  Luci Koenkamp: good idea Marianne
[2010-11-04 11:33:07]  Talarus Luan: Well, typically, people who own stores in RL put their most popular/attractive pieces in the window space, which is small.
[2010-11-04 11:33:11]  Loving Clarity: none of which are my newest or my best
[2010-11-04 11:33:12]  Techwolf Lupindo: Stores can arragge there storefront however they feel like. MP should reflect that.
[2010-11-04 11:33:28]  Carla Collazo: true, talarus, but these are freebies
[2010-11-04 11:33:36]  Talarus Luan: They don’t put free samples in the window
[2010-11-04 11:33:37]  Carla Collazo: I dont want the freebies first
[2010-11-04 11:33:47]  Talarus Luan: Yeah, I know; I am arguing your point.
[2010-11-04 11:33:54]  Luci Koenkamp: me neither on the back were they belong
[2010-11-04 11:33:58]  Carla Collazo: sorry, talarus
[2010-11-04 11:34:01]  Talarus Luan: Storeowners choose what to put in that small space.
[2010-11-04 11:34:03]  Loving Clarity: I think it would be nice for the merchant to have a default and then the shopper can reorganize using the standard options that are offered on the normal pages
[2010-11-04 11:34:04]  Argus Collingwood: a freebie category woud be good along with Demo
[2010-11-04 11:34:18]  Jack Linden: I’ll follow up and make sure it’s on the backlog. seems like a totally reasonable thing to add
[2010-11-04 11:34:19]  jrenslow Bach: why isnt classified search the default instead of search all
[2010-11-04 11:34:20]  Marianne McCann: Right, Loving
[2010-11-04 11:34:36]  Luci Koenkamp: but my trees look out of place next to my clothes lolll
[2010-11-04 11:34:54]  jrenslow Bach: would seem best to get real stores found
[2010-11-04 11:35:33]  Argus Collingwood: any word on Mainland Controls and script limits?
[2010-11-04 11:35:54]  Jack Linden: Argus, no – I don’t have any news there I’m afraid.
[2010-11-04 11:36:00]  Argus Collingwood: kk
[2010-11-04 11:36:04]  Talarus Luan: Pretty much dead in the water
[2010-11-04 11:36:17]  Marianne McCann: Had all but forgotten about those, Argus. That was an end of 2010″ thing, wasn’t it?
[2010-11-04 11:36:22]  Argus Collingwood: mhm
[2010-11-04 11:36:38]  Jack Linden: How many of you guys are using 2.3 beta 2 today? I see one person with a display name here but that’s all
[2010-11-04 11:36:39]  Talarus Luan: That was part of the efficient scripts and mono upgrades which are now more or less on indefinite hold until LL reallocates people to work on them
[2010-11-04 11:36:43]  Something Something: I am
[2010-11-04 11:36:53]  Roya Congrejo: still on .23
[2010-11-04 11:36:55]  Luci Koenkamp: can you put the different stores on top tgoo Jack?
[2010-11-04 11:37:00]  Argus Collingwood sits on hands
[2010-11-04 11:37:01]  Carla Collazo: tpv
[2010-11-04 11:37:13]  Foxy Petunia: I am
[2010-11-04 11:37:13]  Marianne McCann: 2.2 here. Need to install the beta yet
[2010-11-04 11:37:15]  Cinder Roxley: i tried snowstorm from yesterday, but not 2.3
[2010-11-04 11:37:16]  Trouble Streeter: I am not allowed to use a Display Name, or my estate Owner will fire me
[2010-11-04 11:37:22]  Talarus Luan: Until I see that crappy sidebar destroyed, I’ll be on 1.23.5
[2010-11-04 11:37:36]  Arawn Spitteler: Is Display Name on Agni? I can’t even find it on Aditi
[2010-11-04 11:37:42]  Jayson Dorn: I”m on 2.3 beta
[2010-11-04 11:37:42]  Cinder Roxley: i saw display names is rolling to the grid today!
[2010-11-04 11:37:43]  Marielle Caerndow: I tried display names today….but NOWHERE i was able to enable them (no wrench when editing my profile)
[2010-11-04 11:37:50]  Talarus Luan: and Display Names are kinda useless.
[2010-11-04 11:37:52]  Marianne McCann: Arawn – yes. Try it in the Bay City regions
[2010-11-04 11:37:59]  Jack Linden: Arawn, by end of today the main grid will be fully enabled for those using the beta viewer
[2010-11-04 11:38:04]  Marielle Caerndow: I had no luck in Bay City…
[2010-11-04 11:38:10]  Foxy Petunia: preferences<general<name tags
[2010-11-04 11:38:11]  Marielle Caerndow: no wrench for me
[2010-11-04 11:38:18]  jrenslow Bach: change default search to classified adds not search all
[2010-11-04 11:38:26]  Marianne McCann: Curious that, Marielle
[2010-11-04 11:38:30]  Qie Niangao: actually, it was just a little clumsy… this RC transition… where sims that had display names working lost them for a while today.
[2010-11-04 11:38:35]  Qie Niangao: eep
[2010-11-04 11:38:48]  Qie Niangao: and the ??? (???) stuff is not so much fun.
[2010-11-04 11:38:52]  Arawn Spitteler: If a person’s going to search, they might not always be searching for stores.
[2010-11-04 11:38:53]  Marielle Caerndow: *shrugs*
[2010-11-04 11:38:54]  Loving Clarity: oh god no! I’m already paying to be in search, now you want me to pay classifieds too? that would bankrupt me!
[2010-11-04 11:39:02]  Jack Linden: Qie, i think it was made a bit more complex with the rolling restarts etc. should settle down
[2010-11-04 11:39:24]  Foxy Petunia: I pay both search and classifieds
[2010-11-04 11:39:27]  Talarus Luan: Rolling restarts happen all the time now with the new rollout system
[2010-11-04 11:39:27]  jrenslow Bach: well u must not sell then loll
[2010-11-04 11:39:30]  Arawn Spitteler: Shouldn’t Display Names be all over Aditi?
[2010-11-04 11:39:38]  Qie Niangao: yes, I’m sure the roll-back didn’t help either.
[2010-11-04 11:39:43]  Loving Clarity: not enough to be able to pay the prices it takes to get on the front page
[2010-11-04 11:39:44]  Jack Linden: Aditi is the test grid.
[2010-11-04 11:39:48]  Cinder Roxley: they’ll be all over agni today.
[2010-11-04 11:39:51]  Jack Linden: Agni is the main grid
[2010-11-04 11:40:18]  Arawn Spitteler: I’m using Viewer 2.3.0 on Aditi, but use 1.23 for regular existance.
[2010-11-04 11:40:53]  Jack Linden: I expect that Aditi will be a mix.. so there wil lbe mesh regions, display name regions and other stuff being tested
[2010-11-04 11:41:04]  Arawn Spitteler hasn’t really decided whether to use the last name of Tester or Lindan
[2010-11-04 11:41:11]  Talarus Luan: I’ve got to uninstall the original 2.0 first, but before that I have to do a full backup of all my SL data to make sure I don’t lose anything.
[2010-11-04 11:41:17]  Loving Clarity: top classified in my “catetory” is almost 50k. no, sorry, I don’t sell that much.
[2010-11-04 11:41:24]  Cinder Roxley: aditi is always a jumble of oatmeal.
[2010-11-04 11:41:38]  jrenslow Bach: dont have tobe top
[2010-11-04 11:41:41]  Marianne McCann will be sticking with the same ol’ name, ‘cuz its served me well f’r so long
[2010-11-04 11:41:41]  Jack Linden: Ha Cinder, nicely put.
[2010-11-04 11:41:58]  Loving Clarity: why waste the money to be on bottom?
[2010-11-04 11:42:03]  Marianne McCann: Hey daniel
[2010-11-04 11:42:07]  Marielle Caerndow: ay, no i have diplay names
[2010-11-04 11:42:09]  Talarus Luan: ..since 2.0 uninstall loves to delete all my profile data for me.
[2010-11-04 11:42:12]  Arawn Spitteler: Oatmeal is for testing PRIM_ROT_LOCAL
[2010-11-04 11:42:14]  Daniel Voyager: hey
[2010-11-04 11:42:19]  Cinder Roxley: lol
[2010-11-04 11:42:33]  jrenslow Bach: ones wo sellgood wuld bein top
[2010-11-04 11:42:40]  Cinder Roxley: well there are several oatmeals, i had always assumed that’s why they called the sims Oatmeal #
[2010-11-04 11:42:47]  Loving Clarity: classifieds list based on price paid.
[2010-11-04 11:42:54]  jrenslow Bach: not cheat lolll
[2010-11-04 11:43:07]  Carla Collazo: hiya vryl
[2010-11-04 11:43:16]  Vryl Valkyrie: hi everyone
[2010-11-04 11:43:20]  Marielle Caerndow: Btw. i think these tool tips are a good thing…anoying for oldies, but very good for new joinies
[2010-11-04 11:43:27]  Talarus Luan: Yeah, I like to search the second/third pages of classifieds
[2010-11-04 11:43:33]  Loving Clarity: you could sell nothing and still throw down 50k on a classified and be on top
[2010-11-04 11:43:42]  Talarus Luan: Usually find real stores and not slmarts.
[2010-11-04 11:44:10]  jrenslow Bach: who would do that less then are cheating far less
[2010-11-04 11:44:33]  Loving Clarity: I’m just saying your point isn’t valid. I never said it was a smart thing to do
[2010-11-04 11:44:36]  Vryl Valkyrie: Hi Jack, are we able to use voice here?
[2010-11-04 11:45:11]  Luci Koenkamp: Jack, today it happend again that people flag my items without a valid reason and they got delisted. Will something be done about that?
[2010-11-04 11:45:24]  Jack Linden: Hey Vryl.. it should be enabled though the meeting tends to be in text. I have been considerng giving my answers in voice though, going forward
[2010-11-04 11:45:34]  Trouble Streeter cries
[2010-11-04 11:45:40]  Loving Clarity: they only get unlisted if LL agrees with the flag, Luci… what were they flagged for?
[2010-11-04 11:45:40]  Trouble Streeter: i’d be very upset if you did that, Jack
[2010-11-04 11:45:40]  Talarus Luan: No record then. Convenient. :p
[2010-11-04 11:45:42]  Vryl Valkyrie: is it ok if I voice Jack?
[2010-11-04 11:45:46]  Trouble Streeter: yeah. what talarus said
[2010-11-04 11:45:49]  Vryl Valkyrie: easier for me
[2010-11-04 11:46:00]  Trouble Streeter: will someone type vryl’s quewstion then?
[2010-11-04 11:46:03]  Trouble Streeter: i do not have sound on
[2010-11-04 11:46:08]  Jack Linden: Every time i mention voice people tell me I shouldn’t though. Seems to be split on whether voice meetings are good or bad
[2010-11-04 11:46:10]  Chaley May: typing disability?
[2010-11-04 11:46:15]  Carla Collazo: me too, no sound
[2010-11-04 11:46:30]  Marianne McCann prefers text, if only for the ability to step away and catch up
[2010-11-04 11:46:33]  Loving Clarity: well, I know the commerce group counts on NCs of these meetings, Jack
[2010-11-04 11:46:37]  Roya Congrejo: me too no sound
[2010-11-04 11:46:37]  Techwolf Lupindo: And idiots with open mics
[2010-11-04 11:46:38]  Talarus Luan: Lots of reasons for avoid voice, and few to use it.
[2010-11-04 11:46:39]  Luci Koenkamp: fro being in the wrong category, they were textures and in building
[2010-11-04 11:46:48]  Vryl Valkyrie: I think to be fair, not everyone may be able to type or it may be difficult
[2010-11-04 11:46:48]  Seattle LeShelle: text gives us a log of what has been said, we need to have it in writing jack
[2010-11-04 11:46:56]  Vryl Valkyrie: so voice and text both is fair
[2010-11-04 11:46:58]  Qie Niangao types a novel while waiting for the voice ruling.
[2010-11-04 11:47:03]  Trouble Streeter: LOL, and if I gotta tell Mel no record… Jack, you’re killing me here
[2010-11-04 11:47:05]  Jack Linden: Asyou can see Vryl.. not an easy topic.
[2010-11-04 11:47:13]  Drongle McMahon: Voice meetings = chaos
[2010-11-04 11:47:23]  Cinder Roxley: and echo echo echo
[2010-11-04 11:47:31]  Carla Collazo: yes, echo
[2010-11-04 11:47:32]  Jean Swashbuckler smiles and nods at Qie
[2010-11-04 11:47:43]  Roya Congrejo prefers to stay text based
[2010-11-04 11:47:45]  Loving Clarity: plus text only prints one person at a time. voice you get people talking over one another
[2010-11-04 11:47:46]  Arawn Spitteler declines to use Voice, and verbalists don’t seem to care.
[2010-11-04 11:47:46]  Jack Linden: i think it could work if *I* talked the responses but only if someone annotates them back into text too.
[2010-11-04 11:48:11]  Vryl Valkyrie: I think voice and text is fair to all or else it’s discrimintation to allow one and not the other
[2010-11-04 11:48:24]  jrenslow Bach: heres an example i sell the most bowling alleys pooltables and mechanical bulls but you type that in searches wont fnd my tore hw is tat lollll
[2010-11-04 11:48:30]  Seattle LeShelle: and then you can say they recorded your answer incorrectly jack.
[2010-11-04 11:48:31]  Dytska Vieria: But if we didn’t have text, then classic meetings such as the “Twinkie” one would be no more on other blogs!
[2010-11-04 11:48:50]  jrenslow Bach: dont make sense
[2010-11-04 11:48:51]  Jack Linden: It’s difficult Seattle.. agreed
[2010-11-04 11:48:54]  Loving Clarity: how do you know you sell the most, Jren?
[2010-11-04 11:49:05]  Vryl Valkyrie: My comment is mostly to you Jack and I prefer voice because I want you to understand my frustration
[2010-11-04 11:49:10]  Seattle LeShelle: how is it discrimation SL started as a text only service to begin with . we all can read and write to a degree
[2010-11-04 11:49:14]  jrenslow Bach: look games on marketplace
[2010-11-04 11:49:14]  Cinder Roxley: lol
[2010-11-04 11:49:17]  Seattle LeShelle: no all people have speakers or a mic:)
[2010-11-04 11:49:19]  Cinder Roxley shouts: just use shout
[2010-11-04 11:49:24]  jrenslow Bach: im top
[2010-11-04 11:49:34]  Trouble Streeter: can we get to Vryl’s question and talk about voice as a separate agenda item next week?
[2010-11-04 11:49:40]  Trouble Streeter looks at clock
[2010-11-04 11:49:42]  jrenslow Bach: avg 15k day
[2010-11-04 11:49:51]  Drongle McMahon: Just scream, Vryl
[2010-11-04 11:50:08]  Chaley May: she likes to talk because its easier to get attention
[2010-11-04 11:50:19]  Luci Koenkamp: hehe
[2010-11-04 11:50:23]  Arawn Spitteler: Poetry translates well, into text.
[2010-11-04 11:50:29]  Carla Collazo: its harder to understand for not native speakers
[2010-11-04 11:50:36]  Roya Congrejo: yep
[2010-11-04 11:50:38]  Foxy Petunia: dang that was a hard crash:)
[2010-11-04 11:50:46]  Cinder Roxley: and we can hold side convos easier
[2010-11-04 11:50:47]  jrenslow Bach: fix searc
[2010-11-04 11:50:48]  Drongle McMahon: Poetry is text
[2010-11-04 11:51:01]  Carla Collazo: but I understand her now
[2010-11-04 11:51:06]  Seattle LeShelle: maybe Phil need to use vocie and then he might get a answer to his questions <s>
[2010-11-04 11:51:10]  Seattle LeShelle: voice*
[2010-11-04 11:51:12]  Chaley May: i hope your listening jack
[2010-11-04 11:51:20]  Marianne McCann: Hah! Indeed, Seattle
[2010-11-04 11:51:20]  Qie Niangao: voice transcript: they should start delisting all items in the Marketplace
[2010-11-04 11:51:32]  Carla Collazo is surprised voice works on her tpv
[2010-11-04 11:51:37]  Luci Koenkamp: I agree there vryl
[2010-11-04 11:51:44]  Jack Linden: So Vryl.. is it the rule itself (that things be correctly listed) or the fact that we haven’t been consistent in enforcing.. that you’re unhappy about?
[2010-11-04 11:52:01]  Loving Clarity: they only delist if someone flags it, unfortunately. they don’t investigate all items in that category or all items by that merchant… which is a pain when you find a merchant keyword spamming 400 items and they expect you to flag them each one by one
[2010-11-04 11:52:12]  Trouble Streeter: could someone PLEASE state what vyrl said, in txt please
[2010-11-04 11:52:30]  Arawn Spitteler: Did Vryl say something?
[2010-11-04 11:52:38]  Loving Clarity: her items are being flagged for not being in the specific subcategory
[2010-11-04 11:52:43]  Something Something: she is complaining that delisting of marketplace items is done selectively and unfairly.
[2010-11-04 11:52:50]  Talarus Luan: Yus
[2010-11-04 11:52:55]  Loving Clarity: so she might be in “textures” instead of “plant textures”
[2010-11-04 11:52:57]  Foxy Petunia: Well not all of us use voice
[2010-11-04 11:53:19]  Luci Koenkamp: me too Jack
[2010-11-04 11:53:21]  Arawn Spitteler: Those who use Voice are left without record.
[2010-11-04 11:53:31]  Foxy Petunia: exactly and that sucks
[2010-11-04 11:53:31]  Marianne McCann: ‘s true, Arawn
[2010-11-04 11:53:40]  Chaley May: my brain does not process speech all that well
[2010-11-04 11:53:50]  Talarus Luan: I think the problem is as Loving describes.. LL is responding to other users flagging her items.
[2010-11-04 11:53:56]  Analog Vasser: do notifications even get sent to the merchant when things are delisted?
[2010-11-04 11:54:05]  Marianne McCann: Actually, I just thought of somethign else that kinda is an issue with voice. It lacks the ability ot be succinct. Kinda overtakes the meeting, no?
[2010-11-04 11:54:05]  Argus Collingwood: was there any mail about delisting?
[2010-11-04 11:54:08]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Ooh.. Good TP point now. (^_^)
[2010-11-04 11:54:15]  Marianne McCann: Ya, sounds it, Tal
[2010-11-04 11:54:16]  Talarus Luan: IE, they don’t enforce the rules autonomously.
[2010-11-04 11:54:23]  Dytska Vieria: and voice doesn’t have translate…
[2010-11-04 11:54:27]  Chaley May: JAcks not speaking anymore?
[2010-11-04 11:54:29]  Qie Niangao: Mari: see? if you had a microphone, this wouldn’t be a problem
[2010-11-04 11:54:32]  Loving Clarity: on your storefront, Analog.. but no emails
[2010-11-04 11:54:36]  Luci Koenkamp: not only you Vryl
[2010-11-04 11:54:41]  Marianne McCann: Qie – But I do!
[2010-11-04 11:54:48]  Chaley May: text is quicker lol
[2010-11-04 11:54:55]  Imnotgoing Sideways: She do. I’ve heard her on a poscast once. (^_^)
[2010-11-04 11:54:57]  Techwolf Lupindo: Lindens have been fired for less then that. Time to reduce the payroll expenxes again.
[2010-11-04 11:55:02]  Talarus Luan: Good rant! I give it a 9.2
[2010-11-04 11:55:14]  Foxy Petunia: well to me the meeting is in text and all should do it in text ‘
[2010-11-04 11:55:14]  Cinder Roxley: text is pithy.
[2010-11-04 11:55:16]  Analog Vasser: agreed. 9.4.
[2010-11-04 11:55:25]  Seattle LeShelle: the russain judge gives it s 5.7
[2010-11-04 11:55:26]  Marianne McCann: Ya, Cinder
[2010-11-04 11:55:31]  Jack Linden: Okay – well Vryl, without knowing the reasoning behind the specific de-listing I can’t speak to that but i can talk to the support folks about how they are handling it. I agree that consistency is important.
[2010-11-04 11:55:37]  Analog Vasser: resdients DO feel like a sack of potatoes!
[2010-11-04 11:55:38]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Tal…but it is now turning into a filibuster
[2010-11-04 11:55:38]  Chaley May: in text people keep it short and to the point
[2010-11-04 11:55:40]  Qie Niangao: Oh. Okay, so… just talk on voice then. I mean, survival of the loudest
[2010-11-04 11:55:47]  Carla Collazo: hearing vryl speaking and reading the text all in a foreighn language really messes me up
[2010-11-04 11:56:04]  Seattle LeShelle: so sit up?
[2010-11-04 11:56:08]  Marianne McCann: True, Qie
[2010-11-04 11:56:12]  Loving Clarity: I’m with Vryl. I’ve given up on MP. I decided LL doesn’t want their pound of flesh. So I stopped bothering with it till the issues are fixed.
[2010-11-04 11:56:12]  Jack Linden: I can sense the frustration Vryl. I’ll talk to the team about how they enforce
[2010-11-04 11:56:18]  Argus Collingwood: Vryl where did you find the delistins again?
[2010-11-04 11:56:20]  Jean Swashbuckler now understands need for voice
[2010-11-04 11:56:25]  Argus Collingwood: delistings?
[2010-11-04 11:56:29]  Loving Clarity: it shows up on your storefront, Argus
[2010-11-04 11:56:30]  Techwolf Lupindo mutes
[2010-11-04 11:56:32]  Talarus Luan: Can’t we all get along?
[2010-11-04 11:56:39]  Argus Collingwood: kk main page?
[2010-11-04 11:56:50]  Techwolf Lupindo: Next topic please.
[2010-11-04 11:56:54]  Qie Niangao: Meh. Just close Marketplace altogether.
[2010-11-04 11:56:57]  Loving Clarity: yeah. when you click “my merchant home” you’ll have a box that says “this got delisted”
[2010-11-04 11:57:01]  Talarus Luan nods at Qie
[2010-11-04 11:57:04]  Insky Jedburgh: so if my items are delisted right now, how would I know?
[2010-11-04 11:57:05]  Cinder Roxley: there’s an adult textures category?
[2010-11-04 11:57:10]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Chicka chicka yeaaaaah!
[2010-11-04 11:57:12]  Analog Vasser: ty Vyrl
[2010-11-04 11:57:21]  Argus Collingwood: on your merchant hom
[2010-11-04 11:57:25]  Argus Collingwood: hom
[2010-11-04 11:57:50]  Jean Swashbuckler good response Jack
[2010-11-04 11:58:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: So far, I only have a freebie pack listed on the marketplace. If any fees kick in, I’m out. My inworld store does just fine. (^_^)
[2010-11-04 11:58:06]  Talarus Luan: Left hand <<>> Right hand
[2010-11-04 11:58:10]  Analog Vasser: why shouldn’t delistingsbe handled by the MP team who knows the environment better….
[2010-11-04 11:58:12]  Marianne McCann: I
[2010-11-04 11:58:13]  Insky Jedburgh: support always gets right on it
[2010-11-04 11:58:25]  Insky Jedburgh: lol.
[2010-11-04 11:58:26]  Marianne McCann: I’ve a few things in it, Immy. It does okay
[2010-11-04 11:58:33]  Trouble Streeter: so will we be transcribing this?
[2010-11-04 11:58:34]  Loving Clarity: yeah. if LL could get MP working right, they could tap into the cash I make. I make like 30x inworld what I make on MP
[2010-11-04 11:58:51]  Talarus Luan: All salient points have been transccribed.
[2010-11-04 11:58:57]  Analog Vasser nods, agreed!!!
[2010-11-04 11:58:57]  Talarus Luan: -c
[2010-11-04 11:58:59]  Carla Collazo: I made 3x on xstreet
[2010-11-04 11:59:02]  Cinder Roxley: i never transitioned, i redid all my listings and i make more there.
[2010-11-04 11:59:04]  Analog Vasser: LL wants a break, give yer resis a break…
[2010-11-04 11:59:17]  Marianne McCann: I make most of mine inworld, but MP is a nice adjunct to it all
[2010-11-04 11:59:23]  Trouble Streeter: ‘k. i find that voice enables longer questions than any text can ever engender
[2010-11-04 11:59:42]  Imnotgoing Sideways: That’s both good and bad. =^-^+
[2010-11-04 11:59:47]  Marianne McCann: True, Trouble. At the same time, it overpowers text chats
[2010-11-04 11:59:52]  Analog Vasser: not really… people whinge on about the same problem in chat for the whole hour……
[2010-11-04 11:59:53]  Trouble Streeter: yes it does marianne
[2010-11-04 11:59:59]  Loving Clarity: and I spoke with Grant like a month ago about recategorizing and adding categories as well as the ability to multi list up to three categories and all talks of that disappeared
[2010-11-04 12:00:05]  Techwolf Lupindo: A good search engine will replace overloaded catgoies.
[2010-11-04 12:00:06]  Seattle LeShelle: so Jacksince we are now going to use voice i think you will need 2 hour meeting time
[2010-11-04 12:00:06]  Trouble Streeter: yeah analog, but we can cover more than one thing at once in text
[2010-11-04 12:00:11]  Marianne McCann: Not saying it’s an important issue, but ya…
[2010-11-04 12:00:11]  Foxy Petunia: Should be one or the other though as some don’t use voice and it makes it very distasteful to those they don’t know what is going on
[2010-11-04 12:00:12]  Chaley May: Voice makes it more 1 on 1 and excludes the rest
[2010-11-04 12:00:15]  Trouble Streeter: but now we’ve taken 10 minutes on one question in voice
[2010-11-04 12:00:17]  Seattle LeShelle: to cover the exntended time we will need to talk to you.
[2010-11-04 12:00:26]  Trouble Streeter: i have no record of the last 10 minutes of discussion
[2010-11-04 12:00:31]  Trouble Streeter: and I’m really really not amused
[2010-11-04 12:00:36]  Talarus Luan: Yeah, you do.
[2010-11-04 12:00:45]  Talarus Luan: It’s all in the chat.
[2010-11-04 12:00:53]  Foxy Petunia: Voice isn’t in the chat
[2010-11-04 12:00:57]  Analog Vasser: none of us are amused.
[2010-11-04 12:00:58]  Trouble Streeter: including the last part about what tiggs will be doing and that we have a big team?
[2010-11-04 12:01:03]  Dytska Vieria: verbatim
[2010-11-04 12:01:05]  Jack Linden: okays folks.. I have to run now. More meetings to get to
[2010-11-04 12:01:06]  Talarus Luan: Trust me, it was all transcribed.
[2010-11-04 12:01:11]  Trouble Streeter: all we have is that jack is leaving
[2010-11-04 12:01:12]  Marianne McCann: See ya Jack
[2010-11-04 12:01:12]  Chaley May: bye
[2010-11-04 12:01:12]  Arawn Spitteler: Anyone know a place in Aditi, that Display Names is working?
[2010-11-04 12:01:16]  Jean Swashbuckler: ty Jack
[2010-11-04 12:01:17]  Argus Collingwood: kk thanks Jack
[2010-11-04 12:01:18]  Qie Niangao: thanks Jack
[2010-11-04 12:01:26]  Marianne McCann: Arawn – supposedly Bay City and the Blake Sea
[2010-11-04 12:01:29]  Jack Linden: (trouble.. no-one mentioned Tiggs)
[2010-11-04 12:01:29]  Cinder Roxley: display names will be over the enite grid by 8pm tonight
[2010-11-04 12:01:30]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Display names got shut… They rolled back the server. (^_^)
[2010-11-04 12:01:32]  Loving Clarity: bye Jack.. don’t forget the active list from the MP team next week!
[2010-11-04 12:01:34]  Foxy Petunia has left the sim.
[2010-11-04 12:01:34]  Foxy Petunia has left chat range.
[2010-11-04 12:01:35]  Trouble Streeter: see?
[2010-11-04 12:01:37]  Trouble Streeter: i heard a linden
[2010-11-04 12:01:42]  Trouble Streeter: but didn’t catch it cause it was in voice
[2010-11-04 12:01:44]  Seattle LeShelle: see jack you need to give us non voicing people more time since voice took more time to answer:)
[2010-11-04 12:01:45]  Trouble Streeter: you proved mypoint
[2010-11-04 12:01:48]  Carla Collazo: bye jack
[2010-11-04 12:01:51]  Ranee Naxos: take care…
[2010-11-04 12:02:04]  Ciaran Laval: Oh crap clocks went back
[2010-11-04 12:02:05]  Marielle Caerndow: i can use display names right here
[2010-11-04 12:02:08]  Chaley May: Trouble your standing right next to him.. how could you not hear!!!
[2010-11-04 12:02:13]  Arawn Spitteler hopes Jack will enjoy the transcriptions
[2010-11-04 12:02:13]  Luci Koenkamp: see youn next week Jack
[2010-11-04 12:02:15]  Marianne McCann: Yup, Ciaran
[2010-11-04 12:02:16]  Trouble Streeter: because i do not have my voice up
[2010-11-04 12:02:23]  Trouble Streeter: because, i have kids here and other things going on
[2010-11-04 12:02:23]  Solange Cerveau has left the sim.
[2010-11-04 12:02:23]  Solange Cerveau has left chat range.
[2010-11-04 12:02:24]  Dytska Vieria: Hi Ciaran!
[2010-11-04 12:02:25]  Talarus Luan: You can use them, but hardly anyone sees them.
[2010-11-04 12:02:25]  Trouble Streeter: i can read text
[2010-11-04 12:02:27]  Jack Linden: bye all!
[2010-11-04 12:02:28]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I’m listening to the Scorpions and have all Second Life™ sounds off. =^-^=
[2010-11-04 12:02:30]  Trouble Streeter: but not listen to voice easily
[2010-11-04 12:02:32]  Chaley May: bye
[2010-11-04 12:02:32]  Total scripts jumped from 4759 to 4388 (-371)
[2010-11-04 12:02:38]  Vryl Valkyrie: thanks everyone for allowing me to voice and sorry it took so long
[2010-11-04 12:02:39]  Cinder Roxley: just use your group tag.
[2010-11-04 12:02:40]  Analog Vasser yawns… always something isn’t it
[2010-11-04 12:02:41]  Ciaran Laval: Did Stupid and I’m with stupid turn up?
[2010-11-04 12:02:41]  Jack Linden has left the sim.
[2010-11-04 12:02:41]  Jack Linden has left chat range.
[2010-11-04 12:02:42]  Cinder Roxley: same thing
[2010-11-04 12:02:44]  Insky Jedburgh: the Jack has left the building
[2010-11-04 12:02:51]  Chaley May: i am listening to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Em7mzT48J4k&feature=related
[2010-11-04 12:02:54]  Marianne McCann: Have fun, all!
[2010-11-04 12:02:56]  Talarus Luan: Who is that, Ciaran?
[2010-11-04 12:02:56]  Imnotgoing Sideways: =^-^=
[2010-11-04 12:02:57]  Cinder Roxley: but parenthesis around it
[2010-11-04 12:02:57]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!
[2010-11-04 12:03:05]  Jack Linden is Offline
[2010-11-04 12:03:05]  Carla Collazo: byebye
[2010-11-04 12:03:08]  Jean Swashbuckler wave at Mari
[2010-11-04 12:03:09]  Cinder Roxley: group tag + parenthesis
[2010-11-04 12:03:10]  Loving Clarity: another week of empty promises and no answers. yaaaaaaaaaaaay
[2010-11-04 12:03:14]  Chaley May: it relaxes me
[2010-11-04 12:03:18]  Cinder Roxley: you have yourself a display name
[2010-11-04 12:03:24]  Cinder Roxley: omg hax
[2010-11-04 12:03:26]  Ciaran Laval: Alexxa and Driftwood, they were playing with display names
[2010-11-04 12:03:28]  Analog Vasser: doesn’t matter if it’s in voice or text when it’s the same old BS every week.
[2010-11-04 12:03:30]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Well… My prediction came true… I arrived on time just to hear the bugger say “Bye”. =^-^+
[2010-11-04 12:03:32]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[2010-11-04 12:03:40]  Qie Niangao: It’s kinda working here… there’s one person who shows as “??? (???)” on my viewer
[2010-11-04 12:03:44]  Loving Clarity: lol Imn
[2010-11-04 12:03:44]  Carla Collazo: did i get it right? they have a big team there?
[2010-11-04 12:03:59]  Carla Collazo: at the marketplace?
[2010-11-04 12:04:07]  Argus Collingwood: that is what he said
[2010-11-04 12:04:11]  Arawn Spitteler: I wonder if I simply hit Aditi, when the Display Names server was down
[2010-11-04 12:04:17]  Talarus Luan: I don’t think the term “big” applies to any team at LL anymore.
[2010-11-04 12:04:20]  Cinder Roxley: i like how he completely ignored me about wishlist.secondlife.com
[2010-11-04 12:04:25]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Geh… I should stay on… It’s not like I’m doing anything here today. Really… At work and doing work are two very different things. (=_+)
[2010-11-04 12:04:31]  Analog Vasser wonders what will happen with the Grant rumour…?
[2010-11-04 12:04:38]  Imnotgoing Sideways kicks her shift key! DX
[2010-11-04 12:04:46]  Carla Collazo escapes to rl
[2010-11-04 12:04:46]  Guy Linden has entered the sim.
[2010-11-04 12:04:48]  Chaley May: using voice is about control for some people.. its surprising how much power some have in voice
[2010-11-04 12:04:49]  Drongle McMahon: >1 = big
[2010-11-04 12:04:50]  Imnotgoing Sideways: >:G
[2010-11-04 12:05:21]  Argus Collingwood: laters folks I have rather messy notes
[2010-11-04 12:05:26]  Cinder Roxley: my guess is it will either turn out to be true or false
[2010-11-04 12:05:31]  Argus Collingwood: if anyone wants them
[2010-11-04 12:05:32]  Cinder Roxley: that’s how rumors usually go.
[2010-11-04 12:05:37]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I’ve had voice off for over 2 years… Never bothered me none… What am I missing? Corny accents? (^_^)
[2010-11-04 12:05:42]  Analog Vasser: deep
[2010-11-04 12:05:46]  Talarus Luan: yeah, but the nice thing is, everyone else can have 10 other conversations in text chat whilst the one filibusters in voice.
[2010-11-04 12:05:59]  Seattle LeShelle: has anyone evwr had a bacon chocolate bar LOl someone just gave me one on another note LOL
[2010-11-04 12:06:05]  Chaley May: I dont need the notes.. was able to keep up.. but thanx
[2010-11-04 12:06:06]  Imnotgoing Sideways: BACON!!! XD
[2010-11-04 12:06:08]  Imnotgoing Sideways: CHOCOLATE!!!!!!
[2010-11-04 12:06:09]  Argus Collingwood: you missed Jack’s posh accent and Vryls whine Immy
[2010-11-04 12:06:11]  Arawn Spitteler’s been known to sing out of tune, in text: I’ve a few reasons for avoiding Voice, starting with the alienation of the aliens
[2010-11-04 12:06:22]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Ah… Corny accents indeed. (^_^)
[2010-11-04 12:06:26]  Carla Collazo: will be griefer tool, this chocolate
[2010-11-04 12:06:27]  Seattle LeShelle: yup bacon dark chocolate bar who knew
[2010-11-04 12:06:31]  Qie Niangao: thing is, Vryl would be better off if they *did* just close Marketplace. I mean, how many sims can be called “Textures” ?
[2010-11-04 12:06:34]  Trouble Streeter: i’m off, transcript will be up at the Regent Estates website asap
[2010-11-04 12:06:43]  Teleport completed from http://slurl.com/secondlife/Linden%20Estate%20Services/154/112/39

I was late for the first 7 minutes, thank you Rene for keeping me updated

[10:58]  Ziki Questi: hello jack

[10:58]  Master Kane: I hope you got steal on Jack

[10:58]  Driftwood Miles: Hi there Jack

[10:59]  Alexxa Despres: Hello Jack

[10:59]  Alexxa Despres: (en->it) Ciao Jack;)

[10:59]  Dahlea Milena: Hey Jack

[10:59]  Jean Swashbuckler: hiya Jack

[10:59]  Driftwood Miles: Hi everyone :0

[10:59]  Master Kane: Maybe he crashes lol

[10:59]  Master Kane: oh

[10:59]  Jack Linden: hey folks!

[10:59]  Darrius Gothly: Hello Jack.

[10:59]  Jack Linden: let me just wait for things to rez in

[10:59]  Darrius Gothly: Howdy all ..

[10:59]  Master Kane: monring sicky

[11:00]  Nema Galicia: made it in time whew

[11:00]  Master Kane: yep

[11:00]  Master Kane: was watcing for ya to come on line

[11:00]  Nema Galicia: t-y

[11:00]  Master Kane: yw

[11:00]  Master Kane: Hi Seattle

[11:00]  Seattle LeShelle: hi master:) hi everyone:)

[11:01]  Alexxa Despres: Hi Seattle

[11:01]  Jack Linden: okays, hello everyone.. hope you all had an awesome week.

[11:01]  Master Kane: let’em have it people

[11:01]  Rene Erlanger: JACK – Would you say, you more than any other LL employee understands the composition of Mainland? That you also understand that a great percentage of parcels are held by small land owners on Mainland? Yet here you are heading up a Dept that presides over the Search Engine functionality. and allowing your team to introduce a “Parcel Size bias” (or multiplier) that handicaps virtually every SL business under a certain parcel size. (our current tests indicate somewhere between 45k -50 k sqm as a minimum). You cannot deny our findings!

[11:02]  Jack Linden: Hi Rene!

[11:02]  Rene Erlanger: hi…but extremely angry!

[11:02]  Nema Galicia: opps well I gotta say I had to call LL for help and I actually got it so I am pleased there,and I dont know what you all did on the rollout but my sim has never ran better t-y

[11:02]  Master Kane: is that the answer jack? “Hi Rene”

[11:03]  Darrius Gothly: I’ll ask the same thing .. but from a different direction. What is the motivation for the Parcel Size bias?

[11:03]  Ann Otoole: yea. pretty much it seems LL wants small businesses out. you either pay for a full sim or may as well commence shut down.

[11:03]  Moon Corrigible: Wow that will really hurt Nautilus land prices where you cant join parcels

[11:03]  Master Kane: I think we are all angry atm and ready to pull at a drop

[11:04]  Rene Erlanger: JACK -HOW ARE YOU GOING TO BREAK THE NEWS to all the “Small & Medium sized Business owners” that they’re being handicapped from the Search system due to their Land Size? You know those same 1000′s upon 1000′s of SL’ers that bought LL land in good faith over the years, to start up their “Virtual World” dreams. As it stands this LL manipulation of what is meant to be a fair sytem for all………is an epic scandal nearly bordering on your “Open Sim Pricing fiasco” which you also happened to preside over. LL’s only blessing to date…..it’s not widely known YET!…….but it has far more implications than even those Open SIM tier hikes, as it hits a much wider audience.

[11:04]  Qie Niangao: no, just small land-based businesses. All the landless Marketplace merchants are just fine.

[11:04]  Darrius Gothly: Not pull out … no. But I certainly have shifted my focus to competing grids.

[11:04]  Zoha Boa: HI, everyone. You did start without me already ?

[11:04]  Master Kane: dittoe Darrius

[11:04]  Master Kane: Hi Zoha

[11:04]  Dahlea Milena: (hey Zoha… and how!)

[11:04]  Seattle LeShelle: hi Zoha

[11:04]  Master Kane: just started

[11:04]  Zoha Boa:

[11:05]  Ciaran Laval: Hello Alexxa

[11:05]  Master Kane: Im done talking (wasting my breath) I want answers and SOON!

[11:05]  Jack Linden: So, talking about exactly how we rank search results isn’t something we do – which I think it probably understandable. There are *many* factors that make up how search works. The other point i’d make is that search systems change all the time – they are always evolving.

[11:05]  Jack Linden: The search faq is about as much information as we can give on how search works

[11:05]  Darrius Gothly: Okay .. why was this evoluton taken?

[11:05]  Miles Beck: We want to know WHY, not HOW.

[11:05]  Qie Niangao: Jack, you’re missing the point: LL is shooting itself in the foot again

[11:05]  Alexxa Despres: Hi ya Ciaran

[11:06]  Ciaran Laval: Is this true about larger parcels getting preference because if it is I’ll pull a whole load of show in search places parcels and just bloody well join them up as one big parcel

[11:06]  Seattle LeShelle: so you will not talk about how you rank search? is it a state secret?> do you not think if we better understood the process we would be better to adapt to it?

[11:06]  Darrius Gothly: Let me make sure I heard you correctly Jack. Your official statement is “It is what it is, and we refuse to explain why”? Is tha ta fair summary of your position?

[11:07]  Rene Erlanger: ACK- SIM size parcels never needed a helping hand from LL…..they have the size to adapt to whatever changes LL implement to the Search system. If it favoured small specialised shops ……then there’s nothing to prevent the SIM owner to organise their SIM by parcels cuts…..either by Shops or by Brands or by Departments within their Mega stores…..they would still compete on a level playing field.

Now try the opposite…..if “ALL Search” is being Parcel Size biased as it is now……how can the Small or Medium sized Shop compete? Buy a SIM? Well the only option they have, is to render their Content Listings useless….and mass spam it with duplicate prims to crawl up the rankings thus rendering the eventual listings to the “Consumer” as useless.

Are LL in panic mode? …thereby lending a helping hand in preserving any further losses of Sims ?

[11:07:30]  Jack Linden: Ciaran, as I’ve said – we don’t discuss how search ranks – for obvious reasons.

[11:07:36]  Master Kane: It isnt Jacks fault that he cant talk about it. You have a company that hides its self within itself and pissees on its customers and treats them like nothing. Although we PAY their paychecks and they still piss on us

[11:07:53]  Jack Linden: No search engine provider would talk about the details of how relevance is calculated

[11:08:06]  Darrius Gothly: Jack .. simple answer to my question please. LL’s position is they will not explain the latest change to ranking in search?

[11:08:20]  Ciaran Laval: Jack, it’s a simple yes or no, for goodness sake I’m paying L$30 per parcel, if it’s not going to show up it’s pretty damn unethical to keep charging me

[11:08:22]  Qie Niangao: Yeah, that’s all fine, but there’s blessed little reason to *own* land less than a sim in size now… dump it and move to Marketplace.

[11:08:30]  Jack Linden: If you look at a search for say, textures, the second on the list is a small parcel. So clearly it’s not as straightforward as being ‘based on size’

[11:08:41]  Darrius Gothly: Bull pucky.

[11:08:53]  Darrius Gothly: Sorry Jack .. but your statement is both false and misleadng.

[11:09:02]  Darrius Gothly: You do yourself and your customers a tremendous disservice.

[11:09:04]  Darrius Gothly: I am done here.

[11:09:07]  Darrius Gothly: Good day to you all.

[11:09:22]  Rene Erlanger: jack we have done extensive tests…..a red herring entry, won’t cover up your manipualtion of the Search system

[11:09:23]  Jack Linden: Not meaning to be misleading Darrius, but as I said, I can’t discuss the finer details of how search ranks.

[11:09:34]  Ann Otoole: yea because sea linden put in a manual boost for starship because he sucked up on twitter lol. We know how this stuff works.

[11:09:35]  Ziki Questi: Jack, I would guess that many of us are spending valuable time trying to determine how to improve our search listings, to the point where it’s cutting into our creative productivity.

[11:09:36]  Cinder Roxley: that was quite a flounce. lol

[11:10:00]  Qie Niangao: jeepers. who ever heard of *any* of these texture stores? wtf?

[11:10:20]  Rene Erlanger: JACK – This IMO and of many others too, think this a foolhardy change to the Search system! For starters the majority of Mainland (approx 6000 sims) are occupied my small Land holders ………. many of which are actual SL Businesses (Shops/ Clubs/ Malls/ Galleries etc etc). Potentially LL could lose vast quantities of Tiers & Subscription fees over the next year should this manipulation persist.

The Estate sims do not escape from this botched LL policy (or mistake) either ….as a lot of the largest Estate Barons have 100′s of Commercial Sims (parts of Dreamland, Fantasyland, the Azures, RGF Estates etc etc) which are chopped up into smaller parcels to create Commercial Districts. If those renters leave, because of lack of “Search visibility”…..those Estate Commercial sims will start emptying out too. Then Estates either have to sell off those low-occupancy Sims or hand back to LL (abandon)…or change the model to “Residential only” sims

Whoever is responsible for this latest manipulation of the

[11:10:27]  Master Kane: Lindens have, Qie lol

[11:10:43]  Jack Linden: Ziki, understanding relevance is a part of being successful, no question it’s important. But as with any search provider, we can’t explain the calculations that are used.

[11:11:06]  Qie Niangao: (well, Vryl’s store is on top, of course, thanks to Region name scam)

[11:11:24]  Rene Erlanger: Whoever is responsible for this latest manipulation of the Search Engine by using “Land size” meta tags……..ought to be fired….be it yourself or Sea Linden !!!

[11:11:31]  Master Kane: ooooooh i could ay something on that jack that you will probably ban me for.. but I wont

[11:11:39]  Jack Linden: Rene, i’ll happily pass on your comments to the team.

[11:11:45]  Ziki Questi: Yes, but, for example, my business until 2 days ago was on page #1 (position for “dresses” — and now we are not indexed *at all* for that term, even though that’s what we sell … so it is extremely frustrating

[11:12:12]  Jack Linden: Rene, that isn’t very constructive. Please try to keep this as a reasoned conversation

[11:12:12]  Rene Erlanger: JACK – Why must Linden Lab continue to meddle in the SL economy ?. It should be a free market economy, one that naturally finds it’s own baseline. Market forces are quite capable of distinguishing between good and bad Places, good content & bad content and venues worth visiting and those that should be avoided. If this sort of “Parcel Size” favouritism persists, then i’m afraid that Linden employee responsible ought to resign or better still….be FIRED !!!

What all SL Businesses really need is a stable enviorment to do business in…..and that also includes having a stable “Search System” as that’s the only means of everyone being on a equal footing (in theory as now LL have disproved that with their latest “Parcel size” gimmick)…..this constant of changing the Search parameters each month is unsettling. Merchants spend more time than they need to, in re-optimising for each and every major SEARCH change. It becomes like a new “Lottery” Game each month. When will LL FINALLY stop meddling?

[11:12:25]  Ciaran Laval: I’ve got 40 odd parcels on one sim set to show in search, nearly all small shops, seriously, Jack, if there’s a parcel size bias just tell me and I’ll merge them into one

[11:12:26]  Master Kane: Jack > “understanding relevance is a part of being successful, ” and who knows this ? Linden Labs, or us too? that was a downright slap in out faces telling us that we dont understand shit

[11:13:04]  Master Kane: thanks jack, for treating us like chidlren too

[11:13:42]  Jack Linden: Master, I wasn’t intending that – I think you know that I wasn’t. I was trying to explain that we fully know and expect that residents will want to know as much as possible about how search works.

[11:13:54]  Jack Linden: But that we can’t talk about the detailed ranking system.

[11:14:13]  Miles Beck: Then tell us what the goals were in making these changes.

[11:14:19]  Master Kane: Jack, well.. you never know what and how you lindens mean anyting anymore… with the way you all put things nowdays.. so I assumed

[11:14:57]  Rene Erlanger: Jack- how you going to explain to the 1000′s of SL businesses that due to their Parcle size, they are handicapped? please tell me……….and please tell me what you thingk the reprocussions will be?

[11:15:13]  Jack Linden: Miles, the goals are to make search listings as accurate and meaningful as possible. To do that there are lots of pieces that may be used to deduce how relevant a parcel is

[11:15:46]  Miles Beck: What was inaccurate before that is now more accurate about these results?

[11:15:49]  Rene Erlanger: yes…but you cna’t openly manipualte it the way you have done…thats a farce a total nonsense

[11:15:56]  Dahlea Milena: I should like to see the search engine customizable… so I can include key words & exclude other discriptors so I can narrow down searches…

[11:16:25]  Jack Linden: Rene, we have a huge amount of information that we use to make decisions – if we saw that we were causing a bad skew because of a decision we’d made, we would correct for that. As i said, search will be constantly evolving.

[11:16:26]  Rene Erlanger: there is undoubtedly some adavtange for parcels in excess of 45k or 50k sqm upwards

[11:16:39]  Driftwood Miles: Jack, can you give us any feedback on the rampant white noise that Linden Lab has placed Second Life into “maintenance mode” or even worse – is winding it up?

[11:16:47]  Master Kane: Oh, you also still getting BDSM and sex places when you search for trees too , huh Dahlea? lol

[11:17:05]  Marianne McCann: I sell retro toys. It’s a very niche market. When I search for retro toys, I’m #3. But the first is the “Free BDSM Sex Club.” at Sexy Sands. The #4 is Club Bloody Sabbath BDSM and Casino.” I doubt their retro toy stores

[11:17:16]  Marianne McCann: they’re*

[11:17:23]  Dahlea Milena: lol, yea… which is fine for the days I want to find those things… but I’m not always looking for “booty call” lol

[11:17:29]  Master Kane: lol

[11:17:37]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, that’s absolutely untrue. Our velocity right now and the speed of development is increasing month on month. Release cycles are coming down, we’re shipping more etc.

[11:17:42]  Master Kane: well there goes my chance then.. dangit

[11:17:44]  Ciaran Laval: Ok so I’ll just merge my parcels then, save on show in search fees, maybe run a classified, all seems a tad silly to have to do this when it’s easier to be more descriptive per parcel but if it’s getting nerfed due to size there’s no point in showing them

[11:17:59]  Jack Linden: I’d say we’re ramping up more than winding down. We’re a very solid business.

[11:18:31]  Driftwood Miles: Thats the strongest piece of reassurance we have had from the lab in some time Jack and I appreciate it. It would however be very productive to hear a bit more !

[11:18:59]  Master Kane: I think the best thing to do here people, is to try and think like Linden does and try and beat them at what comes next. Like Claran, merge them and go from there.. see a difference later, try something different.. sigh shrgs

[11:19:21]  Master Kane: and who is that “solid” busniess getting sold to

[11:19:25]  Cinder Roxley: i would really like it if search helped me, one of my places has the word cantina in the name, in search it doesn’t show up at all, six others do, 4 for the same place, in old search it’s the top result. i really can’t be arsed to try to manage to get in there i have no idea how all that SEO stuff works,

[11:19:53]  Marianne McCann: I’d really rather not have to make drastic changes like that all the time, though, ya know? I’m all for rolling with punches, but being in constant flux takes its toll

[11:20:00]  Rene Erlanger: Jack…why have you & your Search team decided to penalise small to Medium size businesses in the Search engine

[11:20:10]  Rene Erlanger: what was the rationale?

[11:20:32]  Jack Linden: Drift.. we’re pushing hard to, for example, get into a rapid release cycle for web and viewer changes – I expect you to see v2.3, 2.4 and so on follow on fairly quickly, and for us to provide more info and project viewers etc to get feedback early

[11:20:47]  Miles Beck: Jack, are the results Marianne mentioned above indicative of greater accuracy in the search results?

[11:20:55]  Ciaran Laval: Exactly Mari, it’s a pain having to constantly try and second guess what the search team are upto, the idea of search is to help people find things, not for merchants or place owners to have to play a guessing game

[11:21:01]  Driftwood Miles: Sounds good….and Mesh is awesome as well!

[11:21:07]  Drongle McMahon: Rene. Surely the smallerr businesses take more management and support.

[11:21:13]  Master Kane: feedback? Jack? do you all read that stuff, or ignore it too?

[11:21:25]  Jack Linden: We hit our dates for both Marketplace and Mesh open beta, so we’re really improving each release now. Viewer 2 stability and FPS stats are also pretty strong

[11:21:36]  Cinder Roxley: jack, will those release cycles be similar to the way the sim release process is handled now?

[11:21:53]  Jack Linden: Miles, we’re certainly not done yet with improving search. Hence me saying that it will keep evolving at a rapid rate

[11:22:10]  Jean Swashbuckler agrees on the recent server release our sims are operating much better fps and dilation throughout the day

[11:22:27]  Marianne McCann: Would it them be wisests, Jack, to not do anything at all to improve search rankings until the search folks have it down?

[11:22:28]  Rene Erlanger: Jack -are we heading to Walmart style SIM Businesses instead within SL? Should the small fries pack and leave?

[11:22:31]  Master Kane: Oh like back in 2007 where people asked and partitioned LL to add more groups BACK then and NOW they say more will be added.. but yet again, you say people want display names too.. just which one of those are OLDER than the other

[11:23:09]  Jack Linden: Master, I think you’d be amazed at how much I read.. pretty much every single comment on the blog posts is read. If you ask for feedback, it doesn’t make sense to then not read it. We got some great constructive stuff for Mesh already

[11:23:35]  Jack Linden: Cinder, somewhat yeah. Importantly they will be more predictable and timely.

[11:23:42]  Cinder Roxley: great.

[11:24:08]  Rene Erlanger: – I wnat the OH minutes on record on Melody’s website……so its there for all to read, how LL manipulative have become.

[11:24:28]  Marianne McCann: Much unlike a certain Linden who admitted on the JIRA that he files Resident emails to trash…

[11:24:30]  Ann Otoole: I have a more serious question Jack. How stable is Linden Lab. Everything points to you closing or selling out, Most everyone I know feels like we are just waiting to be terminated when SL is closed. We will lose everything we invested since anything licensed cannot be exported. So is LL planning to close or stay open?

[11:24:41]  Jack Linden: Marianne, good Q. Our feeling is that it’s better to iterate with many small changes than to hold off and then bring large change in – because then we can understand the impact of each thing we alter.

[11:24:49]  Melody Regent waves and gives the URL – http://regentestatessl.com/wordpress/?cat=6

[11:24:56]  Master Kane: I ll send them to ya rene if you need them

[11:25:02]  Master Kane: or mels here nvm

[11:25:31]  Jack Linden: Ann, we are very stable.

[11:26:03]  Master Kane: I agree, Ann.. all this “upgrading” and adding things that needed to be added several years ago, makes me think that there is a business ready to take over and or buy LL out and LL just has to get up to snuff

[11:26:22]  Dahlea Milena: so Jack, the rumors about say.. Microsoft for example??? any comment?

[11:27:04]  Jack Linden: Master, we talked at SLCC and earlier about our aim to address the core issues. There is nothing prompting that work other than our goal of fixing long term issues

[11:27:06]  Marianne McCann: I think there’s a lot of concern out there about that. Many are very nervous about the future. Selling out, Phils re-leaving, etc has a lot of people feeling very unsure of the platform, and I think that hurts everyone’s bottom line, really.

[11:27:08]  Rene Erlanger: All SL Busineeses small to medium size……ought to know what stunt the Search Dev team have pulled…..in monetary terms, could even be worst than Open Sim pricing fiasco

[11:27:28]  Jack Linden: Dahlea, we don’t comment on rumours I’m afraid.

[11:27:33]  Master Kane: Jack > Yes.. and all the promises Phil made too.. shall I find the Video link?! and remind you

[11:27:36]  Driftwood Miles: Perhaps a statement on the Blogs from LL would allay a lot of fears and destructive rumours

[11:28:04]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Driftwood. Well, I think there have been some statements. But I dunno. Something different.

[11:28:16]  Jack Linden: Marianne, Philip was very clear that he had come back as interim CEO. We’ve made big changes internally and are in a much better place now to succeed.

[11:28:19]  Melody Regent: ok Jack, I hope you are sitting down IRL. But the last upgrade, for a few of my people, seems to have helped. I have had more than one person comment to me that the last server upgrade helped overall. SL is still laggy but seems a little better with the land server maintenance. So, thank your people for that. If you can keep THAT kind of momentum going, we may find Rainbows and Unicorns in the year 1212, just in time for the world to end.

[11:28:34]  Marianne McCann: I think about FJs recent post, which was totally the way to do it. That made me a fan of him.

[11:28:39]  Driftwood Miles: define success for the Lab

[11:28:42]  Jack Linden: Master, we take those promises seriously. It was the company making them, not Philip

[11:28:42]  Melody Regent: ((YEs, that was a thank you and a compliment… of sorts)

[11:28:46]  davis Xaris gave you Horse pricing Guide suggestions   10-2-10.

[11:29:07]  Cinder Roxley: i think that’s part of the confusion, the more rapid change happening since slcc.

[11:29:08]  Master Kane: Ues Jack. I know this…

[11:29:12]  Master Kane: Yes*

[11:29:22]  Alexxa Despres: No..Ia m fine

[11:29:34]  Jack Linden: Melody, providing you with Rainbows and Unicorns might have to be my new years resolution. I rather like that.

[11:29:56]  Marianne McCann: Hey, some are still waiting for their mule.

[11:29:58]  Jack Linden: Marianne, agreed FJ’s post was awesome.

[11:30:16]  Master Kane: WHats to say that with him gone now, that LL wont go through with those promises and just drop them like a hot potato? with him being gone.. and NOT informed until after the fact, oh, say like, before

[11:30:25]  Melody Regent makes a note

[11:30:39]  Jean Swashbuckler: Jack, and FJ’s post should be the model

[11:30:55]  Marianne McCann: that FJ said “we’ll try” was a breath of fresh air from previous statements on group limits. I like “we’ll try this” It’s far better than “accept constraints.”

[11:30:58]  Jean Swashbuckler: not spin and redirection

[11:31:12]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Mari

[11:31:22]  Jack Linden: Jean, couldn’t agree more. We have to be as real as we can be when we talk.

[11:31:39]  Jack Linden: We are pushing hard to improve our comms

[11:31:50]  Master Kane: They got to get newer server code in order for all these “tinker toys” to work with what they have now.. thats my idea.. mhm yep!

[11:31:50]  Marianne McCann: We’re in a world where we can fly. Where we build with our minds. It’s remarkably hard to accept constraints with that sort of freedom

[11:31:51]  Marianne McCann winks

[11:32:16]  Jack Linden: So, how many of you have tried Mesh?

[11:32:21]  Marianne McCann raises hand

[11:32:22]  Master Kane: cough

[11:32:24]  Jack Linden: Any feedback or comments?

[11:32:28]  Melody Regent: my husband has been there

[11:32:32]  Master Kane: Jack.. I have an idea

[11:32:36]  Melody Regent: he liks it, he shows me picutres

[11:32:47]  Driftwood Miles: Its impressive for a Beta.

[11:32:50]  Marianne McCann: Still tends to crash me form time to time, but I love it. It’s what sculpts shoulda been

[11:32:51]  Master Kane: why dont you BLOG it and let us feedback on that, so that LL and us have solid comments

[11:32:52]  Jean Swashbuckler: I’ve been over to look several times but not loaded anyting yet..want to get to that stage though

[11:32:55]  Melody Regent doesnt go there, it means change

[11:33:03]  Melody Regent doesnt do well with change

[11:33:10]  Ann Otoole: i enjoy flying my warbird around the mesh sims. but all those gigantic models in the sky need to go unless you want them there causing crashes because of the forest of bounding boxes lol.

[11:33:18]  Master Kane: YOU personally, not the mention of it already there

[11:33:22]  Chaley May: I have returned to see what mesh is like.. havent been in SL for a while

[11:33:22]  Driftwood Miles: would love some better guidlines on file sizes

[11:33:27]  Jack Linden: Melody.. it’ll be good.. you should go take a look at least

[11:33:32]  AnnMarie Otoole: How about upgraded servers for Info Hubs so noobies don’t think all of SL is lag handicapped.

[11:33:42]  Melody Regent: I am looking…. at pictures

[11:33:44]  Jack Linden: Drift, yeah.. we’ve been talking a lot about how we give guidelines for LODs etc too

[11:33:54]  Drongle McMahon: There is an opportunity to not allow megaprim meshes.

[11:34:00]  Ann Otoole: and the devs need to ask people to get busy scripting stuff so they can see what happens with the physics. mesh won’t all be statues

[11:34:02]  Cinder Roxley: i would prefer something i can toy with and manipulate and build inworld. do you think sl will ever be at that point? an inworld tool for meshes?

[11:34:02]  Marianne McCann: I’m also very excited by the lighting and shadow code int he mesh project viewer – though sad that it is not an option for my particular card, apparetely

[11:34:04]  Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets

[11:34:09]  Driftwood Miles: even a rough guide which is subject to change is a good starting point

[11:34:38]  Marianne McCann: Please please consider the 64m size limit with mesh. 10m really does become a big constraint

[11:34:45]  Jack Linden: Cinder, I think it’s quite possible that there will be inworld tools to manipulate Meshes, but whether that is something we build or a third party developer provides – not sure.

[11:34:52]  Cinder Roxley:

[11:35:11]  Qie Niangao: Mari, Projected Texture lighting is very, very cool.

[11:35:14]  Cinder Roxley: well i think it’s fun to come inworld and create rather than import and upload.

[11:35:17]  Cinder Roxley: but that’s just me.

[11:35:19]  Driftwood Miles: Import facility for material files would be good

[11:35:20]  BizTutor Magic: Hi, all. Sorry I’m late.

[11:35:25]  Jack Linden: Marianne, it should be 64m already on the beta

[11:35:27]  Master Kane: rub it on Qie lol

[11:35:36]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Qie. A friend showed it to me on their Nvisia mac, but my ATUI mac gets no love

[11:35:49]  Marianne McCann: It is Jack. I hope that does come to Agni

[11:35:51]  Nameless Moonshadow: would it be possible to consider the 64 meter for regular prims on this gird?

[11:35:54]  Marianne McCann: ATI*

[11:35:56]  Jack Linden: Drift, materials would be great

[11:36:00]  BizTutor Magic: I want to ask a question when it’s ok to do so.

[11:36:06]  Ann Otoole: you can stretch to 64m. but models made with the scale set wrong create gigantic models that are next to impossible to delete.

[11:36:13]  Marianne McCann: Jump into the fray, BizTutor

[11:36:40]  Master Kane: Jack > Doesnt mesh allow those that know blender, maya and such to make more of a profit from those that dont know those programs? Isnt that sort of like favortism?

[11:36:45]  Melody Regent: Jack, I am going to go back to a VERY VERY old problem and would very much like to know exactly what is REALLY being done about this. It is an ongoing issue that creates additional problems for us and you and frankly I am tired of it. What is actively being done to handle the Estate Ban issue and people able to get past these bans on a constant basis.

[11:36:47]  Ann Otoole: needs to be a size check on proposed imports imho

[11:36:48]  Jack Linden: Marianne, we’ve wanted to increase max prim size for a long while. It can really make the existing builds more efficient

[11:37:10]  Fat’s Jazz: Low script memory.  Visitor list reset.

[11:37:23]  Master Kane: Shouldnt this be across the board for everyone, or does LL plan on implementing some sort of tools for others to use?!

[11:37:32]  BizTutor Magic: Jack, the question is, “why in the name of all that’s holy is SL shutting down SLex (now, properly, SLMEx)?

[11:37:46]  Marianne McCann: I agree. While I’ve not needed overly large prims I know many of my existing builds would be less prim heavy with just a bit more than the existing limit

[11:38:00]  Master Kane: Dont think this was another thought out process ….. just saying

[11:38:01]  Driftwood Miles: Isn’t Blender free?

[11:38:06]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Mari

[11:38:07]  Master Kane: yes belender is free

[11:38:14]  Nameless Moonshadow: yes blender is free

[11:38:17]  Jack Linden: Master, I think it requires additional skills but I also expect that as with sculpts, we’ll see a secondary market of component pieces so that residents without those skills can plug pieces of mesh content together to make awesome stuff

[11:38:23]  Marianne McCann: Free… but requires a sanity check to use

[11:38:24]  Master Kane: that isnt the point Drift

[11:38:28]  Jack Linden: Like all the sculpy cushions etc

[11:38:32]  Master Kane: excatly Mari

[11:38:47]  Driftwood Miles: photoshop isn’t an inworld tool

[11:39:00]  Ann Otoole: there isn’t any support for current versions of 3ds max so those of us learning commercially viable tools are screwed. all SL has in it are open source hobbyists and most of them don’t want to help much either so they can keep all the assumed impending wealth for themselves. which is understandable. But LL needs to put some effort into the tutorials for all tools.

[11:39:19]  Drongle McMahon: Marriane, I must be insane then.

[11:39:26]  Jack Linden: Melody – I’m not sure, i’d need to go hunt that one out. I expect it lives with our platform team.

[11:39:30]  Master Kane: Jack > thats what I meant.. some sort of INWOLRD tool OFFERED BY LL for those to LEARN how to work meshes… come on… man…

[11:39:36]  BizTutor Magic: IMHO, if the LindEx is the only game in town, you’ll lose a lot of landowners who’ve used SLEx for years to keep their land expenses within reason with periodic cashouts.

[11:39:42]  Marianne McCann: Drongle – I have my bouts of insanty as well.

[11:40:03]  Cinder Roxley: biztutor there are other exchanges too.

[11:40:07]  Melody Regent: this is an isse that is ongoing for a long time and has a very detailed and active Jira. I will let you ask around and react the QQ next week or two

[11:40:15]  Master Kane: We have the EDIT window. So why not some sort of tool for Meshes.. thats your baby jack

[11:40:18]  Master Kane: pushit lol

[11:40:23]  Jack Linden: Ann, I’d love to see us showcase good resident guides too. We’ve some crazy talented folks using mesh on the beta grid

[11:40:27]  Zoha Boa: /Me never used SLEX..WAY to expensive (bad rates)

[11:40:33]  Ann Otoole: how about the link in build has an option to cull unseen vertexes. then guess what? you are building mesh in world lol.

[11:40:43]  Cinder Roxley: melody, you would want to ask at andrew’s office hour. i believe bluesteel is the rc channel handling the fix for it.

[11:40:48]  BizTutor Magic: Not sanctioned by LL there aren’t. And that’s all I ever intend to use. One of the happiest of my days in SL was the day I read that LL had bought XStreet.

[11:40:59]  Jack Linden: Master, agreed it would be great to have even simple Mesh tools in the Viewer.

[11:41:13]  Qie Niangao: (whatever anybody says about external Mesh tools, the first virtual world with a viable in-world Mesh editor takes all the chips, and everybody else closes down.)

[11:41:17]  Master Kane: Jack > Yes it would and I bet youll “sell” on taht fact alone

[11:41:24]  Joshua: LandMark giver at Joshua (Joshua Full HS – $8,000/week) has just been used by Ais Button !

[11:41:30]  BizTutor Magic: ‘Cause using a 3rd party money exchange frightened the hell out of me – and it was the only one I knew during my first 30 days of SL. LOL

[11:41:38]  Jack Linden: Ann, hehe good point

[11:41:42]  Marianne McCann: Qie – I think you ay be somewhat right there

[11:42:07]  BizTutor Magic: Qie: Bunk and nonsense.

[11:42:07]  Jack Linden: Qie, i like the idea of chips.

[11:42:10]  Marianne McCann: BIz – you coulda been like me and invested some of those early, hard-earned Lindens in a fine Ginko account

[11:42:13]  Marianne McCann winces

[11:42:25]  Master Kane: dam.. was I just ignored?!

[11:42:28]  Master Kane: lol

[11:42:37]  BizTutor Magic: The only one I’ve seen out there even working on it is Blue Mars.

[11:42:41]  Qie Niangao: seriously, if OpenSim exposed messaging for TPVs to do in-world mesh editing, it’s game-over.

[11:43:31]  Cinder Roxley: lol marianne.

[11:43:47]  BizTutor Magic: Qie: You do know what OpenSim is, right? It’s a collection of minigrids. Do you think a rural town’s population can outproduce that of a major metropolis? If so, think again.

[11:43:58]  Marianne McCann: Jack – kudos also for another great project from the LDPW. Sea of Fabels are great. I hopew we’ll see some more good stuff form them in the coming months

[11:44:06]  Jack Linden: How are you guys getting on with the new Marketplace now?

[11:44:08]  Master Kane: Qie.. thats excatly what I meant by “Sell” on that fact alone.. 1) draws people into SL, 2) Not any other VWs have mesh that I know of and been to, 3) Everybody has the option,. not just a few

[11:44:18]  BizTutor Magic: Those who thought that in the Civil War lost in a battle of attrition.

[11:44:50]  Cinder Roxley: i’m loving marketplace. i updated all my listings, and as soon as xstreet closed, my sales exploded.

[11:44:54]  Marianne McCann: Pretty okay on the marketplace. Still find some of the merchant interface to be a bit challenged.

[11:44:58]  Qie Niangao: Biz, disruption happens at the vulnerable points.

[11:45:00]  BizTutor Magic: I still have no use for it when the goods are available inworld, Jack. LOL

[11:45:02]  Melody Regent: abt the exchange Jack. The webpage defaults to the sell at the highest rate. While that is good for you all, and I know that asking you to change it is a customer service request, likely to be denied in favor of money but…. here goes. Since the page defaults to the highest ‘sell’ rate but you CAN go to advanced and choose the rate you want to sell at, most residents do not know they can dictate the sell rate. I educate people weekly on this. Some of them LONG time residents that never knew (They are not button pushers like I am). If you made the advance the default, it would not only be good for residents over all but may encourage more market playing. I have people actually using the Xchange that didnt before, they went to 3rd parties.

[11:45:10]  Master Kane: I hate it.. brings back bad memories of onrez jack

[11:45:12]  Jack Linden: Cinder, that’s awesome!

[11:45:22]  Marianne McCann: Sales have been good. I think it (and search) are stealing sales from my inworld store.

[11:45:27]  Jack Linden: BizTutor, fair enough!

[11:45:58]  Cinder Roxley: oh it is, i focused entirely on updating everything, using it all, making pdfs as begrudingly as i had to. but i did it and it paid off.

[11:46:03]  BizTutor Magic: I moved everything over to the LindEx already.

[11:46:05]  Jack Linden: Melody, that’s good feedback. I’ll have that conversation

[11:46:13]  Melody Regent: Jack, about the market place? When will the step children get a better system in place for us?

[11:46:16]  Jack Linden: Master, why do you hate it?

[11:46:29]  Master Kane: lolol mel

[11:46:44]  BizTutor Magic: I don’t want my money trapped within SLEx when it shuts down.

[11:46:45]  Jack Linden: Melody, step children?

[11:46:54]  Melody Regent: LAND Jack

[11:46:55]  Melody Regent: LAND

[11:47:12]  Master Kane: looks way to much like onrez jack and I was used to SLX and how it worked.. I cant find nothing now and even with searching brings up shit that I dont want to see

[11:47:41]  Jack Linden: Ahhh. I don’t have specifics, but it’s on the roadmap to do land properly in the Marketplace. We have some of the component pieces already but still lots to do.

[11:47:49]  Marianne McCann preferred OnRez

[11:47:52]  Cinder Roxley: master, i’ll agree with you on that. i can’t shop on marketplace, but it brings in L$.

[11:47:56]  BizTutor Magic: Oh, Jack…I said this to Grant, and I’m saying it to you. LL’s got to stop competing against its own residents.

[11:47:56]  Melody Regent: Proposed ETA?

[11:48:10]  Seattle LeShelle: i have heard its been on the roapmap for a while now jack. any specific time table you wish to share?

[11:48:14]  Cinder Roxley: i did a search on kitchen and saw some vore things i wished i hadn’t!

[11:48:15]  Cinder Roxley: lol

[11:48:18]  Master Kane: Have to excuse me. I am a little pissed with ontynes.. speaking of which JACK…. Liam Ontyne and Metta.. need to be offered a Job with Linden Labs when they shut down the Onytnes

[11:48:33]  Marianne McCann: I also wish that gifting n the Marketplace was not something so difficult that it requires its own tutorial…

[11:48:33]  Rene Erlanger: Theres enought threas on Market place on the Commerce Forums Jack…….thats’ where you should do your research from…..regarding any complaints or improvements required

[11:48:37]  Ziki Questi: jack, i find it more difficult to search on the marketplace, especially for things like textures

[11:48:44]  BizTutor Magic: That applies as to land, product sales, and services.

[11:48:49]  Master Kane: those two are the best of them all imho

[11:48:53]  Jack Linden: Melody, I don’t have one. It will depend on many other factors such as the remaining pieces we want to add to Marketplace.

[11:48:59]  Master Kane: they LISTEN! and get things done

[11:49:04]  Melody Regent: Master, do not offer an Ontyne the job, bring back some of our adored Lindens

[11:49:14]  Jack Linden: Master, yeah? You’ve had good support from them then?

[11:49:17]  BizTutor Magic: Because if they don’t, LL will win the battle of breaking its residents’ commercial backs, and lose the war when they all leave.

[11:49:37]  Ziki Questi: jack, what’s the rollout for the “remaining pieces” of the marketplace?

[11:49:40]  Master Kane: I saying these two actually listened and didnt ask “and your question is” over and over and they never once hung up on me on phone of live chat

[11:49:40]  Cinder Roxley: i’ve had good support from liam too.

[11:49:44]  Master Kane: like the other dipshits

[11:49:47]  Jack Linden: Rene, yeah I’ve read a lot of that feedback – was just curious to get views here too

[11:49:47]  Marianne McCann: Do me, I still do have concerns that Marketplace negatively impacts the need to hae land inworld, let alone a store presence. Maybe I’m wrong on that…

[11:50:00]  Marianne McCann: To* me.

[11:50:31]  Qie Niangao: Ideally, in-world objects could be listed for free, no commission, on Marketplace

[11:50:34]  Joshe Darkstone: hi jack, dont know if youve gone over this, on the new marketplace i found a sculpt pack offered at $L 14500, the usd value said it was $85 – but when i look at the value of $L 14500 inworld its $55 to buy the lindens, thats a 54% markup, whats the explanation for the fees?

[11:50:44]  BizTutor Magic: My RL wife got Ruthed last night, and was able to resolve the issue with excellent help from 2 Customer Support people.

[11:50:45]  Master Kane: Who was told to call back in 9 hours the other day? some ontyne told a customer to call back in 9 hours when the dam support was off.. geessssssssh

[11:50:53]  Ann Otoole: well yes and when there are no more magic boxes there will be no further need for any land. so i guess LL could ban sandboxes.

[11:51:00]  Jack Linden: marianne, we haven’t seen that and we watch the data very closely. In fact, a lot of folks bounce from marketplace inworld to check out the merchant’s store

[11:51:03]  Ziki Questi: we still need the ability to have more than one store (brand) per merchant and for assistants

[11:51:25]  BizTutor Magic: If you’d like to IM Sunni Emerald about it so you know who to pat on the back for that (she knows the names, I believe), feel free.

[11:51:28]  Marianne McCann: That’s a good thing, then

[11:51:32]  Master Kane: Hey Joshe… no offense yesterday. I was just teasing with ya )

[11:51:42]  Cinder Roxley: i use marketplace to find stores when search is useless. XD

[11:51:48]  Cinder Roxley: and tp in

[11:51:54]  Jack Linden: Ziki, yeah that would be a good feature add

[11:52:05]  Rene Erlanger: Marianne….if your parcel is under 50000 sqm you won’t neeed land In SL……..the Search Dev team under Jack’s stewardship has taken care of all that for you. No need for SL Land or premium subscriptions ….unless resdential

[11:52:12]  Ziki Questi: lol jack you say that every time someone mentions it

[11:52:12]  Marianne McCann: Cinder – so given some of the rest of the discussion here, you use marketplace to find stores all the time?

[11:52:16]  BizTutor Magic: 1.23′s “all” search has always been all I’ve ever needed to find anything.

[11:52:29]  Joshe Darkstone: i can tell you for a fact that thats not happening in large numbers, since the marketplace/xstreet, even with increased placement in search, traffic to inworld stores is off by droves.

[11:52:35]  Cinder Roxley: no not all the time.

[11:52:37]  Dahlea Milena: I am getting tired of looking for something in search… or in someone’s picks… only to find that it was once listed on xstreet.. didn’t migrate to the new marketplace… and search shows it at a location… that no longer exists… but it’s still coming up in search at an old location . . . if a parcel or region is no longer valid… why are resources still committing to it in search. How long does it take for search to update thse kind of changes?

[11:52:43]  Joshe Darkstone: i would call it a 400% drop

[11:52:46]  Jean Swashbuckler: Mari, I disagree a little, we do a lot of searching in marketplace but we don’t buy until we see it in world and kick the tires..and we still might buy on marketplace just to do the ratings

[11:52:49]  Jack Linden: Ziki, well it is a good feature! better tools for merchants is always a win

[11:53:08]  Ziki Questi: but are there plans to implement those features?

[11:53:09]  Nameless Moonshadow: I’m with you Cinder … sont like the commissions to LL as I already pay them to play.

[11:53:11]  BizTutor Magic: Joshe: 400% drop in what?

[11:53:12]  Marianne McCann: Fair enough Jean. I can understand about tire kicking, ya

[11:53:47]  Joshe Darkstone: drop in traffic to inworld stores since xstreets mergence under LL

[11:53:49]  Jean Swashbuckler: best examples are the luxury yachts and billiards tables we have been buying lol

[11:53:53]  Marianne McCann: Rene – given one of my parcels is a scant 144m in size, I can relate…

[11:53:59]  Dahlea Milena: I’m with Jean on that.. I like to look at something before buying too

[11:54:06]  Jack Linden: Ziki, we have those ideas on the backlog yeah – but when and if we get them built, I’m not yet sure.

[11:54:16]  Joshe Darkstone: hi jack, dont know if youve gone over this, on the new marketplace i found a sculpt pack offered at $L 14500, the usd value said it was $85 – but when i look at the value of $L 14500 inworld its $55 to buy the lindens, thats a 54% markup, whats the explanation for the fees?

[11:54:33]  Ann Otoole: the issue i am having with slm is stuff being relisted to make it new for the sort order. i have stopped looking for new building components. all the old stuff is listed as new and no new stuff is appearing.

[11:54:40]  BizTutor Magic: I know why I don’t buy much in the way of goods anymore. After about a year, I had everything I needed. Including leftover equipment from a defunct gaming site.

[11:54:40]  Ciaran Laval: Some things are better suited to the marketplace than others, buildings, yachts, etc. are better suited inworld

[11:54:49]  Jack Linden: Joshe, there really shouldn’t be a markup that high. Can you send me the url to that example?

[11:55:09]  Joshe Darkstone: sure, give me a sec

[11:55:15]  Master Kane: Joshe, thats the overhead cost markup lol

[11:55:32]  BizTutor Magic: Oh, Jack…one other thing – Could you do what you can to make sure residents know two things: 1. Camping was NEVER made entirely illegal, and 2. It’s regulated only to control camping fraud?

[11:55:35]  Master Kane: ya know.. all the coffee and donuts that they have to eat while posting it lol

[11:55:43]  Nameless Moonshadow: That is why I will avoid the marketplace if possible

[11:56:35]  Dahlea Milena had noticed a $4.00 usd price difference between an item marketed on Xstreet & the same item on SLM… while the L$ price remained unchanged… ended up finding item in world & buying it at the L$ price … which means LL lost their commission… didn’t someone think we might notice that sort of markup?

[11:56:38]  BizTutor Magic: Sooooooo many residents still think it’s 100% outlawed. I know for a fact it wasn’t, ’cause my camping at my gaming place was examined by LL personnel THREE TIMES, and I was allowed to keep it around all 3 times.

[11:56:38]  Jack Linden: BizTutor – are you seeing a lot of confusion around that? I thought we had a pretty clear wikipage on camping

[11:57:12]  You decline DJ Schedule  – MotorWorld Party from A group member named Melody Regent.

[11:57:26]  Joshe Darkstone: and jack is this change to parcel releveance permanent? there used to be a value on old parcels, now its just big parcels, kills the mall market, kills the small business, but if im going to reparcel all my store islands then i will lose my old parcels in the process, then next month when you change your mind again, ill have big parcels instead of old parcels, when are you guys going to stop fiddling?

[11:57:55]  Ann Otoole: traffic doesn’t do much anymore.all i find are bots running gestures on timers when i see green dot clusters on mainland these days. lol. most of the tuime.

[11:58:02]  BizTutor Magic: I’m still hearing about how it’s outlawed. Given that Ralphie Saeed and I pretty well fired the first shot to get $48,000+ annually back to LL from the fraudsters, I watched it very carefully, and would probably know better than anyone except you or Ralphie about it.

[11:58:19]  Cinder Roxley: indeed, ann.

[11:58:35]  Ann Otoole: it is all about green dots on the map now.

[11:58:40]  Liisa Runo: we also have clear wiki page about advertising, but still i see hovering spinning “land for sale” signs all over, along with banlines to boost the sale

[11:58:45]  Jack Linden: Joshe, in a sense any pieces of something like search are prone to change because we will alter and tune the rankings all the time

[11:59:04]  BizTutor Magic: Legit residential camping is one thing. Ripping off camping providers and cashing out at LL expense is another.

[11:59:24]  Jack Linden: ack, i’m out of time I’m afraid. I have to zip to my next meeting.

[11:59:28]  Ciaran Laval: Camping is banned on any parcels set to show in search

[11:59:31]  Jack Linden: thank you all for coming along this week

[11:59:37]  Qie Niangao: Thanks Jack

[11:59:38]  Drongle McMahon: Jack. Are mainland support tickets redirected to trash?

[11:59:38]  Cinder Roxley: have a nice meeting.

[11:59:40]  Master Kane: thanks jack

[11:59:41]  Marianne McCann: Have fun, Jack

[11:59:45]  Marielle Caerndow: Thanks

[11:59:45]  Ciaran Laval: Cheers Jack

[11:59:47]  BizTutor Magic: Jack, can we continue these thoughts by IM, please?

[11:59:47]  Dahlea Milena: so long Jack

[11:59:49]  Marianne McCann: See ya’ll!

[11:59:49]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!

[11:59:52]  Nameless Moonshadow: but the search has taken a dive for the worst … pleeeaaassseee fix the land search

[11:59:53]  Jack Linden: take care all.. have a great weekend!

[11:59:56]  BizTutor Magic: When you have time?

[12:00:02]  Cinder Roxley: take care everyone.

[12:00:06]  Rene Erlanger: JACK – since traffic has been relegated and has little impact on All serach rankings….and the Places Search tab effectively hidden in viewer 2.0 and without traffic units……..why not allow Avatar camping once more……at least Noobs have a way of earning some inword money and sepnding it back into the economy, making the tunrowver of money supply more fluid. I’m not talking about Bots…which i’m in agreement with

[12:00:08]  Zoha Boa: bye everyone

[12:00:09]  Nameless Moonshadow: bye jack

[12:00:15]  BizTutor Magic: You, too, Jack. And everyone else, too. Bye for now.

[12:00:19]  Marielle Caerndow: I came late, anyone know if or where a transscript will be found ? (please)

[12:00:19]  Ann Otoole: have a good day folks. hope you can be found in search.

[12:00:39]  Joshe Darkstone: well i guess it makes for job openings at ll, but it doesnt do anything for the business community, its a full time job trying to keep up with the changes and they tend to be nonsense. gianty parcels being called relevent is just a bad idea, a prefabs parcel drops completely out of search while a dingin room parcel that has any mention of prefabs is on page 1, as long as its a full sim

[12:00:54]  Ziki Questi: @ann lmao

[12:01:16]  Moon Corrigible: Can anyone tell me where to find info on the changes to the search parameters – I have been lax about paying attention

[12:01:33]  Marielle Caerndow: what did Jack call as reason for favouring big parcels ?

[12:01:42]  Ciaran Laval: He wouldn’t comment

[12:01:46]  Ziki Questi: he denied all rumors

[12:01:49]  Ciaran Laval: it’s absurd

[12:02:04]  Joshe Darkstone: its not a rumpur, search any common keyword and look at the top result

[12:02:07]  Marielle Caerndow: so it’s all ok and working as expected, i guess *grins*

[12:02:08]  Ziki Questi: @ moon i don’t think there really are any clear search parameters

[12:02:14]  BizTutor Magic: <—- hopes Rene got his friend request.

[12:02:24]  Dahlea Milena: I always feel like I”ve just sat thru a political press conference when I come to one of these things… a whole lot of spin & nothing clean came out in the wash

[12:02:35]  Ciaran Laval: How does it help people find things if larger parcels are given greater relevance?

[12:02:48]  Melody Regent: Rene, can you send me the first 8 minutes of the meet please

[12:02:54]  Melody Regent: I was late

[12:03:07]  Joshe Darkstone: it doesnt, but they wanted to do away with link farms after they got their fill of the listing fees

[12:03:16]  BizTutor Magic: Dahlea: It’s part of what’s been wrong with SL for quite the while.

[12:03:22]  Joshe Darkstone: lots of 144m parcels

[12:03:22]  BizTutor Magic: Thanks, Rene!

[12:03:34]  Ziki Questi waves and disappears

[12:03:46]  Dahlea Milena: Rene, did you log the session? hopeful look

[12:03:52]  Melody Regent: [12:03:34] Ziki Questi waves and disappears ((LOL, I saw disappears as Diapers))

[12:03:55]  BizTutor Magic: A business that doesn’t listen to its customer base doesn’t last long.

[12:04:00]  Melody Regent needs more coffee

[12:04:03]  Joshe Darkstone: that said you could just raise the minimum size to show in search instead of killing off entire industries like shopping malls

[12:04:43]  Ciaran Laval: Joshe they did that once already, anything below 128 doesn’t show anymore, but you’re right, if they don’t want those parcels in search then raise the minimum size at least then we all know where we stand

[12:04:51]  Rene Erlanger: hi Mel

[12:05:00]  Rene Erlanger: ler me know when minutes are up

[12:05:09]  BizTutor Magic: And residents and business owners are the customer base of SL. Upgraded service is scant…so Premium memberships will be rarely renewed ’til LL starts listening and starts giving everyone who pays their ear.

[12:05:11]  Rene Erlanger: i want to link this OH to some groups

[12:05:15]  Ciaran Laval: Rene did you give Mel the first eight minutes?

[12:05:19]  Rene Erlanger: that are effected by Search

[10:59]  Master Kane: JACK!
[10:59]  Aargle Zymurgy: hey, Mitchell. got a bear?
[10:59]  Qie Niangao: greetings, Jack
[10:59]  Jean Swashbuckler: hiya Jack
[10:59]  Jack Linden: hey folks
[10:59]  Mitchell Linden: i have no bear to give you, but i’m keeping a list
[10:59]  Molly Montale: bear bear bear bear bear
[10:59]  Charlene Trudeau: hiya, Jack
[10:59]  Mitchell Linden: can i put your names on it?
[10:59]  Driftwood Miles: apologies if i landed on someone
[10:59]  Master Kane: Sure
[10:59]  Aargle Zymurgy: ok, thanks.
[10:59]  Cummere Mayo: add me to that list please
[10:59]  Qie Niangao: Mitchell: please.
[10:59]  Jean Swashbuckler: bear Mitchell
[10:59]  Jack Linden: oh hey mitchell
[10:59]  Lamorna Proctor: Hello Jack, and everyone
[10:59]  Molly Montale: yaay, list me
[10:59]  Nema Galicia: add me to the good girl list please
[10:59]  Master Kane: Hi Eq
[10:59]  Mitchell Linden: Molly, Aargyle, Master, Qie
[10:59]  Master Kane: Drift
[10:59]  Equinox Pinion: hi all
[11:00]  Daniel Voyager: hey Jack, are you going to move the landing point ?
[11:00]  Master Kane: ty mitch
[11:00]  EASY-TOOL Radar: enter chatrange: Alexxa Despres (11m)
[11:00]  Charlene Trudeau: Charlene Trudeau, too , please, Mitchell
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: gottarun
[11:00]  Driftwood Miles: Hi there
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: thanks guys
[11:00]  Dytska Vieria: Add me too, Mitchell please
[11:00]  Luci Koenkamp: Hi Jack
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: gotcha charlene
[11:00]  EASY-TOOL Radar: enter chatrange: Drongle McMahon (7m)
[11:00]  Jack Linden: Daniel, i thought that was fixed
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: dytska
[11:00]  Charlene Trudeau: thanks
[11:00]  Molly Montale: be well, Mitchell
[11:00]  Nema Galicia: Cherry i have one sim now and your just as good as every one else here
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: u2
[11:00]  Mitchell Linden: ciao!
[11:00]  Aargle Zymurgy: oops… I got called a sock again.
[11:00]  Zoha Boa: HI everyone
[11:00]  Dytska Vieria: Hi Jack
[11:00]  Jack Linden: hi hi!
[11:00]  Master Kane: Jack >> What changes where made in the TOS.. alot seem to be confused about that?
[11:00]  Imnotgoing Sideways: The Immy has landed! =^-^=
[11:01]  Daniel Voyager: Jack, everyone seems to be teleporting into the Black Leather Couch. lol
[11:01]  Cummere Mayo: hello jack. I have one question if you allow me then I will get out of your hair?
[11:01]  Drongle McMahon: Whoops, Sorry. My aim was too good.
[11:01]  Master Kane: Immy
[11:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: =^o^=
[11:01]  Jack Linden: Master, I think it was some tightening up the language around commerce.
[11:01]  Jack Linden: hmm let me reset that landing spot then, one sec.
[11:01]  Master Kane: Ah ok thats what I was thinking.. onlyh thing that I noticed thanks!
[11:01]  Master Kane: no no leave it jack lol
[11:02]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[11:02]  Daniel Voyager: grins
[11:02]  Cummere Mayo: master the tos changes jsut changed everything from the old xstreet to the new marketplace and accounted for the changes to the system
[11:02]  Master Kane: party pooper
[11:02]  Master Kane: Cummere.. yah..
[11:02]  Master Kane: Hi Alexxa
[11:03]  Jack Linden: so, it’s been a pretty packed week for us. we got Marketplace launched yesterday which is great. still plenty to do but it’s a good start
[11:03]  EASY-TOOL Radar: enter chatrange: Professor Spark (12m)
[11:03]  Cummere Mayo: yeah cept it doesnt work
[11:03]  Aargle Zymurgy: I got my magic box working nicely with it.
[11:03]  Cummere Mayo: like at all
[11:03]  Charlene Trudeau: I set up land on it
[11:03]  Jack Linden: cummere.. in what way?
[11:03]  Luci Koenkamp: works fine for me
[11:03]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Is there any place I can go to see what kinds of fees we’ll face selling content on the Marketplace? (._.)
[11:04]  Charlene Trudeau: once I got over the initial ‘you’ve got to be kidding’ over what I needed to fill in and found the quick fill button, I rather don’t mind it at all
[11:04]  Charlene Trudeau: I’m very happy to be free of having to place a prim on every parcel
[11:04]  Dytska Vieria: I can add that marketplace did not migrate my ratings and reviews and the main pictures were lost to secondary pictures
[11:04]  Cummere Mayo: um transactions dont match and if you buy multiple items from same merchant you get a message saying insufficient funds, that you were refunded, but those lindens disappear.
[11:04]  Lamorna Proctor: A lot of my stuff has not migrated either
[11:04]  Cummere Mayo: migrations failed
[11:04]  Dytska Vieria: big time
[11:04]  Imnotgoing Sideways eeps. (o.o)
[11:04]  Cummere Mayo: and it rejects some logins
[11:04]  Molly Montale: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Marketplace
[11:04]  Jack Linden: Dytska.. I think some of those items are still being addressed
[11:04]  Aargle Zymurgy: migrations failed… but I wanted to start over anyways
[11:05]  Lamorna Proctor: I rather liked the good reviews I had
[11:05]  Cummere Mayo: one of my accounts i can log into xstreet, every other LL page… but not marketplace
[11:05]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I backed out of using Xstreet back when the ‘freebie mitigation’ blog posts came out… So, I’d be starting over anyway. (>_<)
[11:05]  Jack Linden: cummere, has that happened to you since yesterday?
[11:05]  Cummere Mayo: oh and it cant find an avatar when you try and gift soemthing
[11:05]  Dytska Vieria: I hope so Jack, I only have 60 items, I can’t imagine how those who have hundreds feel.
[11:05]  Cummere Mayo: and yes ALL these things still going on yesterday
[11:06]  Jack Linden: okay, well some fixes did go in last night but I’ll mention it to the team
[11:06]  Nema Galicia: I am not euro but most of my tenants are
[11:06]  Cummere Mayo: actually been talking on and off with brodesky? or however the heck you spell his name
[11:06]  Charlene Trudeau: hard to go live with bugs in place, but honestly, without the stress testing of being live, it might be hard to find everything, too. hard to balance that
[11:06]  Cummere Mayo: oh and search still is so broken on marketplace its useless
[11:06]  Master Kane: oh now char come on now.. they did it with v2… should expect that to happen
[11:07]  Master Kane:
[11:07]  Jack Linden: exactly charlene. and having two sites was a problem.. we needed to make the jump
[11:07]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, I have a different question but related to the Marketplace. When the XStreet Exchange finally closes, I will be forced to use the Lindex to cash out money from SL. The last time I did that, it took 10 days for the money to hit my Paypal account. With XStreet it used to take 10 seconds. Why ?
[11:07]  Master Kane: Speaking of which (viewers) when is LL going to KILL 1.23.5 Jack?
[11:07]  Cummere Mayo: well i heard they are keeping xstreet sorta active a month lonnger ?
[11:07]  Charlene Trudeau: paypal cashout is going faster, but its still not as fast as xstreet
[11:08]  Lamorna Proctor likes instant gratification
[11:08]  Nema Galicia: no killing my viwer MK
[11:08]  Master Kane: I hear ya Nema
[11:08]  Charlene Trudeau: also, I have ar esident who cannot get his paypal draw or cc active with the main site, but was fine for purchasing lindens via the xstreet exchange
[11:08]  Charlene Trudeau: what happens to someone in that situation?
[11:08]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, the two went through very different processes. It was a hangover from our acquisition of xstreet that it had such a fast cashout. but we are also concerned about that – so we’ve extra folks involved on the normal cashout so that it isn’t slow
[11:08]  Charlene Trudeau: esp since not premium and therefore has limited support?
[11:08]  Master Kane: Good question Charlene
[11:08]  Scarlet Untermeyer is Offline
[11:08]  Jack Linden: So we’ll see.. but hopefully it’ll be fine
[11:09]  Lamorna Proctor: is 10 days acceptable, in your opinion?
[11:09]  Charlene Trudeau: NO!
[11:09]  Charlene Trudeau: I know you weren’t asking me, but that’s my input ;P
[11:09]  Cummere Mayo: an hour is the most that is acceptable
[11:09]  Jack Linden: That’s what i’m saying.. 10 days is a long time to wait. I’d expect it to be quicker than that.
[11:09]  Aargle Zymurgy: transfer to paypal are supposed to be 0 to 5 days. normally it owrks, but sometimes they get behind.
[11:10]  Master Kane: Jack >> Speaking of which (viewers) when is LL going to KILL 1.23.5
[11:10]  Lamorna Proctor: My last transaction was requested on September 24th and finally paid me on October 4th after I filed a support ticket
[11:10]  Cummere Mayo: jack wont know that mk
[11:10]  Aargle Zymurgy: I had it explained to me that the old xtreet had a different anti-fraud arrangement with paypal than did the lindex.
[11:10]  Master Kane: he should.. its a product
[11:10]  Cummere Mayo: theres no plan on that right now
[11:10]  Jack Linden: Master.. not yet, is the simple answer. And when we do have a date we’ll announce it I’m sure.
[11:10]  Master Kane: Ok thanks jack
[11:10]  Equinox Pinion: Jack, why did you take away the discount for the non profit and education sims, dont you think every company has its obligations to support them?
[11:11]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Kinda like how the new TOS was ‘announced’? (._.)
[11:11]  Lamorna Proctor: surely there could be some kind of flag set for residents who are legit and cash out regularly. they can’t all be subject to manual review
[11:11]  Master Kane: yah Immy
[11:11]  Charlene Trudeau: I do like the new undocking in the snowstorm daily
[11:11]  Master Kane: most people dont like surprises
[11:11]  Cummere Mayo: Imnot: they did say months ago a new tos would be in palce before marketplace went live ^^
[11:11]  Jack Linden: Equinox, not really my area to comment on though i’ve been keeping up to date on the comments to the post.
[11:11]  Aargle Zymurgy smiles
[11:11]  Charlene Trudeau: it’ll take us further towards usability that works for different styles of user
[11:12]  Jack Linden: I expect that we’ll communicate more on it soon though
[11:12]  Equinox Pinion: ok thanks
[11:12]  Cummere Mayo: it wasnt a surprise to those that followed the blogs
[11:12]  Aargle Zymurgy: Lam, you and I could definitely appreciate that since we’ve been doing legit withdrawals for… what? 3 1/2 years now.?
[11:12]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Heck… People who are usually in the know weren’t in the know… That’s bad. DX
[11:12]  Equinox Pinion: any news on when the display names will go live?
[11:13]  Master Kane: Jack >> on concerns with an Email I sent to Phil… I have not reciecved anything back from Phil about that email (same thing I told you about in open chat a few weeks ago). Is this the way a business runs? Just asking so I dont hold my breath
[11:13]  Jack Linden: Charlene.. me too.. the current beta has given me a few extra fps too. But yes, the tear off tabs are great
[11:13]  Cummere Mayo: jack I do have one question. Is ll ever gonna force your subcontractors to recognize differant accounts? I had a problem with one account, and support kept locking down my OTHER account for maintenace in stead…
[11:13]  Imnotgoing Sideways eeps. (o.o)
[11:14]  Jack Linden: Equinox.. we’re still making some changes in light of the feedback we had. I expect to blog pretty soon about the pieces we have changed and when we think it likely to make it out
[11:14]  Luci Koenkamp: Any news on support Jack?
[11:14]  Equinox Pinion: great..thanks
[11:14]  Nema Galicia: Do we even have support any more or are we on our own
[11:14]  Lamorna Proctor: Well, we have our BanClone product ready for Display Names
[11:14]  Master Kane: on our own nema .. as it seems
[11:15]  Cummere Mayo: one of those changes gonna be to disallow use of user names as display names jack? or LL still saying FU to alll of us?
[11:15]  Master Kane: and pray that we dont get suspended for something that we DIDNT do
[11:15]  Aargle Zymurgy: not quite right, Master… however, Jack… can I make a suggestion about support?
[11:15]  Charlene Trudeau: you’ve said that you’re not the support person any more, Jack, who is? and whose office hours can we attend to find out the status of plans to get us the support we need?
[11:15]  Jack Linden: Cummere – not sure why that would happen. alts have always been a tricky problem with support
[11:15]  Cummere Mayo: Jack I NEVER had a problem when you had joppa teagan and twilight doing support
[11:15]  Aargle Zymurgy: Jack, I did a lot of CS on about the 2rd or 3rd level of support since I”m a programmer…..
[11:15]  Nema Galicia: I am not for one an alt so why do i have problem with support
[11:15]  Master Kane: Aargle.. ill just say.. some dont brown nose
[11:16]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Teagan got a job as a community manager at Frenzoo now. =^-^=
[11:16]  Vixen Penucca is Online
[11:16]  Master Kane: Cool Immy
[11:16]  Scarlet Untermeyer is Online
[11:16]  Jack Linden: Cummere – display names won’t be stopped from matching usernames, no. As we’ve said – that’s the fundamental point of the feature after all
[11:17]  Cummere Mayo: so its fundamental to allow people to impersonate your users or to steal TRADEMARKED names?
[11:17]  Aargle Zymurgy: but LL could do a lot for themselves and for the residents if they were to rehire someone like Teagan or Twilight or someone like that who could be both 2nd level of support and provide better training for the first level of support.
[11:17]  Luci Koenkamp: great I´ll be jAck Linden
[11:17]  Jack Linden: The name over the head, is not the unique id. The username is. It’s going to take some adjustment but that’s the way we feel it needs to work
[11:17]  Marianne McCann: So wil I!
[11:17]  Jack Linden: hehe
[11:17]  Lamorna Proctor: that’s the fundamental FLAW of the feature, IMO
[11:17]  Cummere Mayo: are the people that came up with this idea f’n stupid? or just theives ?
[11:17]  Equinox Pinion: you really want to get all the ims luci
[11:17]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I’d still love to have an option in my profile that says “Add my account name to the display name blacklist”. It can be a tickbox right next to “Hide me In search”. (^_^)
[11:17]  Luci Koenkamp: hehe
[11:18]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, well we’ll see when it goes live and has been on the grid for a while. As i’ve said before, we don’t do these things lightly.
[11:18]  Jack Linden: But we do think this is important
[11:18]  Cummere Mayo: yes jack you do
[11:18]  Master Kane: Yah… good idea Immy… same here.. I Second that, Jack!
[11:18]  Luci Koenkamp: but I could answer my own IM´s hahaha
[11:18]  Cummere Mayo: you do it very lightly
[11:18]  Cummere Mayo: without EVER thinking things trhough
[11:18]  Suchalady Blackheart: Mr Jack I am with Imnotgoing we need options
[11:18]  Charlene Trudeau: I want a way to force everyone to see my user.name and title regardless of their client’s settings
[11:18]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, what you seem to be missing is that whilst there are many John Smiths in RL, there is only one Lamorna Proctor in SL and probably none in RL. That’s why I want to protect my name
[11:18]  Aargle Zymurgy: is that even a possiblity, Jack? one of the more knowledgable linden support staff brought back, but spared the tedium of helping people find their lost hair, but but available for the serious problems?
[11:18]  Cummere Mayo: thats why were STILL cleaning up zhindra
[11:18]  Suchalady Blackheart: we need protection
[11:18]  Charlene Trudeau: expanding on the display name and how I want to be known
[11:18]  Cummere Mayo: thats why adult verification still doesnt work
[11:19]  Cummere Mayo: and why we’re being stuck with two disasters we dont want
[11:19]  Cummere Mayo: teens on the main grid, and the ability for any asshat to steal our names and reputations
[11:19]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, if that is the case then you’ll likely never see anyone with that name. But even if you did, they can’t emulate your unique id – the username.
[11:19]  Marianne McCann: I am sure that, within minutes of Display Names hitting the main grid, there will be scores of Prokofy Nevas. Tht’s gonna be a sticky one.
[11:19]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[11:19]  Ciaran Laval: Absolutely Mari
[11:19]  kaiya Manbi: Jack —– If one is not using viewer 2 – this means that we will not see these display names i gather, but does it also mean if we search “people” will we again NOT find display names – there for if we are not using viewer 2 we will have no way at all to see whats going on – appart from seing open chat with our names
[11:19]  Master Kane: thing I dont get is this…. why in the h3ll does the LL viewer opt to SHOW original name on ALL people ALL the time.. I dont get this at all… I mean.. yah I KNOW why, but come on
[11:19]  Charlene Trudeau: someone would *want* to be Prok?
[11:19]  Cummere Mayo: and after trying out your system to fidn the username jack, new peopel cannot figure it out
[11:19]  Aargle Zymurgy: yes, and the highly litigious Stroker Serpentine
[11:19]  Cummere Mayo: even OLD people cannot
[11:19]  Jack Linden: Marianne, yes.. very likely. People will have fun with it for a while but remember.. it can only be changed once per week.
[11:20]  Marianne McCann: Ya, Aargle
[11:20]  Drongle McMahon: But Prok will be imnotgoing!
[11:20]  Lamorna Proctor: Yes, but people will still be fooled. I don’t see why you can’t protect existing resident names. And if you don’t, WE WILL
[11:20]  Imnotgoing Sideways: XD
[11:20]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Now THAT would be a scream. (^_^)
[11:20]  Marianne McCann: Jack – yes, so every throwaway alt…
[11:20]  lufpleh Obstreperous: Lamorna, Immy, if the real person with those names signed up tommorrow display names gives them a chance to use therir own name
[11:20]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I have a good dozen alts, all with my skin and shape… Having a new name a day won’t be all that hard. (^_^)
[11:20]  RihannaAlicia Carami is Offline
[11:20]  Cummere Mayo: peopel that have used sl 3 or four years that tried your display names cannot figure otu how to distinguish between user name and display name… and worse it LOGS the display name
[11:20]  Marianne McCann: I mean, I understandd both sides on this. I like the functionality a lot. But with the functionality comes things like that…
[11:20]  Molly Montale: If being fooled is not a real concern then why will the sur name Linden not be available?
[11:21]  Master Kane: I think thats the point here… ya know . noobs.. being fooled.. and then all sorts of griefing and false ar’s etc.. to get you suspeneded.. mhm.. thats what I think
[11:21]  Lamorna Proctor: Yes, but most SL resident names are funky names that don’t exist in RL. That’s why people like them
[11:21]  RihannaAlicia Carami is Online
[11:21]  Aargle Zymurgy: it’s still available, Molly.
[11:21]  Imnotgoing Sideways: =^o^=
[11:21]  Charlene Trudeau: really, Cummere? I figured it out in less than 5 min and was satisfied by every count except that I would want to force others to see my user.name in addition to my display name, regardless of their preferences
[11:21]  Lamorna Proctor: my name IS my identity here
[11:22]  Charlene Trudeau: it is for me too, but I’m not going to tell a real world charlene trudeau that she can’t use her own name here if she wants
[11:22]  Equinox Pinion: your user name will always be unique lamorna
[11:22]  Master Kane: that isnt the point
[11:22]  Cummere Mayo: and this “new users had trouble with our naming system” crap is total flat out lie. Not ONE person i have ever helped set up an account didnt like the system except that sometimes they had to refresh through the list, or a name they liked was already retired
[11:22]  Drongle McMahon: The name was the only constant. Now that has gone.
[11:22]  Jack Linden: Marianne.. we’ve never denied that there are aspects to this that are hard.. or that it can’t be misused like many other standard features can also be misused. However, we feel that in line with other services on the web this is an important milestone for us to get past so that we can further grow Second Life.
[11:22]  Charlene Trudeau: over time, I’ve come to realize that what we fight most in terms of change, long term are the best things for sl
[11:22]  Cummere Mayo: jack how are you going to protect trademarked names?
[11:22]  Marianne McCann nods
[11:22]  Charlene Trudeau: free accounts is an example
[11:22]  Cummere Mayo: like cummere may?
[11:22]  Cummere Mayo: *mayo
[11:22]  Lamorna Proctor: I know that, and you know that, but noobs and causal users won’t know that. there will be geifing and lawsuits. you can count on it
[11:23]  Cummere Mayo: its trademarrked
[11:23]  Drongle McMahon: Jack. S you are following instead of leading!
[11:23]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, yes your name is your identity. it’s your username. That remains yours.. it remains unique.
[11:23]  Cummere Mayo: so if you allow another user to use it youre liable for helping them be able to
[11:23]  Marianne McCann: I agree, Jack. For me, as long as user.name remain visible, I’m not going to sweat a few Marianne McCanns. That is until someone goofs and ARs me because someone wants to fake up an ageplay report on me…
[11:23]  Charlene Trudeau: people in rl use tm names as nicknames all the time
[11:23]  Suchalady Blackheart: well i have another question to ask can we have more groups and more picks in the profiles some of us use these to advertise
[11:23]  Charlene Trudeau: not sure there’s a difference
[11:24]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I almost wonder how many people AR me daily, simply out of spite. =^-^=
[11:24]  Jack Linden: We’ll be very careful to never discipline according to display name.. so you won’t be blamed for badness that wasn’t you
[11:24]  Cummere Mayo: theres nt charlene. if someoen that hold sthat tm gets bitchy enough, they go to court and clean them out
[11:24]  Marianne McCann: Oh, I AR you six times before breakfast, Immy.
[11:24]  Marianne McCann winks
[11:24]  Cummere Mayo: yeah jack and how the heck will you do that?
[11:24]  Master Kane: Jack >> I hate to inform you and all of Linden Labs of this (and sure some here will agree with me). the reason some make those idiotic names is to cause trouble and stalk others… this is a proven fact over the years of the internet.. as on Yahoo!, MSN, Prodigy etc… why in the he3ll would LL allow this other than th ose reasons?
[11:24]  Imnotgoing Sideways: \(^_^)/
[11:24]  Cummere Mayo: dont make promises you cannot keep
[11:24]  kaiya Manbi: Jack —– If one is not using viewer 2 – this means that we will not see these display names i gather, but does it also mean if we search “people” will we again NOT find display names – there for if we are not using viewer 2 we will have no way at all to see whats going on – appart from seing open chat with our names
[11:25]  Tammy Nowotny: hello~
[11:25]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Konnichiwa <Hi> (^_^)
[11:25]  Master Kane: Hi Seattle
[11:25]  Charlene Trudeau: one would guess that by the time display names goes live, viewer 1.23 won’t be on teh grid anymore. Though if you’re using a tpv that doesn’t buildin the display names, you’ll still have issues
[11:25]  Jack Linden: Suchalady, both good suggestions and stuff we have on our list of things to discuss. We’ve been talking about Picks recently for example, because we’re doing some work on Profiles. People want more flexibility in Picks as they use them for so many different things now
[11:26]  Cummere Mayo: jack you have thhe vry peole that asked fo display names upset with how youre implementing them. the vast majority of your blogs are saying dont implement like this. why are you sayign “fu: to us?
[11:26]  kaiya Manbi: so if we are NOT using viewer 2 – we will have no way to monitor the use of these display names right?
[11:26]  Rigrunner Rang: would be good to have a biz section and maybe a ‘places to see’ one yeah
[11:26]  Marianne McCann: Jack – yes. For many in my neck of the woods, we want to have more on our families and friends in our profiles. Picks often end up “repurposed” for that
[11:26]  Jack Linden: kaiya, if your Viewer isn’t supporting Display Names then search will work on usernames as usual.
[11:26]  Qie Niangao: People use *groups* for many different things, too…. most of which they don’t do very well.
[11:26]  Suchalady Blackheart: thank you
[11:26]  Charlene Trudeau: Jack, seriously, if you’re working on profiles, you need a ‘contact info’ section separate from picks. Its a huge need for anyone who is in biz here.
[11:27]  Cummere Mayo: why is it that the desires of a handful of grieers, and a few computer programers that dont actually spend time in SL are being put over the needs of the community?
[11:27]  Lamorna Proctor: I guess I could make a sell a sensor that shows display names to people using 1.23. Now there’s a good idea
[11:27]  Aargle Zymurgy: yeah, if you can get some people to read them, Charlene
[11:27]  Suchalady Blackheart: yes charlene
[11:27]  Lamorna Proctor: *make and sell
[11:27]  Seattle LeShelle: i will buy one lamona
[11:27]  >>> Seattle: voy a comprar uno Lamona
[11:27]  Jack Linden: Yep, I think people want Picks that are commercial – for their own stories or services, separately from Picks that call out friends or places they like
[11:27]  Rigrunner Rang: Jack what’s happening with PG & Moderate. I see PG parcels on moderate sims are blocked from pg searches now, similarly pg events on moderate sims are no longer searchable unless moderate is ticked. Is this something implemented for the teens?
[11:27]  Lamorna Proctor: OK Seattle, you’re on
[11:27]  Tammy Nowotny: that was what ads were for, but ads don’t work very well & cost money
[11:28]  Ciaran Laval: it’s something that shouldn’t have happened Rigrunner, that’s for sure
[11:28]  Jack Linden: Charlene, totally agree.
[11:28]  Rigrunner Rang: well id certainly prefer more in world picks or profileoptions to fill in than a facebook link heh
[11:28]  Cummere Mayo si waiting for an answer from jack
[11:28]  Jack Linden: Those are the kinds of things we can add
[11:28]  Marianne McCann: It’s like the long time desire some folks have had for enhanced partnering. Multiples, or whatever. SOmehtingthat shows their connections, gives them more “categories” (sister, master, ehatever)
[11:28]  kaiya Manbi: So if we are NOT using viewer 2 then we wont be able to even search a display name? somone in chat has my name, and i search it, i wont find it, if im not using viewer 2! so the only way to monitor griefers using our names is to be on viewer 2 – this seems to be the case
[11:28]  Marianne McCann: whatever*
[11:28]  Master Kane: Me too Cummere
[11:29]  Cummere Mayo: yes kaiya
[11:29]  Jack Linden: Rigrunner.. there will be some changes for that reason. There will also be some changes to search around maturity as well
[11:29]  Aargle Zymurgy: Lamorna and I are attempting to track that regardless, Kaiya
[11:29]  Lamorna Proctor: Kaiya, your friends’ list and open chat will look very weird too
[11:29]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Heh… I can’t even get my one crush to partner with me… Two and a half bloody years, already. (._.)
[11:29]  Master Kane: However, I dont think we will get one to that question
[11:29]  Jack Linden: Kaiya, you won’t see it.. so you won’t need to search for it.
[11:29]  Jack Linden: You’ll just see usernames
[11:29]  Cummere Mayo: oh and jack, people that were thinking of coming to secondlife are now refusing because of how youre chanign naming
[11:29]  Cummere Mayo: they are going to open grid instead
[11:30]  Cummere Mayo: so if youre trying to discourage new users, pat yourself on the back
[11:30]  Cummere Mayo: you succeeded
[11:30]  Suchalady Blackheart: whats open grid
[11:30]  Luci Koenkamp: haha
[11:30]  Lamorna Proctor: If Display Names is something prospective new residents are gagging for, I’ll eat my hat
[11:30]  kaiya Manbi: we wont even see it? omg! so we could have griefers all over the place with our names, and we wont even see it, unless were on viewer 2 – brilliant way to get every one onto viewer 2!!!!
[11:30]  Master Kane: I see a lot of OLD timers leaving SL too because of all this hooligan acts thats suppose to be (looks at Immys tag) “FAST, EASY & FUN”
[11:30]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Chicka chicka yeaaaaah!
[11:30]  Master Kane: lol
[11:31]  Rigrunner Rang: Jack how is the blog post going about the Atlas program? I see you guys are cutting costs this week with education but still no transparency about what the benefits the large landowners are recieving?
[11:31]  Jack Linden: kaiya, if a tpv hasn’t implemented display names as a change then clearly that viewer isn’t going to show them.
[11:31]  Cummere Mayo: this might coem as a surprise jack, but peopel DONT like the forced Resident last name
[11:31]  Jack Linden: we’d like to think that they will bring the feature across of course
[11:31]  Cummere Mayo: they dont like that their account names will look like molley3521876zt
[11:31]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Heh.. Some do already. (^_^)
[11:32]  Luci Koenkamp: that´s their choice cumer
[11:32]  Seattle LeShelle: agreed cummere i have had many turn away from coming here since the unqiue name became a non factor
[11:32]  Tammy Nowotny: and that means we will have more avis with names like molley3521876zt
[11:32]  Rigrunner Rang: how about an ability to lock/register names, like you can on chat servers? one name per avi, should the avi wish to lock it
[11:32]  Cummere Mayo: so jack im still waiting for an answer? why are the needs of griefers and a few programmers that dont even use SL regularly put before those of us that do?
[11:32]  Master Kane: I think I know where cummere is going with this and I have to agree (if its what I think)
[11:32]  Tammy Nowotny: although everyone here has a real name with no numerals in it
[11:32]  Aargle Zymurgy: I know someone named 99
[11:32]  Charlene Trudeau: trust me, Rig, atlas members would love to see that transparency too, so that the record is straight and we can’t correct the misconceptions out there
[11:32]  Lamorna Proctor: Rigrunner, see http://www.slysense.com/banclone (and sorry for the commercial)
[11:32]  Techwolf Lupindo: Mifght as well go with d48f8fa7-2512-4fe5-80c8-c0a923412e07 as names.
[11:32]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Technically speaking.. .I have a sentence. (^_^)
[11:33]  Master Kane: Cummere.. so they dont have to payout that 300L$ stiped eachmonth to thousands of users.. this way they have all free acounts in their databses
[11:33]  Jack Linden: Cummere – I don’t think we’re going to agree on that one. We shall see how it works out once it’s been launched; we understand that some people are concerned about it. Not everyone will like it. But that doesn’t change the fact that we strongly believe it to be the right thing to do for the platform.
[11:33]  Marianne McCann: While I personally have no need for a display name, I know a lot of people who can and will use them. Changing their visible last names alone is huuuge
[11:33]  Cummere Mayo: irc allows registering of names, many of the mmorpgs are moving into firstname last name for account names.
[11:33]  Rigrunner Rang: thank you Lamorna, was wondering when services like that would pop up
[11:33]  Jack Linden: Preventing people from using their choice of identity, or limiting their choice of username, are both not good
[11:33]  Lamorna Proctor: The trouble is that you’ll be opening Pandora’s Box.
[11:34]  Cummere Mayo: to lower the number of password looking names
[11:34]  Dennis Lagan: you strongly believed other things as well…
[11:34]  Master Kane: I quote a Linden a few weeks back… ” … Linden Labs is listneing”
[11:34]  kaiya Manbi: Jack – as Rigrunner Rang already asked, still no transparency about what the benefits the large landowners (atlas) are recieving?
[11:34]  Master Kane: Listening*
[11:34]  Cummere Mayo: yeah their listing and spitting at us
[11:34]  Aargle Zymurgy: Jack, any response to my question which I hoped was a positive suggestion?
[11:34]  Master Kane: Ummmm.. to what…. rock… 70′s…. disco?
[11:34]  Drongle McMahon: I am reading a book about mistaking association for causality. I thjink the people who made the justfication for the displynames need a copy.
[11:35]  Cummere Mayo: at least those involved in display names, ui, teens, and every other important issue
[11:35]  Lamorna Proctor: Business owners want to protect their own names and offer a service to people visiting them. That’s why we have developed BanClone
[11:35]  Jack Linden: Master.. what makes you think we’re not listening? If we don’t change a decision does that imply we’re not? Because that doesn’t follow at all. We’ve listened to the feedback, and we’re making a long list of changes to make this less spooky for people.
[11:35]  Molly Montale: Discussion last night on Info Island about the education price changes had about 2 dozen schools represented. The consensus was dismay. Many mentioned reduction of presence in SL due to the proposed price increase.
[11:35]  Suchalady Blackheart: So mr Jack there is no way to give some of us a choice to buy our name out of the username database
[11:35]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Oh, that would be wild… Uncle Lumpylap could take on the display name of a teen to get his hands on her friends. (O.o)
[11:35]  Master Kane: Jack.. I think the majority has spoken on this Display name bit.. and no.. not on this at all
[11:35]  You decline Sands Mall Biker Sim, Sands World (202, 74, 22) from A group member named Tess Zimer.
[11:36]  Cummere Mayo: jack because if you dont change a stupid deicsion that adversely affects 99% of the comunity youre either not listening or youre increadibly stupid
[11:36]  Lamorna Proctor: Suchalady, we offer that service
[11:36]  Rigrunner Rang: well its ore a case of walk in the residents shows jack, if you feel people wont impersonate and grief… allow linden names too….and see for yourselves…
[11:36]  Zoha Boa: you are NOT listening Jack, We business owners are asking you since DAY 1, to PROTECT our ID, we did work for years with this name, to have a good reputation.
[11:36]  Rigrunner Rang: shoes*
[11:36]  Marianne McCann: Seems like it could be a good feature for premiums. A protected/verified name.
[11:36]  Master Kane: Jack.. feedback of griefers or actuall people that make a living IN SL?
[11:36]  Jack Linden: Suchalady.. that would undo the purpose of the feature. If you buy a name, and lock it, then we’re back to stopping people from using the identity they wish to use. It just doesn’t make sense to have one id for both your avatar name *and* your unique login.
[11:36]  Master Kane: Sorry to be so harsh and to the point
[11:37]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, you have to respect the opinions of creators and business owners. They are the people who make the content here
[11:37]  Driftwood Miles: Only for names people are willing to pay for Jack…there will be PLENTY of others to go around…lets keep it in perspective
[11:37]  Zoha Boa: Why do you lock the Linden name then ?
[11:37]  Luci Koenkamp: good question
[11:37]  Cummere Mayo: you litterally told parental rights groups, internet safety groups and law enforcement, that you didnt care what they thought about merging the teen grid. you told the entrie world you’ll shove display names on us. you refused to go back to the 1.x ui . show me jack WHAT have you lsitened to us about?
[11:37]  Rigrunner Rang: i love the idea of usernames but for those whove established an identity here, they should be able to protect it
[11:37]  Cummere Mayo: name one thing jack
[11:37]  Suchalady Blackheart: so there can be a whole bunch of Suchalady blackhearts here ?
[11:37]  Suchalady Blackheart: ♠It’s me..Suchalady Blackheart
[11:37]  Suchalady Blackheart: ★ ץoυ кηoฬ мe?! ★
[11:37]  Suchalady Blackheart: ★ Oƒcoυrѕe ץoυ do, ★
[11:37]  Suchalady Blackheart: ★ тнaт’ѕ вecaυѕe I’м ƒaмoυѕ ★
[11:37]  Lamorna Proctor: Locking the name Linden is futile. I’ve already worked out how to spoof it
[11:37]  Cummere Mayo: one
[11:37]  Marianne McCann: (FWIW, and widly off topic, I’d love to see other enhancements to premium. Maybe even give them the option to do megas, or to import meshes, or whatever)
[11:38]  Suchalady Blackheart: sorry for gesture
[11:38]  Dennis Lagan: “doesn’t make sense”.? it just didnt exist before, but it does now. there was only one name. no need ot call the previous situation one name for two things
[11:38]  kaiya Manbi: they are listening – but are simply not changing their minds – this is more than apparent – no matter how we beg or plead
[11:38]  Professor Spark: cummere, when did it become okay to call someone stupid just because you disagree with them?
[11:38]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Linden Lab was only called Linden Lab because the initial office was on Linden St. in San Francisco. Surely, the name has a history that predates SL. (^_^)
[11:38]  Lamorna Proctor: Unter den Linde was a street in Berlin years before
[11:38]  Lamorna Proctor: *Linden
[11:38]  Marianne McCann: Have any other names been blocked? Mole? OnTyne? F***? SLPolice?”
[11:39]  Master Kane: SL Police hahahahaahha
[11:39]  Lamorna Proctor: Marianne, you’d better believe it
[11:39]  Ciaran Laval: mariane McCann! Was your mouth out with soap!
[11:39]  Jack Linden: Suchalady.. no. there will be one, by username. Because it’s the username that is your unique id.
[11:39]  Marianne McCann: Yessir
[11:39]  Ardy Lay: There are quite a number of people in USA with the last name of Linden.
[11:39]  Marianne McCann blushes
[11:39]  Charlene Trudeau: but there are things in 2.x that are *better* and they are working on a lot of changes to make 2.x more functional the way we need it. They are listening there, they are improving the new product as a result of listening.
[11:39]  Driftwood Miles: Why are these Display Names so important please?
[11:39]  Cummere Mayo: so we’re stuck with names like george544339485443te for user names?
[11:39]  Cummere Mayo: how is that gonna attract new users ?
[11:39]  Techwolf Lupindo: Charlene, how much did LL pay you?
[11:39]  Charlene Trudeau: heh
[11:39]  Seattle LeShelle: there is npo interest to LInden Labs to protect our good names or buisness’s that is a lack of repsect to those of here who enchance and give you revenue.
[11:39]  Marianne McCann: Charlene – I agree. The product that is 2,2 is by far closer to what should have sipped as 2.0 in Q1
[11:40]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, you are doing a good job defending the indefensible. Do you not understand the concerns of long-established residents who pay your salary?
[11:40]  Cummere Mayo: no he doesnt lamorna
[11:40]  Charlene Trudeau: as for display names
[11:40]  Suchalady Blackheart: well I am concerned because I made the name my pseudonym
[11:40]  Lamorna Proctor: look after your existing customer base before everything else
[11:40]  Charlene Trudeau: the reason given is that they lose the majority of people during the name selection phase
[11:40]  Charlene Trudeau: if my choice is protecting my name and reputation
[11:40]  Cummere Mayo: no they dont
[11:41]  Charlene Trudeau: vs having more people in world to buy my product
[11:41]  Master Kane: Lamorna.. I think they know they wwill be weeded out sooner or later.. so they actually dont give a crap, just saying
[11:41]  Cummere Mayo: they dont lose anyone there
[11:41]  Driftwood Miles: I do not see how thse names help
[11:41]  Drongle McMahon: If I was an RL Linden, I might …..
[11:41]  Lamorna Proctor: one old customer lost is far more damaging than one new customer not gained
[11:41]  Rigrunner Rang: regarding v2, yes things do appear to be getting better, perhaps Linden need to do a blog to encourage users to take at least a look at it again. I for one lost confidence when you encouraged me to use a half-built viewer which wasnt suited to my needs as a resident at all and so was reluctant to try it again. many other residents feel the same way
[11:41]  Charlene Trudeau: I’ll take door number 2 every time
[11:41]  Cummere Mayo: charlene which linden alt are you?
[11:41]  Charlene Trudeau: heh
[11:41]  Master Kane: lol
[11:41]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[11:41]  Cummere Mayo: or are you one of the griefers that intend to steal others names and greif?
[11:41]  Jack Linden: Driftwood.. several reasons. Firstly, almost no other services limit naming in the way that we do.. it’s absolutely normal to separate unique login from identity within a service or game. Without doing that we severely limit what names people can use for their identity. Also, we lose hundreds of thousands of potential registrants each year the name choice part of registration. We want to make that simpler and allow people to bring their real world or net id with them into Second Life.
[11:41]  Master Kane: its that hard to figure out cummere? lol
[11:42]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Don’t worry. Desmond still thinks I’m FBI. =^-^=
[11:42]  Rigrunner Rang: similar things are happening with the marketplace atm… forced onto a half-completed solution, you are once again losing confidence of the customers you have
[11:42]  Master Kane: lmao
[11:42]  Charlene Trudeau: I run a public sandbox…. I deal too much with griefers to even find that last suggestion funny, sorry
[11:42]  kaiya Manbi: he does, but the potential of getting in more sign ups and having second life correspond to face book is too big an opportunity for LL to not take – so we, the old residents are thrown under the buss — LL is making a business decision here, and were simply the casualties of this war
[11:42]  Marianne McCann: Everyone knows your MI5, Immy
[11:42]  Cummere Mayo: jack what proof do you have that you lose “hundreds of thousands of potential users” at name selection”?
[11:42]  Imnotgoing Sideways: =^-^=
[11:42]  Seattle LeShelle: so the fact google limits names means nothing? they are a small company to you now jack?
[11:42]  Cummere Mayo: you say that, theres never been any proof offered
[11:42]  Cummere Mayo: and allot offered agaisnt it
[11:42]  Drongle McMahon: Again confusing association and cause.
[11:42]  Ciaran Laval: Wait wait wait, we don’t have, nor are we going to have, separate login names and usernames, we should have, we should have all our alts under one login, but that’s another story.
[11:42]  Seattle LeShelle: or msn or numerous other companys out there
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: and LL still will be too
[11:43]  Lamorna Proctor: why not simply open up last names to be anything then, Jack? As long as it’s not already in use. Technically simple, and no more difficult to police rude names than Display Names will be
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: our user.name will still be unique
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: we’ll just have the ability to have a ‘nick’
[11:43]  Marianne McCann: Right, Charlene
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: that’s why I want to force my user.name below my nick
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: I’d really like to have display name simply be ‘Char’
[11:43]  Ciaran Laval: Our user.name will be everywhere still
[11:43]  Charlene Trudeau: with charlene.trudeau under it
[11:43]  Suchalady Blackheart: Lamorna i agree
[11:43]  Marianne McCann: Right. To me, that should be sticky and visible, Charlene
[11:43]  Zoha Boa: maybe you are loosing hundred thousands of users because you ended the mentoring, closing the community gateways..now new users are lost, don’t know what to do. They even have no idea that there is more then an empty orientation island
[11:43]  Seattle LeShelle: agreed charlene
[11:44]  Jack Linden: Lamorna, because it would still be impossible to use your real name in that case. Fundamentally we have to be able to all two John Smiths to both be John Smith.
[11:44]  Jack Linden: *allow
[11:44]  Cummere Mayo: and every place where the username is forced into a format that they start looking like passwords starts losing people. NWN, wow, eq and everywhere else found that out and changed it
[11:44]  Lamorna Proctor: Yes, but not two Lamorna Proctors !!!
[11:44]  Suchalady Blackheart: Zoha thank you
[11:44]  Drongle McMahon: What about John Lindens?
[11:44]  Cummere Mayo: jack how many people want to use their rl name?
[11:44]  Lamorna Proctor: that is the fundamental point, Jack
[11:44]  Molly Montale: the idea of 20 Proks showing up for office hour and having to check each profile in chat to see who is speaking is not appealing
[11:44]  Cummere Mayo: most people do NOT
[11:44]  Driftwood Miles: Jack…I understand…but the implementation of Dislay Names still means they have to select a UNIQUE avatar name AND a Display Name…thus lengthening the process. On top of that you are allowing the use on ANY name as a display name and not just adding a premium feature of “protecting” a name. This should not be a huge problem because not HUGE amounts of people will pay for that protection. And lets face it…the argument about “premium” names defeating the object is pretty moot when you consider it is available for the Linden moniker
[11:44]  Suchalady Blackheart: Mr Jack we need more sims to be chosen as showcase
[11:45]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, not necessarily. All we need is a username. We’d then set their display name to match it
[11:45]  Suchalady Blackheart: we need players choice
[11:45]  Jack Linden: But.. they’d be able to change it
[11:45]  Marianne McCann: Ya, for me I’m actually more concerned about getting people in to SL, then getting them to stay in SL, at a pretty fundamental level of it all.
[11:45]  Driftwood Miles: understood….so where is the change?
[11:45]  Ciaran Laval: What’s the default surname going to be then?
[11:45]  Cummere Mayo: jack are you going to at least give us the ability to disable display names at the parcel level?
[11:45]  Driftwood Miles: how does this bring the masses flocking?
[11:45]  Charlene Trudeau: Jack, did you ever answer the Atlas question?
[11:45]  Dytska Vieria: Maybe I miss the point, why can’t the display name never be the same as an existing user name?
[11:45]  Cummere Mayo: resident
[11:45]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, all you need to do is prevent a Display Name being identical to a “legacy” Firstname Lastname combo. That would alleviate most people’s concerns
[11:46]  Master Kane: Drift.. its called PR
[11:46]  Master Kane: and thats it
[11:46]  Dennis Lagan: Drift, Basically they will trick people a bit saying ‘enter a name to be shown in world (this can be changed later)’
[11:46]  Cummere Mayo: all new accoutns will looke like hubert98897987789ght.resident
[11:46]  Ardy Lay: Destination Guide FAQ: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Destination_Guide
Submission Form: http://secondlife.com/my/forms/destinations.php
[11:47]  Drongle McMahon: Is that an alt of Hubert98897987788ght.resident?
[11:47]  Jack Linden: Drift, we believe it will lessen that dropoff and encourage more people to come into Second Life. Usernames can be anything that hasn’t been used, so they may choose to be jack34456, or they may find something easier
[11:47]  Lamorna Proctor: lol
[11:47]  Cummere Mayo: and jack, how are you goign to react when you get takedown notices abotu protected names ?
[11:47]  Nema Galicia: wait go back did some one say my usuer name and display name can not remain the same?
[11:47]  Jack Linden: Point is.. it’ll be up to them
[11:47]  Driftwood Miles: I understand how important it is to make SL more attractive…but is this really the best we can come up with
[11:47]  Rigrunner Rang: Jack you seemed to have missed my question about the atlas program earlier, how is the upcoming blog post about atlas and transparency coming along?
[11:48]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, it’s not the *only* thing we’re doing, no. It’s one that we think is very significant, yes
[11:48]  Charlene Trudeau: I’d like to hear that answer, too, Jack
[11:48]  kaiya Manbi: me too!
[11:48]  Cummere Mayo: jack where do you get that name selection is whats costing you users?
[11:48]  Master Kane: Jack >> ok.. here is what I see with all this Display name stuff… if LL doesnt allow us to protect our original ID NAME.. then LL loses alot of users. And gains tons of childish people that have no clue as to how to do anything, what will Lindens do then (remember, theres only about 250 of you now and theres millions of users).. just asking
[11:49]  Rigrunner Rang: when my dad signed up to sl (groan lol) he quickly forgot his name & surname so didnt return for months, new users should be able to sign in via email addresses
[11:49]  Rigrunner Rang: if retention is the issue because of names…
[11:49]  Cummere Mayo: jack when the content creators and educational groups that pay for sl pull out, who you gonna send your resume too?
[11:49]  Driftwood Miles: It is difficult, and freeing up names is important but maybe a premium protected name would solve all of the issues.
[11:49]  Marianne McCann: I dunno. I don’t have a great fear of display name. I think there’s concerns, but I’m far more concerned about the teens, the non-profits, and other issues.
[11:50]  Marianne McCann: (Now that’s funny)
[11:50]  Charlene Trudeau: teens don’t worry me
[11:50]  Jack Linden: Cummere, it’s a point in the registration where we can see peope abandon the signup. It’s straightforward web analytics. We won’t get all of those people to move through with this change, obviously. But we do think we’ll get significantly more
[11:50]  Ciaran Laval: Protected names is the way to go, most people won’t bother, long term we’ll all get used to the display names issue, alternatively LL could lead by example and allow Linden to be used
[11:50]  Prokofy Neutron: You’re all being foolish. Display names are a genious idea. Please, rush it out as quickly as possible.
[11:50]  Charlene Trudeau: the ones that are griefer sorts are already in here
[11:50]  Cummere Mayo: and jack the moment i see another cummere mayo display name im filing a takedown. how will you handle that?
[11:50]  Dytska Vieria: It should be as simple as a user is not allowed to use a display name of an existing user name unless that user is the owner of the display name.
[11:50]  kaiya Manbi: i certainly would drift, allow those of us to put a black list on our names – the amount of names that would block is tiny compared to the thousands of names that are no longer in use
[11:50]  Charlene Trudeau: the good ones that mind the rules and stuck to teen grid are the ones coming over
[11:50]  Lamorna Proctor: As a business owner, I greatly fear Display Names. It will be a disaster for us, and ultimately for Linden Lab
[11:51]  Tammy Nowotny: TY Jack
[11:51]  Master Kane: I cant wait for display names.. (being premmie I get to protect my name for free) and Ill walk around as.. umm.. lets see here…. MaryCU812 BR549
[11:51]  Master Kane:
[11:51]  Cummere Mayo: jack how will you handle takedown notices of protected names?
[11:51]  kaiya Manbi: id even pay a premium every month for that right
[11:51]  lufpleh Obstreperous: Jack its simply, people want to protect a unique SL display name, charge them $100 per week
[11:51]  Drongle McMahon: It will be interesting Jack, but I think they will just find another convenient point to pull back.
[11:51]  Tammy Nowotny poofs early
[11:51]  Rigrunner Rang: yep, already seen new users who read an ‘owner ‘ group tag and read into it as a store owner, so names will make it easy for people to scam
[11:51]  Charlene Trudeau: is that lindens, Iufpleh or usd?
[11:51]  Charlene Trudeau:
[11:51]  Lamorna Proctor: Kaiya, we offer the BanClone service for that
[11:51]  Jack Linden: Cummere.. as I said.. if there are real world reasons why someone feels they have a claim on something, then they can talk to us about that.
[11:51]  lufpleh Obstreperous: US$
[11:52]  Cummere Mayo: thats not what i asked
[11:52]  Charlene Trudeau: signage, we already have that problem wtih groups and so on
[11:52]  Charlene Trudeau: and we’ve had to adress it over and over
[11:52]  Rigrunner Rang: will you wait until someon uses Anshe or Stiletto Moody before you take action?
[11:52]  Charlene Trudeau: not a new problem
[11:52]  Driftwood Miles: Would Linden look at name protection Jack?
[11:52]  Charlene Trudeau: now, Jack, what about the Atlas question?
[11:52]  Cummere Mayo: i asked what procedure you have for takedown notices of trademakred or copyrighted names?
[11:53]  Cummere Mayo: saying talk to us isnt a procedure
[11:53]  Molly Montale: One of the initial blog posts about user names said that user names will appear on the forum and blog comments. How will we know if we are seeing the real person?
[11:53]  Reita Vinaver: кошмар
[11:53]  Charlene Trudeau: user names are hte unique ones, Molly. Do you mean display names?
[11:53]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, if by protection you mean locking names from being used as display names, no. As I’ve said.. display names are not your unique id.. they are intrisically a configurably item like your height. Your unique id is the username, which is visible right through the UI
[11:53]  kaiya Manbi: display names will appear in the forums?????
[11:53]  Molly Montale: display names, yes
[11:54]  Seattle LeShelle: how can we talk to anyone when support and live chat is usually down
[11:54]  Cummere Mayo: jack its only visible if you know how to look for it
[11:54]  Master Kane: locking our original names jack. not display names
[11:54]  Seattle LeShelle: for display names to be used in blogs and forums posts is totally unacceptable
[11:54]  Aargle Zymurgy: but the question is *Trademarked* names, Jack…. what’s the procedure there?
[11:54]  Lamorna Proctor: Jack, I still think you appreciate the difference between the use of names like John Smith, as opposed to Lamorna Proctor or Stroker Serpentine
[11:54]  Seattle LeShelle: they should require your unique ID for that Jack
[11:54]  Cummere Mayo: and still im asking what procedures do you have for takedown notices of copyrighted and trademarked names?
[11:54]  Jack Linden: hang on, reading back a bit
[11:55]  Lamorna Proctor: so why can’t you provide protection for existing residents who want it?
[11:55]  Driftwood Miles: configurable as long as it’s not Linden… I surrender!
[11:56]  Master Kane: I have a motion…. ALl those with Premium accounts get their ORIGINAL names LOCKED by Linden Labs and therefor cannot be used in anyway shape or form by someone else. And when said person try to use said name, they automatically get banned from Futrue Second Life and Linden Labs.
[11:56]  Jack Linden: Aargle, I’m not part of the legal team, so I can’t be any more specific than I have been.. if people believe they have claim over a name then I would expect that they would contact our legal team
[11:56]  Cummere Mayo: because lamorna, the griefers couldnt have a new tool to drive us off. and a handful of computer geeks couldnt pretend to be you and ruin your business for fun
[11:56]  Equinox Pinion: if you trademark your name in real life lamorna they will
[11:56]  Rigrunner Rang: ie, after the damage is done Jack?
[11:56]  Cummere Mayo: contact your legal department? you mean the department that doesnt even bother to READ their mail?
[11:57]  Master Kane: lol cummere
[11:57]  Karen Illyar is Offline
[11:57]  Cummere Mayo: the department that has NO phone number?
[11:57]  Drongle McMahon: Why aren’t unique usernames enough for Lindens? As long as that name is protrcted, none of the arguments given can hold water.
[11:57]  Cummere Mayo: the department that failed to send someone to a court hearing last month?
[11:57]  Cummere Mayo: yeah jack that makes us ALL feel good
[11:57]  Cummere Mayo: we feel SO secure now
[11:57]  Jack Linden: Drongle, Linden is a real world company with real world brand and protections of that brand. So yes, we will protect that inworld
[11:58]  Ciaran Laval: Linden is also a real name Jack
[11:58]  Master Kane: Oh and we qare just pissants jack?
[11:58]  Zoha Boa: ZoHA Islands is a RL company paying +400 K US$ in tier to LL. Why can’t you protect us ?
[11:58]  EASY-TOOL Radar: enter chatrange: Suchalady Blackheart (9m)
[11:58]  Cummere Mayo: jack, many of the designers here are real world companies with bradings too
[11:58]  Cummere Mayo: *brandings
[11:58]  Imnotgoing Sideways: So, what about Linden St. San Francisco? (^_^)
[11:58]  Marianne McCann: Hmn. I suspect Voyager might be a company’s name out there, maybe others…
[11:58]  Drongle McMahon: SA are hundreds of other names.
[11:58]  Aargle Zymurgy: and I’m legally incorporated as well.
[11:59]  Rigrunner Rang: so again i repeat a person can take no action until they see someone using their TM? There’s no protective measures in place for anyone except Linden?
[11:59]  Drongle McMahon: *So
[11:59]  Cummere Mayo: thats what he said rigrunner
[11:59]  Drongle McMahon: I don’t want bto argue about this any more.
[11:59]  Lamorna Proctor: just to prove that Linde is a real name, how about this for a bit of light relief. http://www.birminghammail.net/news/top-stories/2010/03/19/hire-car-crook-is-facing-jail-97319-26062999/
[11:59]  Lamorna Proctor: *linden
[12:00]  Rigrunner Rang: yeah lets get some atlas info before the meeting s ove. How is the atlas blog post going Jack? near completion?
[12:00]  Imnotgoing Sideways: But, we get to use our RL names, right… What about when a Frank Linden signs up to SL… It’s now everyone but him. (^_^)
[12:00]  Jauquin Cascarino is Online
[12:00]  Dytska Vieria: tsk, poor Frank
[12:00]  Jack Linden: okays, I’m going to have to head out. Thanks everyone for coming along and getting involved. Even drift.
[12:00]  Imnotgoing Sideways: If there’s nothing to be afraid of…. There’s nothing to be afraid of. (^_^)
[12:00]  Lamorna Proctor: yeah, you can have any name you like, as long as it’s not Linden. What’s sauce for the goose should be sauce for the gander
[12:00]  Marianne McCann: Immy – I don’t recall specifics any more, but I do recall AOL having that issue with names in their heyday.
[12:00]  Ciaran Laval: Cheers Jack
[12:01]  Jack Linden: Take care all!
[12:01]  Rigrunner Rang: x_x
[12:01]  Driftwood Miles: Thooper thims Jack?
[12:01]  Master Kane: thanks jack
[12:01]  Equinox Pinion: take care jack!
[12:01]  Dytska Vieria: thanks Jack
[12:01]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!
[12:01]  Rigrunner Rang: thank you Jack
[12:01]  Lamorna Proctor: OK, thanks Jack. I look forward to the new Display Names proposals
[12:01]  Qie Niangao: thanks Jack
[12:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I had a funky name on AOL. (>_<)
[12:01]  Alexxa Despres: Bye
[12:01]  Molly Montale: By the way, there is a Jack Linden porta-potty on one of the Burning Man sim near the Man. It has quotes on the walls like “I love office hours… oops, time for my next meeting, ciao.” and “I’m afraid I can’t comment on that at this time.” and “We will be blogging on that but I am not certain when.”
[12:01]  kaiya Manbi: atlas question unanswered :/
[12:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Well… I have a funky name here too. (O.o)
[12:01]  Seattle LeShelle: he never answered the atlas question <s>
[12:01]  Equinox Pinion: bye all..see you next week
[12:01]  Luci Koenkamp: I just wonder why I still show up here
[12:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: … I like funky names. =^-^=
[12:01]  Scarlet Untermeyer is Offline
[12:01]  Marianne McCann: I was gonna say, “this is different how, Immy?”
[12:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[12:01]  oak Moyet is Online
[12:01]  Marianne McCann: Jave fun, all!
[12:01]  Luci Koenkamp: bye all, have fun
[12:01]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Bai you guyz! Xd
[12:01]  Rigrunner Rang: so who’s his alt? we can all come as that once names are implemented
[12:02]  Imnotgoing Sideways: HA! XD
[12:02]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Lawl ^-^
[12:02]  Alexxa Despres: bye all..good weekend to everyone
[12:02]  Driftwood Miles: Laters all
[12:02]  kaiya Manbi: its mad that we get one hour a week
[12:02]  Lamorna Proctor: OK, I have to go
[12:02]  Lamorna Proctor: bye everyone
[12:02]  Cummere Mayo: okay so he says write to the legal department. whose up for flooding thier department with postcards that say we are trademarking and copywriting our names?
[12:02]  Rigrunner Rang: and it gets busier each week heh
[12:03]  kaiya Manbi: surly he could give up two hours or get in another linden to help answer — man!
[12:03]  Rigrunner Rang: an ask jack agony column
[12:04]  Cummere Mayo: kaiya theres a reason hes secnd most hated linden

[11:01:15]  Nema Galicia: Jack I got something for you
[11:01:17]  Master Kane: Hi Jack, and welcome to your own Office Hours, where Linden Labs Research Customers, do not get answers…..
[11:01:24]  Qie Niangao: everybody is busy in Blender. Get used to it. :p
[11:01:30]  Nema Galicia: I didnt make the prims but I did have a huge say on what went on it
[11:01:35]  Nema Galicia: no offence just enjoy
[11:01:36]  Jack Linden: hey folks
[11:01:39]  Master Kane:
[11:01:43]  Alliez Mysterio: Good to see you
[11:01:48]  Jean Swashbuckler: hiya Jack
[11:01:49]  Marianne McCann: What’s the latest, Jack?
[11:01:52]  Ardy Lay: Hi Jack
[11:02:13]  Jack Linden: Small crowd this week!
[11:02:37]  Master Kane: ut oh.. jacks sitting.. this may be a long one
[11:02:39]  Drongle McMahon: Hmmm Qie. wait till they see mesh costs.
[11:02:41]  Nema Galicia: we have one just like it now at burning man
[11:02:46]  Marianne McCann: So how soon ’til we get “Clippie” in the Viewer 2 interface?
[11:02:57]  Jean Swashbuckler: ROFL Maria
[11:03:00]  Jean Swashbuckler: *Mari
[11:03:01]  Jack Linden: so this week we switched off AU and announced a date for Mesh open Beta
[11:03:09]  Ciaran Laval: Ha! Beat you
[11:03:12]  Marianne McCann: Hey Ciaran
[11:03:12]  Master Kane: and
[11:03:18]  Nema Galicia: WooT WooT on mesh
[11:03:21]  Alexxa Despres: I let you win
[11:03:24]  Master Kane: what else do you all have up your sleves?
[11:03:39]  Melody Regent: So Jack, I want to thank your people for the bone that was tossed to us in the LAND section of the Market Place. However, the beta is soon going to be over and we were told we would have a final solution. Although this is a bandaid on the damn, we still need something better. What are the options you are looking at giving us that is much better and user friendly?
[11:03:46]  Ciaran Laval: Hey mari, Drift
[11:04:07]  Jack Linden: Mesh is going to be pretty fun I think.. we had an internal demo a couple of days ago and we’re green lighted for the Beta. I’m hoping we get a lot of people trying it out
[11:04:14]  Master Kane: Jack >> Let’s (Linden Labs) focus on FIXING actual things instead of coming up with more garbage that the MAJORITY does not want. ( We still need to see numbers on how many wanted this display names ).
For me and many others that I’ve talked to, want things like Search to work, lower tiers due to lack of knowledgeable support, lower tiers due to lack of support, bugs fixed, stop adding crap to the viewer, better viewer UI (a start over), ripped/copy botted things to stop (close the TPV!) and I can go on and on. When you say Linden Labs is listening, they very well may be doing that, but they are NOT listening to those that fill their pockets with cash! Bottom line!
[11:04:18]  Driftwood Miles: Hi there Ciaran
[11:04:40]  Alexxa Despres: Hi Drift
[11:04:54]  Alexxa Despres: Hey Zoha
[11:04:55]  Alliez Mysterio: Jack, I do have a question about Second lilfe. Is it true Microsoft is buying sl?
[11:04:56]  Driftwood Miles: Hello
[11:05:02]  Jack Linden: Melody, I think the commitment was to basically match what we had in xstreet until such time as we could create a better land sales process on the web
[11:05:09]  Ciaran Laval: Tizzers isn’t the most reliable source
[11:05:13]  Daniel Voyager: Sounds exciting Jack on Mesh beta.
[11:05:15]  Zoha Boa: Hi everyone
[11:05:17]  Master Kane: Yes good question Alliez
[11:05:21]  Marianne McCann: Seriously, Ciaran
[11:05:22]  Melody Regent: what you have on there now does NOT match
[11:05:42]  Jack Linden: I know it’s not ideal but it’ll take us time to build land sales into the marketplace so for now, it’s at least a place where land dealing can happen
[11:05:54]  Marianne McCann: I’ve had a long time concern with marketplace. Not sure if others feel the same. If Marketplace becomes *the* way to shop in SL, then why have an inworld storefront (with the tier costs and hassles) when we can all buy 16m parcels to house our Magic boxes? Is there anything being dne to offset that>
[11:05:55]  Melody Regent: it is ALOT more cumbersome and difficult to set up. I would be happy to have a match that is equal, so when will we see the real match?
[11:06:16]  Jean Swashbuckler: good question Mari
[11:06:25]  Marianne McCann: Strawmaning a bit on my part, but I don’t see how that helps maintain use of inworld land
[11:06:31]  Alliez Mysterio: Everyone is wondering so I decided to ask you
[11:06:46]  Jack Linden: I don’t know Melody – I expect that as with a lot of the functionality we’ll be iterating on it post launch
[11:07:10]  Marianne McCann: Alliez – I think that’s the 200,000 linden question
[11:07:19]  Ciaran Laval: Are you going to give us a reasonable beta period with mesh jack? More than a month for example
[11:07:25]  Marianne McCann: (Is that the going price?)
[11:07:34]  Jack Linden: Alliez, I wouldn’t believe rumours like that. They are just that.. rumours.
[11:07:44]  Melody Regent watches what moves Jack will make as he dances around the MicroSoft topic
[11:07:59]  Marianne McCann: Ciaran – I know it’s been in private beta (alpha?) for nearly a year now
[11:08:01]  Jack Linden: Ciaran.. yes.. the Beta will run until we’re happy that we’re production ready.
[11:08:02]  Master Kane: lol mel
[11:08:23]  Master Kane: Jack >> Is Microsoft going to be buying SL and or LL?
[11:08:31]  Ciaran Laval: Sue Mari, but viewer 2 was in closed beta for a while too and look what happened there. Cheers Jack, that’s encouraging.
[11:08:38]  Alliez Mysterio: Im sure nothing can be said til its a fact. Would be nice to somehow let us know talking are on going or whatever
[11:08:49]  Jack Linden: Did make me laugh a lot though, seeing how that rumour spread across the net
[11:08:52]  Driftwood Miles: Jack there are some great features appearing on the Viewer 2 Beta and they are welcome and show the Lab are going for it. However these are all ADDITIONS and do nothing to make the experience easier for new users which has long been recognised as a major problem. What are the plans in the short term to make the viewer EASIER to use?
[11:09:16]  Ciaran Laval: The source appears to be Tizzers, whereas there could be truth in the rumour, it’s not the most sound base to start from.
[11:09:18]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Jack and continues to be picked up and spread
[11:09:32]  breeze Herrey: I think it should be cleared on the main site that yes it is just Rumers..this way we all don’t speculate
[11:09:40]  Jean Swashbuckler wonders if this rumor should be stomped down by LL PR
[11:09:51]  Ann Otoole: the slurl to this dumps people in the 4 corners spot. there are people there waiting.
[11:09:51]  Jack Linden: Ciaran.. importantly, it’ll be open while we work on it so you’ll see consecutive Viewer revisions come out as we polish the UI and fix things
[11:09:54]  Alliez Mysterio: I would think so
[11:09:57]  Marianne McCann: breeze – true. A certain level of clarity would help with the rumor mill
[11:10:11]  Xstreet SL Magic Box v3.0.11: Xstreet SL – Delivered item Regent Estates Home Office – Tier Central.
[11:10:11]  Jack Linden: Ciaran, it’s not a base at all.
[11:10:29]  Aargle Zymurgy: for a chuckle: http://marx.inworld.sl/2010/09/30/top-10-rumors-surrounding-microsoft-takeover-of-linden-lab/
[11:10:33]  Marianne McCann: I would dearly love to see a lighter (in color) UI as an option.
[11:10:45]  Jean Swashbuckler: Agree with Breeze…we have enough issues with SL and RL economy to not have to deal with this
[11:10:52]  Driftwood Miles: lighter in features as well Mari
[11:10:57]  Melody Regent: Jack, if they are rumor and not in any way shape or form, fact. It may be good to say something official. I am already seeing talk of people leaving and/or selling out.
[11:11:13]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Melody
[11:11:22]  Marianne McCann: Driftwood – I might disagree with you there. If anything, I’m glad to see 2.2 slowly creeping up to what 2.0 should have been
[11:11:40]  Jack Linden: Marianne.. or one where you can fully control the colouring
[11:11:40]  Driftwood Miles: I am thinking of new users Mari not experienced
[11:11:46]  Ann Otoole: if microsoft should ever put forth a tender offer i recommend all lindens research what happened with the eshop acquisition in 1996 and the subsequent happenings in 1997.
[11:11:58]  Marianne McCann: Melody – agreed. This is one to make at least *some* statement on.
[11:12:17]  Master Kane: excatly anna
[11:12:19]  Master Kane: ann*
[11:12:35]  Jack Linden: Melody, I’m not sure what the PR folks will choose to do. We’ve had these rumours before, many times.
[11:12:36]  Ciaran Laval: Making a statement about Microsoft will have LL’s legal dept walking on eggshells, I wouldn’t envy them
[11:12:48]  Ann Otoole: i.e.; don’t sell your home in sf and pull your kids out of their lives to go to redmaond and be terminated.
[11:13:00]  Marianne McCann: Ya, I seem to recall old Google speculations, back pre-Lively
[11:13:07]  Master Kane: so if youve had these rumors before.. what would make us think that this time they are not true?
[11:13:12]  Melody Regent: Yes, but moral is at an all time low in game. There are far to many things fucked up right now to let something like this go on ignored.
[11:13:15]  Driftwood Miles: I heard BP had an interest
[11:13:37]  Aargle Zymurgy: “BP… bringing oil to your shores.”
[11:13:41]  Jack Linden: Marianne, yes.. that was one that ran for a while
[11:13:43]  Master Kane: nah drift.. cant believe oil slug
[11:13:45]  Ann Otoole: hey if i won the powerball i might buy up a lot of shares lol
[11:14:28]  Driftwood Miles: I was talking about Belindas Pastries “as light as air”
[11:14:35]  Marianne McCann: I agree, though, Melody. This whole year has been on punch after another. Hard to keep moral and stuff up
[11:14:57]  Daniel Voyager: nods
[11:14:57]  breeze Herrey: It would be a sad thing if its true and Microsoft announce it before LL does, is why the point should be taken to put it up somewhere to clearup the rumors
[11:14:59]  Aargle Zymurgy: lindex is back to normal.
[11:15:01]  Marianne McCann: morale*
[11:15:02]  Jack Linden: how many of you guys will be trying out the Mesh beta?
[11:15:06]  Jack Linden: Just curious
[11:15:13]  Ciaran Laval: I will Jack
[11:15:16]  Driftwood Miles: For sure Jack
[11:15:21]  Daniel Voyager: Indeed.
[11:15:22]  Master Kane: why jack.. want us to go try to crash the beta grid?
[11:15:22]  Jean Swashbuckler: yep
[11:15:23]  Master Kane: lol
[11:15:24]  Marianne McCann: I’ve been in Mesh for the last several months
[11:15:26]  Master Kane: Im up for it
[11:15:47]  Jack Linden: excellent. so i’ll get some feedback in my office hours then?
[11:15:48]  Marianne McCann: (Yay for lifted NDAs!)
[11:15:55]  Bronson Blackadder: im already in the mesh beta
[11:15:55]  Master Kane: one thing though jack
[11:15:56]  Qie Niangao: I will, assuming there’s anything interesting to script
[11:16:15]  Bronson Blackadder: I must tel;l everyone here who hasent seen it yet, Mesh rocks
[11:16:15]  Master Kane: if we DO crash the grid… we do not get suspended or it goes on our accounts
[11:16:18]  Melody Regent: maybe lift a few other NDAs Jack?
[11:16:39]  Drongle McMahon: Do you want mesh discussions here Jack?
[11:16:42]  Marianne McCann: Agreed, Bronson. I’m concerned about what it might all cost in the end, but the results are so much nicer than, say, sculpt
[11:16:52]  Jack Linden: Master.. you mean in the Mesh beta? that’s a separate grid.. and no, you’d be fine (presuming it wasn’t deliberate of course)
[11:17:02]  Master Kane: yes I know jack
[11:17:12]  Jack Linden: Drongle – feedback here would be great
[11:17:14]  Marianne McCann: Better be okay, for the number of times the old mesh testing sims crashed….
[11:17:25]  Jack Linden: Mesh is one my projects so the more I know, the better
[11:18:03]  Drongle McMahon: Oh good. We xcan talk abot mesh costs when they are a bit more sorted.
[11:18:06]  Marianne McCann: Jack – I think, from a creator’s standpoint, i’m most keen to know what it will cost those of us using it.
[11:18:13]  Ciaran Laval: Mari can spill the beans now the NDA has been lifted
[11:18:14]  Jack Linden: Yes Drongle
[11:18:14]  Qie Niangao: There should be Mesh office hours on Aditi, too… may want to attend some of those.
[11:18:33]  Master Kane: Agreed Qie
[11:18:46]  Jack Linden: Marianne, yeah we’re still talking about what the upload cost will be, and what the relative prim costs will be
[11:18:51]  Driftwood Miles: is there any infos on poly limits etc?
[11:18:53]  Marianne McCann: oh, there are others spilling a lot more beans than I
[11:19:10]  Marianne McCann: (on Mesh)
[11:19:17]  Jack Linden: And also, how it affects prims themselves.. do we move to a larger prim maximum for example because Meshes will be able to be much larger than 10m
[11:19:52]  Ann Otoole: i think mesh will be great. as long as it doesn’t kill the core of the existing designers and cause a domino effect of land abandonment and large decrease in tier revenues for LL. A few LL buddies can’t float all of LL’s expenses.
[11:19:53]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, not yet but that info will start to come out soonish we hope
[11:20:12]  Driftwood Miles: ty
[11:20:44]  Marianne McCann: ‘s true, Ann. Well, it kinda goes back, to, to what I was sayin about Marketplace. How do we keep land being a valued asset, especially for creators to build, have stoes, etc.
[11:20:52]  Drongle McMahon: The problem isn that meshes will be costed by actual resource use, while stabdar and sculpted prims are not. This may preclude use of mesh in some cases where they could be much more resource efficient.
[11:21:06]  Bronson Blackadder: if there was a few more little options for normal prim editing, the prim builders will still be viable
[11:21:08]  Jack Linden: Ann, we’ve discussed that a lot internally.. around what the impact on the economy might be. We don’t think prims will go away at all, we think that it’s more a case of combinations of content types
[11:21:11]  Ciaran Laval: What are the concerns with how they render? Will they be a lag fest if not done correctly?
[11:21:16]  Drongle McMahon: * syadbar=standard !!
[11:21:39]  Marianne McCann: Ciaran -from my view, they’re easier render=wise than some sculpts
[11:21:40]  Bronson Blackadder: I am a prim builder and I still will build with prims, but I like the ability to use mesh too
[11:22:04]  Marianne McCann: An ya, I’ll continue to use whatever is best for the job. Sculpt, mesh, prim…
[11:22:08]  Ann Otoole: i see no group of mesh beta members out there striving to help anyone adjust. all they do is say gtfo and watch some magic tutorial that doesn’t exist. So the onus will be on LL for education.
[11:22:22]  Jack Linden: Ciaran, a Mesh can be costly if not brought in efficiently (such as the Physics shape for example)
[11:22:24]  Zoha Boa: Jack, will the current viewers be able to show mesh, or is there a new viewer needed ?
[11:22:41]  Drongle McMahon: Meshes can be much more efficienjt to render. The significant costs are downloas and physics.
[11:22:42]  Jack Linden: But in general, Meshes offer some substantial improvements if done well
[11:23:02]  Jack Linden: Zoha, for the Beta we’ll be pushing out a test Viewer
[11:23:03]  Bronson Blackadder: we cant really help too much yet because everything is still in flux ann
[11:23:28]  Zoha Boa: So the current viewers can’t display mesh ?
[11:23:36]  Ann Otoole: as for me i got in the autodesk assistance program and will learn 3DS max and the other high end tools. but rumors about darth ballmer and the microsith empire grabbing SL kills confidence so i hope it is all bs
[11:23:37]  Bronson Blackadder: nope
[11:23:41]  Marianne McCann: Zoha – I susect it will require the code for it. So ya… I suspect that’ll be the end of 1.23
[11:23:44]  Bronson Blackadder: at least not yet
[11:23:54]  Driftwood Miles: Mesh raises the level of specialist knowledge required to create. Even if prims do still exist the casual user will be less inclined to create as the mo has been moved
[11:24:04]  Drongle McMahon: Yes. All the stuff we have made is about to be destroyed some coding change ….. shrug
[11:24:39]  Bronson Blackadder: mesh will no more raise the bar then sculpts did
[11:24:46]  Qie Niangao: bullshit
[11:24:46]  Drongle McMahon: Drift. I think that is a very valid concern.
[11:24:53]  Bronson Blackadder: sculpts came around and everyone bitched then
[11:24:59]  Bronson Blackadder: this is no different
[11:25:06]  Aargle Zymurgy: well, the sculpties were never a problem.
[11:25:07]  Ciaran Laval: I think those proficient with prims will still make good stuff, even when mesh is here
[11:25:10]  Marianne McCann: Mesh is in many ways more specialized
[11:25:25]  Marianne McCann: Er, sorry, less specialized than sculpts
[11:25:28]  Driftwood Miles: sculpties are a blunt instrument
[11:25:30]  Bronson Blackadder: but if you can build a model in sculpt you can make a mesh
[11:25:31]  Ann Otoole: and assinine attitudes on the part of mesh pundits is having a negative effect. Maybe LL should take the mesh beta members aside and tell them to deal with it in a different manner. like being supportive instead of what is going on.
[11:25:41]  Bronson Blackadder: mesh just looks better and rezzes faster
[11:25:42]  Jack Linden: I also think that we’ll see component pieces done in Mesh and combined.. as we did with Sculpty cushions for example
[11:25:50]  Marianne McCann: I can see that, Ann.
[11:25:58]  Marianne McCann: to me, it’s just another tool
[11:26:04]  Driftwood Miles: “just”?
[11:26:14]  Drongle McMahon: Ann. Some of us are trying.
[11:26:27]  Bronson Blackadder: ann we WANT to help
[11:26:27]  Ann Otoole: i see it as a way to make better stuff with less vertices.
[11:26:38]  Bronson Blackadder: we just dont want to say one thing one day
[11:26:56]  Bronson Blackadder: only to have it change on us later
[11:27:11]  Ann Otoole: i also can easily make the prediction that whatever the maximum is the products will strive to reach it lol
[11:27:15]  Qie Niangao: mesh is much *much* more than sculpts could ever be. the avatar rigging alone makes it a game-changer.
[11:27:18]  Aargle Zymurgy: the problem for me with mesh is a matter of finding the right tools.
[11:27:20]  Bronson Blackadder: when every detail is solidified we CAN help
[11:27:34]  Jack Linden: Ha Ann, quite
[11:28:01]  Jack Linden: Qie.. yes.. avatar rigging is going to change avatar building. Some amazing possibilities
[11:28:05]  Driftwood Miles: Jack , how does LL intend to deal with the very likely influx of models arriving form no LL source…ie Renderosity, Turbosquid and all those other Freebie repositories?
[11:28:24]  Drongle McMahon: I made a rope ladder that exceeded the prim capacity of a whole sim.
[11:28:35]  Ann Otoole: yes. a 30 meter tall Cthu’lhu rising from the ocean to terrorize the mainland would be impressive.
[11:28:46]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, it’s not unlike all the textures that come from other places. If there are violations then we’ll deal with those
[11:29:17]  Driftwood Miles: a texture is not an end product
[11:29:21]  Ann Otoole: next thing you know all the super models are Victoria clones and are 30 meters tall
[11:29:58]  Jack Linden: True Drift (though they are sold as such), but the point is the same – we have a process for violations of IP – and it will apply
[11:29:59]  Nema Galicia: i want to be 30 meters talll but do i have to be a victoria clone?
[11:30:22]  Master Kane: http://blog.machinimatrix.org/2010/09/15/meshes-i-a-preliminary-tutorial-about-meshes/
[11:30:25]  Aargle Zymurgy: just tell the noobs how tall they are. Noob: “I made myself short like RL.” Me: “you’re 6’5″ Noob: “OMG!”
[11:30:33]  Qie Niangao: ah hah! big avatars need big parcels! I knew there was a land play in here somewhere.
[11:30:38]  Ciaran Laval: From what the mesh folk have been saying, you won’t be able to just download a set from a third party site, you still have to do something with it
[11:30:49]  Jack Linden: Ha Qie!
[11:31:04]  Jack Linden: Yes, our cunning plan to make avatars giant, to sell more land.
[11:31:10]  Qie Niangao:
[11:31:11]  Driftwood Miles: here will be plenty of scripts appear for conversions
[11:31:32]  Melody Regent perks up at the idea of selling more land “WIll you fix the marketplace to handle it too Jack?” Smiles
[11:31:43]  Zoha Boa: you will have to create a new linden home continent
[11:32:00]  Ann Otoole: the limits will cause people to have to have skills to segment models. but if I want a mansion that is on a model site and can’t do the cutting then i can hire a better modeler to make the rez package. Not for sale of course.
[11:32:53]  Ann Otoole: models out there don’t really follow typical SL land plot sizes though.
[11:33:19]  Jack Linden: It may also be true that those other sites may recognise Second Life as a new license opportunity and allow for use inworld
[11:33:33]  Driftwood Miles: hence the marketplace
[11:33:34]  Ann Otoole: but for 200 ktris/fr worth of mesh, which is a drop in the bucket, you can have a dang fine castle.
[11:34:16]  Ann Otoole: i read 2000+ ktris/fr here
[11:34:22]  Ann Otoole: 2 million polys
[11:34:35]  Ann Otoole: ten times an elaborate mansion i looked at
[11:34:57]  Jack Linden: I’m most excited about Mesh hair.. quite honestly.. because of how much more efficient it will be than prim hair
[11:35:10]  Master Kane: http://blog.machinimatrix.org/2010/09/15/meshes-i-a-preliminary-tutorial-about-meshes/
[11:35:12]  Master Kane: http://www.1up.com/news/microsoft-may-purchase-second-life-dev
[11:35:14]  Jack Linden: Prim hair is scary expensive in terms of load
[11:35:20]  breeze Herrey: thank god i can use better hair
[11:35:29]  Ann Otoole: i want cloth. like a dress like this that doesn’t have sredded prims dangling
[11:35:41]  Ardy Lay: Hell, they can’t even get the name right.
[11:36:18]  Ann Otoole: all we need then is real time reflectivity on the cloth and attachments
[11:36:24]  Master Kane: lol niiiiice landing sera!
[11:36:30]  Sera Lok: sorry >.<
[11:36:31]  Jack Linden: ouchies
[11:36:32]  Sera Lok: lol
[11:36:33]  Jack Linden:
[11:36:35]  Sera Lok: got all excited
[11:36:40]  Master Kane: mhm guess so
[11:36:42]  Master Kane:
[11:36:43]  Drongle McMahon: There are real dangers if attached mesh complexity is not limited.
[11:36:50]  Master Kane: bet 5jack liked it though hehe
[11:36:54]  Jack Linden: Agreed Drongle
[11:37:12]  Melody Regent: I want to see some EXPORTING from SL into RL. What kind of team allocations are you putting towards that. Like the ability to TP or change your body type in RL?
[11:37:19]  Drongle McMahon: So far there are no flexi meshes.
[11:37:25]  Master Kane: meshes cannot be exported
[11:37:51]  Ardy Lay: origami?
[11:37:56]  Master Kane: but other things.. I agree, mel.. we need a way to back up our inventories our selvs
[11:38:04]  Nema Galicia: Mel they will be blogging about that soon just not sure when it will come out
[11:38:05]  Aargle Zymurgy chuckles at Melody’s comment
[11:38:06]  Melody Regent: LOL, Master
[11:38:11]  Melody Regent: he didnt read it right
[11:38:12]  Jack Linden: Melody, we’d love to make teleporting work inthe real world.. just not sure we have the resources
[11:38:13]  Aargle Zymurgy: I’d like to export my abs.
[11:38:26]  Melody Regent: Maybe upgrade our servers?
[11:38:32]  Zoha Boa: it’s way to laggy in RL
[11:38:39]  Aargle Zymurgy: Jack… any chance I can get a bear? my collection is lacking yours
[11:38:49]  Jack Linden: Yeah, and a failed TP in the real world might be the last thing you do
[11:38:49]  Melody Regent: Would make the cost of housing less if we could use mesh for building
[11:39:06]  Master Kane: well come on mel….. rl what… hard drive or closets lol.. geesh.. you women.. )
[11:39:19]  Driftwood Miles: I wonder how many people would step into an RL teleporter that was labelled “Manufactured by Linden Lab”
[11:39:20]  Sera Lok likes her solid prims >:| dammit
[11:39:29]  Sera Lok: tp box
[11:39:51]  Master Kane: or, “May contain radiation”
[11:40:01]  Jack Linden strikes Driftwood off the alphatester list
[11:40:06]  Nema Galicia: can you imagian tping and comming otu ruithed in rl
[11:40:08]  Melody Regent: I told a client today how much his tier would be on the new house he was buying. I then went to the market place to find stroner coffee. Basically, it was a *fail* day all around
[11:40:08]  Nema Galicia: omgee
[11:40:12]  Zoha Boa: Jack, any news about prices for 2011 ?
[11:40:13]  Sera Lok: sorry i came in late… is ther something about IBM going on?
[11:40:14]  breeze Herrey: sorry
[11:40:16]  Driftwood Miles: <<is SO disappointed
[11:40:36]  Driftwood Miles: I prefer my hair on my head
[11:40:44]  Jack Linden: Zoha, no.. but I have seen the blog post draft so hang in there. More soon.
[11:40:55]  Melody Regent: Sera is is a rumor and Jack promised to call everyone personally to explain that it is not true
[11:41:16]  Sera Lok: i was wondering why LL doing all this new marketplace stuff if they just going to sell, but yanno… if it’s true just tell us
[11:41:25]  Master Kane: LOL>. 1-800-CALL-RUMORS, right mel?
[11:41:27]  Qie Niangao: wait. IBM? cool: a bidding war.
[11:41:33]  Dennis Lagan: It may actually be google. thats why the side bar was introduced. it will evolve to a google add bar that automatically shows relevent adds for chat and objects nearby. everyone will get 3000 sq m free land, with 1GB data storage (textures, prims, scripts, inventory). and if you want you can get more storage for a price ofcourse.
[11:41:34]  Alliez Mysterio: he didnt say it was not true only that its a rumor
[11:41:38]  Sera Lok: my phone number is:::: 555-1212
[11:41:40]  Driftwood Miles: Burger King are the suitors
[11:41:47]  Aargle Zymurgy: thanks Jack
[11:41:53]  Master Kane: well there is alot of urls on the web dated today
[11:41:56]  Sera Lok: so is it… somewhat true?:)
[11:41:57]  Master Kane: i posted one
[11:42:09]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Qie…if it’s a biddin war…then Dell will get into the mix
[11:42:19]  Marianne McCann: AOL, all the way
[11:42:24]  Sera Lok: nooooo
[11:42:27]  Driftwood Miles: or Autodesk lol
[11:42:27]  Ann Otoole: LL doesn’t respond to rumors. Make a tender offer instead and they might talk.
[11:42:37]  Jack Linden: Are any of you guys using the latest beta of Viewer 2.2?
[11:42:44]  Jean Swashbuckler: yes
[11:42:46]  Techwolf Lupindo: No
[11:42:46]  Jayson Dorn: I am
[11:42:47]  Sera Lok: i tried it for a bit
[11:42:49]  Ann Otoole: i am using the beta now
[11:42:52]  Melody Regent: Yes Jack, as a dart board
[11:42:52]  Jack Linden: How are you finding the tear off tabs?
[11:42:52]  Qie Niangao: Jack, using a dev 2.2.1
[11:42:55]  Sera Lok: i still hate v2 for various reason
[11:42:58]  Master Kane: I treid it Jack.. and sadly to say… its the same.. make me sick
[11:43:00]  Sera Lok: better but odd
[11:43:01]  Driftwood Miles: tried it
[11:43:03]  Jayson Dorn: lov the tear off tabs
[11:43:05]  Ann Otoole: Second Life 2.2.0 (210127) Sep 21 2010 16:02:42 (Second Life Beta Viewer)
[11:43:13]  Bronson Blackadder: omg omg Ontyne is buying LL !!!!!!!
[11:43:18]  Alliez Mysterio: lol
[11:43:18]  Marianne McCann: Still on 2.1 here. Keep meaning to grab 2.2
[11:43:19]  Sera Lok: i still can’t do simple things. like open up a tabbed window of properties for a selected amount of assets
[11:43:21]  Master Kane: slaps bronson
[11:43:22]  Qie Niangao: still really, really need to have profiles and groups available at the same time
[11:43:23]  Nema Galicia: not me again it makes me physicaly ill
[11:43:24]  Dennis Lagan: no, its hard to start using a product that was unusable at first.
[11:43:28]  breeze Herrey: no offense but im not crazy about 2.0 – 2.2
[11:43:29]  Aargle Zymurgy slaps bronson too
[11:43:34]  Ardy Lay: Second Life 2.2.1 (210917) Sep 30 2010 05:11:51 (Second Life Development)
[11:43:41]  Ann Otoole: only crashed a few times at Spikes party last night. made it over 1.5gb mem for a while. better than the old.
[11:43:41]  Nema Galicia: I would love to have a viewer i can use 1.23 is gettting old but…
[11:43:41]  Alexxa Despres: Me as well Nema…gives me a headache
[11:43:42]  Bronson Blackadder rubs both sides of his face
[11:43:42]  Sera Lok: i’ve been meaning to file a JIRA, jack, but i am TOO busy figuring out the new marketplace since everything changes at the same time…
[11:43:42]  Jack Linden: Qie, yes.. we’re working on revamping Profiles.
[11:43:47]  Techwolf Lupindo: Phoenix Viewer 1.5.1 (366) Sep 30 2010 10:36:28 (Phoenix Viewer Gentoo)
[11:44:02]  Sera Lok: yes, once again I think a Viewer1.23 UI would be a good and very obvious step to get people to adopt
[11:44:09]  Qie Niangao: thanks Jack. I’ve kinda lost track of snowstorm sprint plans
[11:44:18]  Marianne McCann: Too used to 2.x to go back to 1.23
[11:44:22]  Driftwood Miles: the bottom right confusion corner is too messy
[11:44:36]  Jayson Dorn: now see I love the bottom right corner
[11:44:38]  Jean Swashbuckler: good news on the profiles/groups
[11:44:38]  Sera Lok: but a choice of a viewer1 UI would be very nice as an option. not a necessity. an option.
[11:44:38]  Marianne McCann: Driftwood – I agree. I call it “the black hole” for a reason
[11:44:45]  Jack Linden: Drift.. agreed. That will get addressed too.
[11:45:05]  Driftwood Miles: that could be a huge improvement Jack!
[11:45:06]  Master Kane: My Personal Viewer 10.30.2010 (BR549) Sept 30 2010 12:08:26 (Second Life Release)
[11:45:08]  Zoha Boa Emerald Viewer 1.2 ….ups
[11:45:08]  Ann Otoole: once you use it steady for 2 weeks it is not so bad. especially with the sidebar improvements. but need the graphics enhancements from kirstens to make it rock
[11:45:19]  Nema Galicia: I want new options but wht i need is the same format I guess I am saying as 1.23
[11:45:28]  Jack Linden: Ann, which enhancements specifically?
[11:45:30]  Sera Lok: personally i don’t understand why LL is not doing better announcment of what is happening with profiles to web, etc
[11:45:57]  Ciaran Laval: This is easily the best version of viewer 2, by a country mile.
[11:46:02]  Marianne McCann: Overall I’m happier with it now than I was before, but there’s still some fixes that I’d love to see, as well as the planned enhancements to groups and profiles.
[11:46:06]  Ann Otoole: all of the extra panels for graphics in kirstens. complete control of shadows, etc. turning on shadows is easy, etc.
[11:46:09]  Qie Niangao: actually, 2.2 expose more of those shadows options in the Develop tab… it’s not Kirsten’s but its better
[11:46:11]  Driftwood Miles: 2.2 Ciaran?
[11:46:15]  Alexxa Despres: There are things I love about V2 but I DO think as Marianne said…a lighter color would be better. I think the drab grey makes it harder to look at…hence the headache
[11:46:18]  Sera Lok: nice, Qie
[11:46:21]  Ann Otoole: it is all debug settings in SLv2.x
[11:46:31]  Sera Lok: or just a few options that are easy to do for the lay user! with colors
[11:46:31]  Ciaran Laval: Yeah the latest one, I lose track of the number I just follow the forced upgrade
[11:46:39]  Sera Lok: a few ‘themes”
[11:46:44]  Ann Otoole: just a ui to make it easier than messing with debug settings
[11:46:49]  Marianne McCann: Ya, Alexxa – even if just a skinning option. It would make staring at this that much nicer
[11:46:54]  Alexxa Despres:
[11:47:04]  Sera Lok: nodnod skinning please!
[11:47:06]  Ann Otoole: stick it under advanced or develop for all i care lol
[11:47:09]  Driftwood Miles: K, I love some of the features, but confusion corner drives me to distraction, so if they fix that then hay…game on!
[11:47:11]  Ciaran Laval: When are we getting avatar physics though?
[11:47:17]  Master Kane: I read somewhere, that they were going to allow skins.. and there is some on the wikie already for v2
[11:47:18]  Aargle Zymurgy: I thought you COULD skin v2 by tinkering with the xml settings
[11:47:18]  Sera Lok: most of us don’t want to deal with xml files and blablah
[11:47:20]  Jack Linden: Yeah, skinning is a better option than us trying to pick the colours
[11:47:30]  Sera Lok: aargle see above lol
[11:47:31]  Alexxa Despres: Ciaran… your perviness is showing
[11:47:32]  Ann Otoole: kirstens has several skins
[11:47:36]  Jack Linden: Aargle.. you can I believe
[11:47:45]  Aargle Zymurgy: yes, sera. we said it at the same time.
[11:47:51]  Master Kane: I can see jacks viewer… UK Flag
[11:47:52]  Ann Otoole: also jack those windlight settings that are shareable are really great.
[11:47:57]  Marianne McCann: Heck, I’d even love to see the option to use a system UI option.
[11:48:12]  Ciaran Laval: It was a perfectly innocent question, I didn’t mention jiggly boobies
[11:48:13]  Sera Lok: i am a lazy one, i want pushbuttons. and draw distance changeable from the main panel
[11:48:18]  Ann Otoole: something else long promised and delivered by katherine berry and found in kirstens
[11:48:18]  Marianne McCann: Ann – for yers I’ve been waiting for sharable asset windlight, and region settings for it
[11:48:31]  Master Kane: Imprudence Sera
[11:48:48]  Sera Lok: just take a look at imprudence and do what they do (it’s what i use Master lol)
[11:48:57]  Master Kane: yep
[11:49:00]  Sera Lok: idon’t like using LL viewers anymore because of the better options from Imp
[11:49:06]  Qie Niangao: region-setting of Windlight really would make SL a more interesting place.
[11:49:09]  Aargle Zymurgy: well, I’m waiting for C#… then I’ll get excited about meshes and v2 client
[11:49:15]  Sera Lok: like searching in a notecard for a certain word…. for one tiny example
[11:49:21]  breeze Herrey: they they every fix the search window where you search for something tp , then have to search again?
[11:49:30]  Bronson Blackadder: I use a plethora of viewers
[11:49:38]  Marianne McCann: Aargle – I believe that was Babbage’s baby. You might be waiting for a while
[11:49:43]  Bronson Blackadder: including several versions of LL viewers
[11:50:03]  Aargle Zymurgy: yeah, Marianne… I got sort of excited when I saw his name turn up in group chat yesterday.
[11:50:15]  Bronson Blackadder: I like the improvements LL has made so far since the disaster of 2.0 and look forward to further improvements
[11:50:18]  Sera Lok: i would use LL viewers, in fact i PREFER to, but they just don’t offer features I tend to use every day
[11:50:19]  Marianne McCann: I so wish the LL viewer had the temp uploads of, say, Phoenix. I can dream
[11:50:19]  Ciaran Laval: They fixed it Breeze, then some buffoon decided it should be broken again
[11:50:19]  Aargle Zymurgy: I got the impression that the project was going to resume.
[11:50:50]  Qie Niangao: breeze: not exactly. you can go back to the last search, which is clumsy as hell, but (mostly) works. I’ve pretty much quit using in-world search, tbh.
[11:51:12]  Marianne McCann: Qie – likewise.
[11:51:44]  Jack Linden: What do you use instead Qie?
[11:51:50]  Qie Niangao: search.secondlife.com
[11:52:03]  Qie Niangao: it’s only PG, but at least I can get to what it finds
[11:52:09]  Jack Linden nods
[11:52:17]  Aargle Zymurgy: as a developer and scripter, I still find it easier to use something like Phoenix
[11:52:24]  Ciaran Laval: There are switches you can use Qie, I think &mat=7 allows all ratings
[11:52:30]  Qie Niangao: ooo!
[11:52:37]  Sera Lok: search could be great if you’re looking for a 5 word search.. except for the fact that everyone is targeting 1 and 2 word searches, which are a MESS, and so no one wins because the 5 words aren’t on good pages that are trying to target for 1 or 2 words.
[11:52:37]  Qie Niangao: thanks, Ciaran!
[11:52:37]  Ann Otoole: heh that marketplace search can be such a problem i made my own custom big google search for SLM lol. at http://annotoole.com
[11:52:49]  Ciaran Laval: The full list is on one of the wiki pages
[11:52:51]  Aargle Zymurgy: having named constants in my scripts is worth using a TPV for
[11:53:07]  Sera Lok: the Search is a mess and puts more power into the merchants’ hands than the consumers
[11:53:18]  Aargle Zymurgy: though I did work that out so I can do the same externally and then import into SL using V2
[11:53:28]  Ann Otoole: i am not having issues with the GSA in world. not at all. doing well actually. i learned how things work.
[11:54:15]  Sera Lok: not having a problem as a merchant or a customer? or both?
[11:54:32]  Ann Otoole: i’ll never make page 1 in jewelry. the top end has over 1500 products and 3-4 more per week. can’t compete. only 100 merchants per niche sadly.
[11:54:33]  Qie Niangao: incidentally, lest we fail to mention microparcels: Good to see GOLD COINS bite the dust, finally.
[11:54:36]  Ciaran Laval: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/SearchAPI
[11:54:44]  Ciaran Laval: It’s all there Qie
[11:54:44]  Jack Linden: Yes, Qie
[11:54:55]  Drongle McMahon: Oh yes Jack …. Haven;t discussed microplots for ages, so congratulations on the ending of the Gold Coins microplot empire.
[11:54:56]  Qie Niangao: (thanks Ciaran… bookmarking it now)
[11:55:09]  Drongle McMahon: Ah! SNAP Qie
[11:55:12]  Techwolf Lupindo: The biggest challenge for search I think was to showhorn in a GSA that was designed for web pages with content. Not index a lot of short describtions and keywords.
[11:55:15]  Sera Lok: ty Ciaran.. this looks.. updated.. lol
[11:55:21]  Ann Otoole: not having any issues as a merchant. since i mainly shop via blog feeds and word of mouth i seldom use search for personal things
[11:55:51]  Sera Lok: i don’t really use search and that’s how it works for me as a customer
[11:56:09]  Techwolf Lupindo: I wonder if the microplotter are simply going out of busness instead of being force off the grid.
[11:56:12]  Nema Galicia: i use search alot and prefer to shop in world
[11:56:31]  Marianne McCann: Ann – I’m much the same on that. I end up with word of mouth, favorite stores, etc.
[11:56:44]  Ann Otoole: the main issue i have with search today is events. LL really needs to begion penalizing these merchants spamming fake contests 24*7
[11:56:56]  Sera Lok: i like the classifieds, if someone can afford a good classified for a span of time they probably are a good biz. but hey, wouldn’t it be nice if money i paid for classifieds had SOME effect on my ranking in search? or is that not fair…?
[11:57:03]  Ciaran Laval: Well events and land search, land search still sucks
[11:57:06]  Ann Otoole: people stopped listing events because the spam makes it pointless
[11:57:08]  Jack Linden: Ann, that’s definitely a problem. It is much better than it was though
[11:57:13]  Sera Lok: even though classifieds don’t even SHOW UP in many viewers!
[11:57:34]  Marianne McCann: I still do list events, Ann – but I agree. Hard to find them burined under the spam
[11:57:45]  Marianne McCann: buried*
[11:57:46]  Techwolf Lupindo: I like to have a search where the only thing that can be returned is if there is a classified on it.
[11:57:46]  Ann Otoole: the endless 4000L event went away. now thee is the endless 500L one instead lmao
[11:57:47]  Master Kane: Oh that brings up a good one Ann….. all the spammers when you goto their shops for something or other, hunt, looking, random map tp etc… that crap has to stop
[11:57:55]  Ann Otoole: *5000L
[11:58:05]  Sera Lok: at least they do not effect search anymore so you don’t have “improve your life with furniture” ads every 2 hours
[11:58:26]  Master Kane: I will ar those everytime until it stops! I didnt ask for it and I didnt sign up for it

[11:58:45]  Ann Otoole: yea but we need people to start listing events again. 30000 regions and only 20 places have anything going on?[11:59:02]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Ann
[11:59:06]  Sera Lok nods, agrees Events need to have someone dedicated to watch the listings!
[11:59:07]  Jack Linden: Right, I’d best run.. thank you all for coming along this week!
[11:59:07]  Marianne McCann: Agreed
[11:59:09]  Master Kane: most are abandoned lol (shrugs)
[11:59:13]  Sera Lok: put someone on it Jack!
[11:59:15]  Aargle Zymurgy: ugh… try getting the feedback I get from club owners when other spam their places.
[11:59:17]  Marianne McCann: See ya Jack
[11:59:18]  Qie Niangao: Thanks, Jack.
[11:59:21]  Ann Otoole: thanks Jack
[11:59:21]  Jack Linden: Take care all!
[11:59:24]  Alexxa Despres: Bye Jack… have a good one
[11:59:26]  Aargle Zymurgy: bye Jack
[11:59:26]  Marianne McCann: Bye Bye!!
[11:59:27]  Alexxa Despres: Bye all
[11:59:29]  Jean Swashbuckler: thanks Jack
[11:59:31]  Zoha Boa: take care
[11:59:31]  Ardy Lay: Bye Jack
[11:59:31]  Alliez Mysterio: take care Jack
[11:59:32]  Driftwood Miles: Thanks Jack
[11:59:33]  Sera Lok: bye..:) cheers
[11:59:38]  Jayson Dorn: thanks Jack
[11:59:41]  Ciaran Laval: Cheers Jack

[11:00:11]  Master Kane: jack?

[11:00:16]  Qie Niangao: greetings, Jack

[11:00:17]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Konnichiwa <Hi> (^_^)

[11:00:17]  Master Kane: Jack >> I think this should take front row seat and I have a huge concern for some ripped avatars and content from SL, by people using Incognito (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY2-rnvYpjc) and Inertia viewers(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4ywcJVjMFM). This content is being posted on forum boards outside of SL and I have tried to contact Linden Labs VIA phone, and I keep getting these damned Ontynes! Even the Press number, and other numbers. The latter is -shocking-…. So my question is in two (2) parts: 1-) Is there any numbers that we can call straight to Linden Labs to report something like this ( if we file tickets, they would be deleted without the proper elevation ) so that we could get Linden Labs on it ASAP? and second part 2-) Should we mention this to the creators of the ripped/copybotted content, or let Linden Labs handle the outside world? (I have contacted several of these content creators and no word back yet.) ? I have alos sent Phil all the information that he needs to look into this is
[11:00:19]  AnnMarie Otoole: Hi
[11:00:24]  Sera Lok: Hello Jack
[11:00:30]  Jack Linden: Err hello!
[11:00:34]  Driftwood Miles: Hi Jack
[11:00:36]  Sera Lok: you just don’t wait do ya MK
[11:00:43]  Master Kane: theres your firast one jacl
[11:00:46]  Master Kane: jack*
[11:00:58]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Heh.. One heck of a greeting, no? (^_^)
[11:01:07]  Master Kane: nope.. I invest in sl and I want to know what they are going to do anout all this.. as many people invest
[11:01:17]  Master Kane: Yep.. and to think I shortened it
[11:01:30]  Imnotgoing Sideways: =^-^=
[11:01:41]  Sera Lok: wow, hate to have to hear you say goodbye when getting off the phone MK ;P
[11:01:49]  Master Kane: lol
[11:02:21]  Jack Linden: Okay, well.. first of all.. letting us know via Support is fine and does get through to the teams that need to know. There is also a security email address for exploits which I think is mentioned in the wiki
[11:02:59]  Jack Linden: Calling many different numbers actually doesn’t help, it just slows down our response if we get messages coming in from many places. Best to just tell us once.
[11:03:02]  Master Kane: please directme to it as I read about every page on that wikik that I know of
[11:03:18]  Master Kane: oh i know.. everytime they say ontyne i hangup
[11:03:19]  Jack Linden: I’ll try to dig it out MK.
[11:03:25]  Master Kane: ok thank you jack!
[11:03:37]  Imnotgoing Sideways: What gets me is that Ascent = Enertia(Minus some HAX) = Hazim = Crawlingin Meskin… Permabanned WU dude. (=_=)
[11:03:37]  Sera Lok: in case you all haven’t checked email in last hour, Avatars United is dead. lol
[11:03:38]  Master Kane: Im am just concered about everyone else as well
[11:03:46]  Jack Linden: I’m certain we already know about it though.. we’re very sharp and have many eyes and ears.
[11:04:17]  Sera Lok: Nod, support is absolutely atrocious. still.
[11:04:24]  Master Kane: what would I search for in the wiki to find this number jack? Securoty?
[11:04:26]  Master Kane: ity*
[11:04:47]  Qie Niangao: AU Dead, Sera? At least that saves me having to respond to all those damned friend requests.
[11:04:56]  Sera Lok: and if support doesn’t respond to issues
[11:04:58]  Master Kane: Hi Zoha
[11:05:01]  Sera Lok: then people send more tickets and more calls
[11:05:03]  Zoha Boa: Hi everyone
[11:05:03]  Hermit Barber: Jack: is the reason that LL is attempting to assert that using the LLDKU distributed by LL, used by code written by LL when it is present on a computer, is a GPL violation – which it most definitely isn’t. The GPL only forbids linking to (which this doesn’t) non-GPL code, or distributing non-GPL code with GPL code. Which TPV creators do not do. Is it because the alternative is 3 times slower in yet another attempt to discourage people to switch to LL’s Turkey on Crack disaster, or is there some even more dishonest reasoning happening as usual?
[11:05:04]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Yeah.. Bloggie just said it got poofed. (._.)
[11:05:16]  Sera Lok: and support is not responding to issues AFAIK
[11:05:18]  Driftwood Miles: Thanks for the land listings on the Marketplace Jack – even as a workaround it is a huge step forward
[11:05:19]  Jean Swashbuckler: Jack, different ticket than Master…but I have had a ticket in since Aug 19 on a money issue (failed credit process) that took place on August 12..that’s over 35 days in support for a $USD issue
[11:05:20]  Master Kane: I sent it to Philip as well via email cause ontynes dont think it is any importance
[11:05:36]  Sera Lok: hi Zoha
[11:05:58]  Master Kane: Hi Equinox
[11:05:59]  Imnotgoing Sideways: He’s mouse’n all over… I love AV head moves to follow the cursor. =^-^=
[11:05:59]  Sera Lok: LOL yeah Qie, no more annoying group add requests… only from in SL and in FB now
[11:06:04]  Jack Linden: Hermit, I’m not able to comment on that one I’m afraid. You’d really need to speak to the opensource team
[11:06:06]  Equinox Pinion: hi master
[11:06:47]  Jack Linden: Jean, I’m not involved with support these days – haven’t been since early this year but have you called them to ask about it?
[11:06:55]  Equinox Pinion: Jack, what about the script limits, did you put that in your “cancelled” folder or is it still on your list, if so any news about it?
[11:06:55]  Master Kane: Jack.. watch those videos also when you get time i can send you the notecard
[11:07:06]  Sera Lok: I’m wondering, since Marketplace Team is not communicative at all unless you bludgeon them…. if and when this discrepancy between $L value and $USD value is going to get resolved. It makes Linden Lab look reallllllllllly bad to those who understand they can buy L from different place on website for totally different amount.
[11:07:07]  Hermit Barber: Jack: They are not responding to that question. As ” Exec Director of Product” would you please ask the appropriate Linden to respond. It might be Oz.
[11:07:29]  Master Kane: Jack >> Sent the notecard
[11:07:40]  Sera Lok: not to mention the fact that it makes all merchants’ wares look overpriced!!
[11:07:57]  Sera Lok: oh, and screws your customers.
[11:07:58]  Jean Swashbuckler: yes, OnTynes pop it over to billing, Blondin sent a note…can I drop u a short NC you can pass on…OnTynes are baffled why this hasn’t been dealt with…Peggy closed it without resolution
[11:08:29]  Jack Linden: Sera.. I believe that is being taken care of.. yes. My understanding is that additional messaging is going in to explain to residents what the numbers mean
[11:08:39]  Jean Swashbuckler: know you haven’t been involved with support but no where else to go at this stage
[11:09:02]  Sera Lok: so it will be explained that LL is essentially taking 30% even as the same company that will sell you the L for 30% less in another location on the same exact website…….
[11:09:04]  Master Kane: email phil go to the top
[11:09:14]  Master Kane: might be weeks or months but still
[11:09:27]  Griss Alexandre: Is this Jack Linden’s office hours?
[11:09:33]  Sera Lok: now that there is no Exchange there is no reason for that disrepancy to be there IMO
[11:09:40]  Hermit Barber: Yes. He is busy avoiding questions.
[11:09:42]  Sera Lok: very negative
[11:10:11]  Jack Linden: All I can suggest Jean is to keep talkng to support directly, by phone.
[11:10:12]  Sera Lok: ty for your partial answer^^ lol
[11:10:18]  Master Kane: i hate that ctrl shift h sometimes
[11:10:24]  Jack Linden: Sera, the rates will be explained, yes
[11:10:32]  Sera Lok: is there anywhere that explains them now?
[11:10:33]  Jack Linden: Hey Griss, es it is
[11:10:35]  Jean Swashbuckler: ty…do it every day and update ticket every day
[11:10:42]  Griss Alexandre: ty
[11:10:58]  Chaley May: where is LL selling L$ at an inflated price?
[11:10:59]  Sera Lok: the USD conversion that is 30% more than actual conversion even by LL’s own calculations, i mean
[11:11:10]  Sera Lok: if you buy a product on Marketplace using USD, Chaley
[11:11:12]  Chaley May: i havent been on SL for a while so i havent heard this
[11:11:18]  Chaley May: thanx
[11:11:24]  Sera Lok: LL takes 30%+ the price and doesn’t tell anyone where it goes
[11:11:44]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Sandwiches. =^-^=
[11:11:45]  Griss Alexandre: I have noticed a descrepncy on the translation of LL to USD on the new marketplace for some time now
[11:11:48]  Sera Lok: even when you can buy L with USD somewhere on same website for much cheaper O_O
[11:11:52]  Chaley May: thats a lot
[11:12:09]  Sera Lok: yes..it’s been a problem :/ and not dealt with and needs to be!
[11:12:22]  Jack Linden: Sera, yeah we’re aware. As I said, we’re putting extra messaging in very soon to explain.
[11:12:31]  Jack Linden: Agree that it looks very odd
[11:12:43]  Sera Lok: it looks… like a racket. sorry to say
[11:12:51]  Equinox Pinion: Jack, what about the script limits, did you put that in your “cancelled” folder or is it still on your list, if so any news about it?
[11:13:27]  Jack Linden: Equinox, not cancelled but I know that the platform team has a long list of significant improvements they are working on
[11:13:38]  Equinox Pinion: ok..thanks you
[11:13:49]  Jack Linden: So I’m not sure where it sits on their timeline right now
[11:13:57]  Equinox Pinion: k
[11:14:12]  Chaley May: maybe they mistakenly added a 0… 3% sounds a more fair fee than 30%
[11:14:12]  Jack Linden: Have you guys seen todays announcement about AU?
[11:14:19]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Yeah. (^_^)
[11:14:20]  Sera Lok: yep just saw the email
[11:14:25]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Email, Twitter, and Blog. (^_^)
[11:14:27]  Jean Swashbuckler: yes, both blog and email
[11:14:29]  Sera Lok: glad i didn’t invest too much time there!
[11:14:52]  Master Kane: so does this mean that some of us will lose our regions to.. for….. sizing and better performances… lol JK
[11:14:54]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I mostly used it for pictures Cris would refuse to host on Snapzilla. (=_=)
[11:14:57]  AnnMarie Otoole: Jack, Concierge Live Chat is no longer permitted to do mainland sim restarts. They say “Submit a ticket”. This is unacceptable, we can’t wait days for a ticket to be processed when lag gets excessive.
[11:15:01]  Jack Linden: hehe Master
[11:15:03]  Chaley May: i havent seen the announcement
[11:15:04]  Master Kane: )
[11:15:37]  Master Kane: Ann… we get that too
[11:15:40]  Hermit Barber: Repeating and expanding: Jack, I understand that even though you are now ” Exec Director of Product” you are asserting that you cannot answer a simple question about motivation for a ruling based on a blatantly faulty interpretation of the GPL, with massive implications for the speed and stability of all non-Turkey on Crack based viewers. While you have suggested asking the question of the “Open Source Team” (which I understand to be Oz Linden),many people including me have asked the question, “is the reason that LL is attempting to assert that using the LLDKU distributed by LL, used by code written by LL when it is present on a computer, is a GPL violation – which it most definitely isn’t. The GPL only forbids linking to (which this doesn’t) non-GPL code, or distributing non-GPL code with GPL code. Which TPV creators do not do. Is it because the alternative is 3 times slower in yet another attempt to discourage people to switch to LL’s Turkey on Crack disaster, or is there some even more dishonest reasoning
[11:15:40]  Hermit Barber:  happening” or equivalent without receiving a response, could you, as executive director please try to do some actual directing and tell them to respond meaningfully.
[11:15:45]  Imnotgoing Sideways: オ～マイ～ガ～(O,O)
[11:15:48]  Jack Linden: AnnMarie.. understood. I’m really not involved with support these days so I can’t answer for changes they are making to their policies I’m afraid.
[11:15:51]  Master Kane: or they DO a restart without asking first
[11:16:00]  Sera Lok: wish someone was involved in support
[11:16:07]  Jack Linden: I hadn’t heard they had changed that
[11:16:12]  Driftwood Miles: a pride swallowing decision and just a little embarrassing but an indication of how serious you guys are to improving things
[11:16:20]  Master Kane: I told them my map was grey.. they told me.. “to contact the region owner for a restart”
[11:16:29]  Master Kane: omfg
[11:16:31]  Jean Swashbuckler: seriously Ann? Glad we moved our monthly concerts at the intersection of 4 Nautilus City sims to our private sims
[11:16:43]  Chaley May: where can i see this AU announcement?
[11:16:47]  Sera Lok: ontynes are about 98% clueless to anyone who’s been in SL for 6months or more
[11:16:57]  Hermit Barber: AnnMarie: Submit a “Sim Down” ticket (as an unusable sim is by definition down) stating the situation and requesting a restart. It will be cleared, usually in 15 minutes, occassionaly up to 30 minutes.
[11:16:57]  Qie Niangao: Chaley: http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2010/09/23/saying-farewell-to-avatars-united
[11:16:57]  Master Kane: agreed sera
[11:16:59]  Imnotgoing Sideways: http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2010/09/23/saying-farewell-to-avatars-united
[11:17:04]  Sera Lok: and 99.9% useless according to my calculations
[11:17:15]  Jean Swashbuckler: Sera, I have had some OnTynes who have really tried to help and in several cases did help
[11:17:17]  AnnMarie Otoole: Thanks Hermit
[11:17:24]  Chaley May: ty
[11:17:25]  Master Kane: that line just proved to me, that they are “some people are just dumb” (immy should remember that
[11:17:46]  Chaley May: never been able to find what i want on them blogs lol
[11:17:47]  Hermit Barber: Jack: What are you responsible for if you can’t answer questions about support or about product?
[11:17:47]  Jack Linden: Hermit.. this is a live office hour and you;ve asked me a question that I don’t have an answer for because I’m not involved with that side – so I can’t really do much more than let you know that. I’m happy to pass it on, and will.. but I don’t have an answer for you
[11:17:51]  Imnotgoing Sideways: XD
[11:18:00]  Master Kane: yep thats it
[11:18:00]  Sera Lok: i’m glad to hear that Jean:) i’ve dealt with about 5 of them and none of them are very friendly even when i present a very friendly and accomodating/understanding attitude.
[11:18:06]  Hermit Barber: Thank-you. I will expect a response soon.
[11:18:36]  Sera Lok: honestly if they were even halfway friendly i’d be more forgiving. it’s like you’re bothering them. definitely not worth dealing with for me.
[11:18:55]  Master Kane: ditto sera.. but they are not one bit nice at all
[11:18:58]  Jack Linden: In other news.. we’ve pushed a new version of the Display Names project viewer live with some of the changes that we talked about in the last blog post
[11:19:06]  Jack Linden: So if you get a chance to try that out.. please do
[11:19:13]  Imnotgoing Sideways eeps. (o.o)
[11:19:16]  Sera Lok: sorry, can’t use v2. lol
[11:19:18]  Griss Alexandre: I would like to speak to you about the display name project
[11:19:29]  Master Kane: Jack >> whats all this talk about TPVs not being able to use LLKDU now or much less call it in?
[11:19:41]  Imnotgoing Sideways << Display-ish name. (^_^)
[11:20:06]  Sera Lok: is it true that all new avatars will have the last name “Resident”?
[11:20:11]  Sera Lok: at some point in the future?
[11:20:18]  Master Kane: lmao sera
[11:20:29]  Sera Lok: hey it’s what i heard, lol. there’s even a JIRA about it!
[11:20:36]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I think they’ll get no last name at all, but, “Resident” will be tacked on for legacy clients. (._.)
[11:20:48]  Master Kane: http://imprudenceviewer.org/2010/09/18/regarding-llkdu/
[11:20:52]  Jack Linden: Sure Griss, did you have a question?
[11:20:55]  Master Kane: LLKDU info
[11:20:58]  Master Kane: hearsay
[11:21:15]  Griss Alexandre: i posted for the very first time last night on the changes thread
[11:21:31]  Jack Linden: Sera, we may use a default for new residents until they have chosen a display name, yes.
[11:21:32]  Griss Alexandre: to quote what i said: Jack Linden says that “The Display Names project also allows us to simplify the registration process. In the past, name choice has been a point at which many potential Residents abandon the process.” I believe they have statistics on this, but I believe that they are lacking information that would allow these numbers to be analyzed accurately.
[11:21:35]  Hermit Barber: Best of the Web for a vide4o on how broken the Turkeyu on Crack viewer is – http://www.ted.com/talks/seth_godin_this_is_broken_1.html
[11:21:58]  Sera Lok: so display name is going to be more important and viewable than username overall?
[11:22:15]  Sera Lok: basically the shift of true importance will be onto display name, not username?
[11:22:17]  Master Kane: SL is just wanting to be like Yahoo! is.. lol jk
[11:22:17]  Jack Linden: Griss, okay. I haven’t caught up on the latest comments today but I’ll be reading the recent ones later on
[11:22:19]  Chaley May: display names look to be a real mess for scripters
[11:22:31]  Master Kane: Jack >> LLKDU commetns?
[11:22:38]  Griss Alexandre: I believe that looking at the numbers of ppl that quit at that screen has a varient that has not been accounted for
[11:22:49]  Griss Alexandre: V
[11:22:52]  Griss Alexandre: How many of us have browsed to that page, because we were just “thinking” of getting an alt account? And how many of us have played with making funny names? I have. (/me hangs head in shame) I believe a large percentage of the people “almost” signing up for these accounts are doing just that. Especially if they know that every time they change the first name, a whole set of last names appears. And they could be on a different computer, as in my case, so if LL is keeping track, it would be a different IP address, and appear to be a totally new user.
[11:22:55]  Hermit Barber: Jack: You might have missed the question, what are your responsibilities as ” Exec Director of Product”, and what questions are you able to replay to? It will save us from wasting our time in future.
[11:22:58]  Sera Lok: all they wanted was a freaking last name choice.
[11:23:05]  Sera Lok: not to name themselves anything and anytime.
[11:23:07]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Yeah.. I already get people trying to “/hug Immy” Which totally confuses the script… Display names will just amplify that. (=_=)
[11:23:18]  Sera Lok: all they wanted was to pick a unique name at startup.
[11:23:26]  Jack Linden: Sera, not exactly no. Username is the unique id and will be visible wherever that is important. Display name is how someone chooses to be known and will appear above their heads etc
[11:23:33]  Griss Alexandre: SLname watch has all the available names- why doesnt SL?
[11:23:41]  Hermit Barber: Gris: There are some awesome non-linden name-getter pages out there.
[11:23:49]  Sera Lok: so if somone chooses to be known as sera lok and it’s not me, LL see that as ok?
[11:23:54]  Griss Alexandre: According to SLnamewatch.com, there are 10,880 known last names. That is hardly all last names in existance in RL, or that could be made up.
[11:24:03]  Sera Lok: even though i pay you guys tons of money every year to operate a business here?
[11:24:06]  Hermit Barber: http://slnamewatch.com/ is one of them.
[11:24:07]  Griss Alexandre: According to SLnamewatch.com, there are 10,880 known last names. That is hardly all last names in existance in RL, or that could be made up.
[11:24:19]  Driftwood Miles: It all seems a million miles away from Fast Easy and Fun Jack….isn’t it ADDING complication?
[11:24:29]  Sera Lok: agrees with Driftwood
[11:24:35]  Imnotgoing Sideways << Well… LL ain’t bad at making up names. =^-^=
[11:24:36]  Master Kane: Agree drift
[11:24:38]  Hermit Barber: Sera: Take is as flatteryt
[11:24:38]  Jack Linden: Griss, we can see that kind of activity compared to unique visitors. Also, we’re looking at hundreds of thousands of people who hit the name choice and then leave so it’s unlikely that it’s a large portion that are simply looking at names
[11:24:42]  Sera Lok: easy solution could have sufficed… let pick unique name at start
[11:24:44]  Master Kane: slow, scarey and stupid
[11:24:46]  Sera Lok: easy…
[11:24:57]  Master Kane: imhoo
[11:25:02]  Qie Niangao: Drift: this is left over from the Slow, Difficult, and Unpleasant regime. :p
[11:25:03]  Griss Alexandre: no. because I name shop from a different IP address
[11:25:04]  Sera Lok: but attention should be paid to merchants, etc ? don’t you agree Jack?
[11:25:11]  Driftwood Miles: LOL Qie!!!!
[11:25:15]  Alexxa Despres: LOL
[11:25:20]  Griss Alexandre: and believe me, i am not the only one that does that
[11:25:24]  Master Kane: lmao qie
[11:25:26]  Sera Lok: and their names. Do i have to go copyright my name now and DMCA anyone trying to use it for a display name?
[11:25:33]  Griss Alexandre: People do this when theyre at rl work, SHHH
[11:25:38]  Jack Linden: Drift, we feel it’s very important for Second Life that we make that change. It’s not easy or fun that you cannot choose your own name
[11:25:46]  Zoha Boa: How will people know if we put on a board contact our sales agent “joe cocker” if there are 50 joe ockers in SL ,
[11:25:58]  Griss Alexandre: Its not fun if soemone has my name over their head either
[11:26:04]  Chaley May: i think your name would be trademarked
[11:26:11]  Griss Alexandre: if you are intent on changing the sign up/name process, my suggestion is to forget the username idea, and have the sign up process of picking names like SLnamewatch.com. Be able to see ALL available last names. Be able to pick one, and add the first name of your choice, as long as it is not already taken- DONE. FAST, EASY, FUN!!
[11:26:13]  Jean Swashbuckler: Jack, who is the Linden in charge of Support?
[11:26:14]  Qie Niangao: (unless your real name happens to be Linden, in which case… no fun for you!)
[11:26:16]  Driftwood Miles: Hey I screwed up my name when I joine (looks above my head) but hey…..I kinda like it noww.
[11:26:18]  Sera Lok: right exactly
[11:26:22]  Zoha Boa: Or if a sales agent says pay ZoHa Boa 50 K to order a new sim that they send it to me and not to another ZoHA Boa ?
[11:26:26]  Griss Alexandre: and how is LL going to police the griefers taking advantage of this?
[11:26:31]  Master Kane: Ooooooh i getit… screw the exsisting resident and what they want or need… just please the noobs and eff the older ones.. and what they worked for all these years… GOTIT!
[11:26:32]  Sera Lok: i pay INTO the system so i guess my claim to my name is not important
[11:26:37]  Jack Linden: Zoha, no question that there will have to be aperiod when people get used to searching username rather than just display name
[11:26:46]  Sera Lok: sheeshhh….
[11:26:50]  Master Kane: Nice and clear!
[11:27:08]  Griss Alexandre: when being griefed, you dont always have the time or sense to look for that person’s “real name”
[11:27:10]  Zoha Boa: So Jack, we just have to deal with it ? Aren’t our businesses important for you then ?
[11:27:14]  Jack Linden: Griss, it’ll be policed in the same way that name griefing or any other griefing is handled now
[11:27:17]  Sera Lok: once again, when will LL take into account merchants and promientn names in SL?
[11:27:23]  Chaley May: Its worth pointing out that the Lindens see impersonating Lindens as being dangerous so Linden is blocked but they dont recognise the need for us to protect our own names
[11:27:24]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Erm… Some people make rather big money transactions here… To deal with that using a “Getting used to it” period is… Not smart? (O.o)
[11:27:40]  Griss Alexandre: and your staff has been cut, and i have heard these things take a while now. so will LL be able to keep up?
[11:27:46]  Jack Linden: Griss, both names will be there and we’l make it easy to copy the name to clipboard
[11:27:46]  Sera Lok: give some people who have been building Your World a little protection maybe??
[11:27:51]  Driftwood Miles: You mut be expecting a Tsunami of new sign ups from this Jack…such is the vigour of the sales job!
[11:27:56]  Griss Alexandre: and once the reputatuion of someone is harmed, can that be erased?
[11:28:05]  Zoha Boa: How will people know the 2nd name of Joe Cocker ?
[11:28:07]  Sera Lok: When can I know that sera.lok isn’t going to be running around? i can’t?
[11:28:20]  Master Kane: Im wondering ( an no offense jack or lindens) if some of that ignornace from ontynes isnt rubbing off on the lindens
[11:28:25]  Jack Linden: Chaley, Linden is a real life company with real life brand. There is nothing unusual about us protecting that.
[11:28:27]  Melody Regent: we have headr the line that people grief anyway, and they will still find ways to do it. This however, is just one more Labs sanctioned opportunity to so that
[11:28:33]  Sera Lok: i can’t report for griefing those peole i don’t know are using my name.
[11:28:35]  Griss Alexandre: This is a very disturbing notion to a lot of people. I wish there was a way to make LL understand what we feel
[11:28:42]  Zoha Boa: Zoha Islands is a RL company too , Jack
[11:28:52]  Griss Alexandre: someone could go to my store, and pretend to be me
[11:29:07]  Zoha Boa: How will people find ME as owner of ZoHa islands if there can be tomorroW 50 ZOHA BOA’s
[11:29:09]  Jack Linden: Hehe Drift, I’m not sure about a tsunami.. but we do think it will drive the registration numbers up, yes
[11:29:10]  Sera Lok: Exactly. New users will not understand and will be even MORE confused by multiple names
[11:29:12]  Driftwood Miles: I have tried it on the test viewer and it was a lot better than I imagined…but it still makes things more complicated…I hope it produces the results you obviously think it will.
[11:29:12]  Griss Alexandre: why make this sort of thing easier
[11:29:13]  Sera Lok: Seriously
[11:29:18]  Sera Lok: I dunno why LL not see this??
[11:29:20]  Chaley May: Linden also happens to be a real life name.. there is also thousands of real life companys rthat could be used as names in SL
[11:29:28]  Sera Lok: unless they just have NO appreciation for those who do BUSINESS inworld?
[11:29:55]  Griss Alexandre: then once this is enacted, it will be hard to go back. But if you gave the full choice of last names, as slnamewatch provides, that would certainly help people pick a name
[11:30:05]  Jack Linden: Griss, what makes you think that we don’t understand the concerns? We do. We’ve been listening and taking feedback for weeks and will be making changes to try to make this less concerning
[11:30:06]  Hermit Barber took a snapshot
[11:30:16]  Melody Regent: @Jack, are you giving ANY thought to having a way for those wanting to protect our names, a way to do so. Paying for it, adding a benefit to having a premium account? Something that gives us a way to keep anyone from getting it? People would take the extra steps and even money to protect thier names
[11:30:16]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I’m mostly worried that my freakishly unique name won’t be freakishly unique any more. (._.)
[11:30:17]  Jack Linden: But we still ultimately feel it’s the right thing to do
[11:30:20]  Sera Lok: then address what i’ve been saying please?
[11:30:21]  Driftwood Miles: Jack, as a reassurance……..if this Display Names proves to be a retrogade step…are you ble to pull it without too much trouble (should the need arise)
[11:30:26]  Griss Alexandre: less concerning is not the same as no concern
[11:30:28]  Master Kane: it is not jack
[11:30:35]  Zoha Boa: YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND THEM JACK, THAT’S WHY YOU CONTINUE WITH THAT STUPID DISPLAY NAME IDEA
[11:30:45]  Sera Lok: Please address the question of merchants not wanting people running aorund with their names
[11:30:52]  Master Kane: well.. wait.. yea.. do it and i bet you SL will lose tons of your high paying “customers”
[11:30:56]  Zoha Boa: WE WANT TO PROTECT OUR BUSINESSES, OUR REPUTATIOn
[11:31:03]  Jack Linden: Griss, it actually isn’t hard to go back.. if we needed to we could disable the feature.
[11:31:08]  Chaley May: but I think its not the real life aspect of names that LL should be worried about.. This is about virtual identities and what harm do you imagine that people could do impersonating Lindens in SL is any different to impersonating any other SL Business owners?
[11:31:10]  Griss Alexandre: why not have steps: you could add all available names at once, and see if that helps
[11:31:12]  Jack Linden: But we don’t think that will be needed
[11:31:17]  Sera Lok: let’s hope so
[11:31:19]  Melody Regent: @Jack, are you giving ANY thought to having a way for those wanting to protect our names, a way to do so. Paying for it, adding a benefit to having a premium account? Something that gives us a way to keep anyone from getting it? People would take the extra steps and even money to protect thier names
[11:31:22]  Hermit Barber took a snapshot
[11:31:24]  Griss Alexandre: then try letting “married people hyphanate their names”
[11:31:25]  Equinox Pinion: Jack, if there now way having us to pay for protecting our names?
[11:31:26]  Sera Lok: but why won’t you offer protection to your merchants????
[11:31:29]  Sera Lok: WE PAY FOR IT.
[11:31:32]  AnnMarie Otoole: For my scripting I will totally ignore display names. Use registered name only and it works fine.
[11:31:43]  Equinox Pinion: i would be fore sure willing to pay for it
[11:31:53]  Master Kane: I think it is clear to me.. as a rl business owner “LISTENING” to these people here.. thast they are afraid to lose what they have invested in SL, Jack. What is so hard to listen to that and see that?
[11:31:53]  Driftwood Miles: geez I never thought about scripting issues with this
[11:31:57]  Jack Linden: Zoha, understanding and changing are not the same thing. We do understand and we are balancing our design against those concerns. We still feel that the positives will greatly outweigh the negatives
[11:31:59]  Sera Lok: yes, we are happy to pay, we WANT the protection from LL
[11:32:08]  Griss Alexandre: what positives??
[11:32:14]  Sera Lok: nobody NEEDS to be sera.lok here except ME. agreed??
[11:32:19]  Griss Alexandre: i liked picking my first & last name
[11:32:21]  Zoha Boa: NEGATIVES…LOOSING 50K when a client pays another zoha ..?.
[11:32:23]  Equinox Pinion: i guess it should be easy to do as you can protect the linden names too
[11:32:24]  Sera Lok: or melody.regent or zoha.boha or anyone else.
[11:32:33]  Imnotgoing Sideways: People named xxxsexxyslut3713 can heave readable names. (^_^)
[11:32:40]  Jack Linden: Equinox, if you paid to hold a name then Display Names wouldn’t work. The whole point is that they are not restricted so that you can express yourself freely
[11:32:48]  Sera Lok: except for Linden
[11:32:54]  Master Kane: notice how logic get unanswered
[11:32:56]  Equinox Pinion: i dont think many people would pay for it
[11:32:57]  Sera Lok: Jack, please asnwer my earlier qustion?
[11:33:00]  Melody Regent: Stop ignoring my question Jack
[11:33:01]  Master Kane: hi nema
[11:33:02]  Melody Regent: @Jack, are you giving ANY thought to having a way for those wanting to protect our names, a way to do so. Paying for it, adding a benefit to having a premium account? Something that gives us a way to keep anyone from getting it? People would take the extra steps and even money to protect thier names
[11:33:07]  Equinox Pinion: and it would help the business owners
[11:33:10]  Sera Lok: Sera Lok: but why won’t you offer protection to your merchants????
[11:33:13]  Griss Alexandre: their freedomn to express themselves freely will take my freedom
[11:33:14]  Nameless Moonshadow: It sounds like this is the end of most of our second lives as we know it and the whole nature of the experience will change … I hear Jack saying …” we have made our minds up to do this … sorry if it hurts everyone in world … ll is just interested in new signups”
[11:33:20]  Sera Lok: [11:32 AM] Sera Lok: nobody NEEDS to be sera.lok here except ME. agreed??
[11:33:27]  Sera Lok: [11:32 AM] Sera Lok: or melody.regent or zoha.boha or anyone else.
[11:33:34]  Zoha Boa: We WANT to protect our names, REGISTER our company names? WHY DON’T YOU GET IT ?
[11:33:38]  Griss Alexandre: i dont think people dont sign up because thy dont like the last names
[11:33:45]  Zoha Boa: Or are only the NEW residents important to you ?
[11:33:55]  Griss Alexandre: This is so upsetting to us
[11:33:56]  Jack Linden: Melody, yes we have, but as I said.. that would undo the purpose of the feature.
[11:33:57]  Master Kane: thats it zoha
[11:34:06]  Sera Lok: if they do Griss, they give up too soon and don’t belong here anyway
[11:34:08]  Griss Alexandre: the feature is based on what data?
[11:34:13]  Melody Regent: not everyone would ask to have a protected Name jack
[11:34:20]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Griss…people don’t sign up for other reasons
[11:34:20]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Sould have a protection option in our own account to add our user name to a blacklist.. Maybe just like the tickbox that hides our AV from search. (^_^)
[11:34:26]  Sera Lok: no, it wouldn’t
[11:34:26]  Melody Regent: I doubt a very large amount of people would care
[11:34:29]  Jack Linden: The unique identity is the username. That remains unique. The display name, what is over your head, will not be unique.
[11:34:30]  Nema Galicia: my name is incorperated into my logo,i dont want that used
[11:34:34]  Sera Lok: so it’s ok for anyone to be sera.lok
[11:34:34]  Melody Regent: except those with REAL business
[11:34:35]  Sera Lok: ok fine
[11:34:39]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Auto-add to the banned words list. (^_^)
[11:34:39]  Sera Lok: anyone can pay my tiers.
[11:34:40]  Hermit Barber: For once I am on Jack’s side. LL confused identity (your avatar’s UUID) with an attribute, the user name (as well as access, permissions and accounting) right in the early days. Diosplay names are onme small step in the right direction, decoupling the identity from a name. Lets see how it works out before becoming agitated. After all, no mater how hard LL works, I guarantee we can all arrive as John Smith at Jacks first meeting aftewr display names are enabled and see how well he deals with it.
[11:34:40]  Melody Regent: and, for that, we would PAY FOR IT
[11:34:42]  Griss Alexandre: i dont want my name used
[11:34:42]  Master Kane: I htink they are tired of all of us oldies because we soemtimes ask for way to much. andthey want to redo things and reset things for the noobs
[11:34:47]  Sera Lok: and all the money you get from me for doing business here.
[11:34:48]  Master Kane: thats my opinion
[11:34:57]  Melody Regent: you like money, you all show it in all you do, here is a chance to bleed us some more
[11:35:02]  Sera Lok: why won’t you protect the merchants and service providers?
[11:35:05]  Melody Regent: let me keep my money, I will PAY for it
[11:35:05]  Sera Lok: simple question……..
[11:35:07]  Equinox Pinion: But i thought you will even change the transactions to display names and who the creator of an object is
[11:35:14]  Sera Lok: why won’t you protect us and our names?
[11:35:14]  Chaley May: In SL you will soon walk past friends and not realise it
[11:35:24]  Griss Alexandre: I have never asked for a thing, this is the firt time for me. i am very upset by this, and can see no good business reason for it
[11:35:34]  Master Kane: everything in live, you have to start over once in a while if things arent going the way you expect them to
[11:35:41]  Jack Linden: Yeah, I think that would be interesting.. a room full of John Smiths.
[11:35:42]  Master Kane: simple business startagy
[11:35:50]  Sera Lok: protecting your merchants and service p;roviders ensures they will actually be here in a year.
[11:35:51]  Imnotgoing Sideways: DERP!! DX
[11:35:52]  Chaley May: you make a new friend.. they change names.. then you have no clue who they are
[11:35:55]  Jack Linden: I do agree that this is going to take some adjustment
[11:36:00]  Jack Linden: It’s a bug change
[11:36:01]  Griss Alexandre: “some”?
[11:36:02]  Jack Linden: *big
[11:36:02]  Sera Lok: so are you going to give us some protections?
[11:36:10]  Sera Lok: any at all? for our names?
[11:36:11]  AnnMarie Otoole: I agree Hermit, I can’t see the problem. Use the nickname for converation, for transactions use registered unique name.
[11:36:11]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Freudian? =^-^=
[11:36:13]  Driftwood Miles: lol nice slip Jack
[11:36:14]  Melody Regent: even in real life, we have something called a TRADEMARK that lets people protect thier names
[11:36:16]  Master Kane: fluke more like it jack
[11:36:16]  Jack Linden: But we believe it’s necessary
[11:36:19]  Sera Lok: heloooo….
[11:36:28]  Ardy Lay: People on your friends list will have names highlighted in cyan or something. No matter what their current display name is. That will be awkward. “Do I know you?”
[11:36:30]  Master Kane: and you said that LLs IS listening.. no you are not!
[11:36:34]  Nameless Moonshadow: Not necessary for me…
[11:36:38]  Jack Linden: Melody, if you have a real world claim then you can file that with us.
[11:36:52]  Griss Alexandre: there are less than 11,000 last names out there. how is that anywhere close to running out
[11:36:56]  Sera Lok: So you will do nothing to protect your merchants and service providers with established names in SL?
[11:37:08]  Melody Regent: lol, ok… so if I trademark Zoha name, you will make him change it?
[11:37:14]  Melody Regent shakes her head
[11:37:15]  Sera Lok: the reasons are clear and obvious as to why you should.
[11:37:23]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Just make a tickbox on our account profile page… Right next to scripted agents… “Include my user name on the display name blacklist”. (^_^)
[11:37:23]  Griss Alexandre: will i have to trademark my name?
[11:37:25]  Jack Linden: Ardy.. the feature allows you to have those on your friends list show with green names so that you can easily see who your friends are regardless of what Display Name they have chosen
[11:37:27]  Sera Lok: So you will do nothing to protect your merchants and service providers with established names in SL?
[11:37:29]  Hermit Barber: Jack, I think you missed, [11:22:53] Hermit Barber: Jack: You might have missed the question, what are your responsibilities as ” Exec Director of Product”, and what questions are you able to replay to? It will save us from wasting our time in future.
[11:37:40]  Griss Alexandre: what sort of green name?
[11:37:41]  Chaley May: All they had to do was let people Create their own surnames too
[11:37:50]  Sera Lok: yes, completey agreed Chaley
[11:37:54]  Master Kane: All youa re doing is cutting the hands off that feed your alls pockets… fine.. thats great… but dont complain when you dont have nothing to use to buy things.. and like i said a long time ago… I think LL is forcing people out of SL so that they can go bankrupt
[11:37:56]  Sera Lok: that would have been fast fun easy
[11:38:03]  Sera Lok: and not hurt all the existing users
[11:38:10]  Driftwood Miles: Jack the whole argument sinks like the titanic when you turn around and tell us that the LINDEN name will not be open for use!!
[11:38:23]  Melody Regent: exactly Drift
[11:38:24]  Jack Linden: Sera, we will protect the uniqueness of your username and we will act if people use naming to grief you. We will not lock display names though.
[11:38:33]  Driftwood Miles: and it is not Irony
[11:38:35]  Griss Alexandre: i am wondering about some of the upcoming changes too? is this all for publicity? Is it the theory, that “any publicity is good publicity”?
[11:38:42]  Sera Lok: how do i know if i’m not around to see if they are using my name to do fraudelent business?
[11:38:44]  Sera Lok: So you will do nothing to protect your merchants and service providers with established names in SL?
[11:38:44]  Canipanic Maslow: i just found this response video on youtube about displaynames http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcgUmvcLccE
[11:38:46]  Hermit Barber: Driftwood: So far there are hundreds of ISO symbols allowing easy emulation of the Linden name…
[11:38:52]  Sera Lok: it doesn’t answer the question:
[11:38:53]  Sera Lok: So you will do nothing to protect your merchants and service providers with established names in SL?
[11:38:58]  Sera Lok: is the answer NO?
[11:39:05]  Imnotgoing Sideways: /rus
[11:39:09]  Imnotgoing Sideways: ☭
[11:39:16]  Zoha Boa: Jack, Will you give as also protect us by giving the L$ someone pays to the wrong ZoHa Boa ?
[11:39:20]  Melody Regent: four years in business and HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars paid a year
[11:39:24]  Sera Lok: not talking about filing grief reporst. we are BEYOND that
[11:39:31]  Griss Alexandre: jack, do you see how many are here in this room, and upset by this?
[11:39:36]  Chaley May: you should at the very least let islands ban names using a filter from access
[11:39:42]  Griss Alexandre: Do you see how many have posted about this?
[11:39:51]  Chaley May: so they can prevent people entering their shops impersonating
[11:39:54]  Jack Linden: Driftwood, as I’ve said above.. Linden is our brand in the real world. We have stated usage terms for that branding already, it’s totally natural that we would protect that
[11:39:55]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Yeah, I can imagine transaction rollbacks will be necessary. (._.)
[11:39:56]  Sera Lok: I am appalled that LL will not protect certain usernames
[11:39:56]  Hermit Barber: Driftwood: What LL needs to do is to make the Lindens have some other non-spoofable attribute of Godliness and not try to guard their name. Or they need to get into the nightmare of guarding all trademarks.
[11:40:00]  Sera Lok: totally appalled
[11:40:00]  Griss Alexandre: this is a BIG DEAL to us
[11:40:17]  Sera Lok: ok so if i brand name Sera Lok, you’ll disallow use of it as a display name?
[11:40:29]  Master Kane: I tell you this Jack. If anyone uses my name for anything.. and I get suspended for it. I will sue LL!
[11:40:30]  Zoha Boa: Is THE ONE person here in this room who likes the display name without protection of our businesses names ?
[11:40:39]  Melody Regent: @Jack, since you are insisting on doing this, come hell or high water, then give us an ESTATE TOOL that lets us turn OFF display names from anyone tht enters the sims. We turn it off via ESTATE and the display name will NOT show up
[11:40:40]  Sera Lok: cuz that’s what i’ll do then. i need to KNOW what protection you offer so i can protect my OWN if you WON’T
[11:40:44]  Master Kane: and I dont care if its for the smallest of thing either!
[11:40:45]  Griss Alexandre: I, for one, would like LL to remain successful. I really care about this place, and do not want it to fail in any way, but please rethink this!
[11:40:49]  Master Kane: cause LL doesnt care
[11:40:52]  Jack Linden: Master, we’re not going to assume it’s you unless the username matches.
[11:40:55]  Nameless Moonshadow: Jack… why are you here? you are not listening … noone wants this and someone in LL has said ” if we could only capture all those that come and play with names”… This is not the way to do that.
[11:41:00]  Sera Lok: right, just the new users will
[11:41:08]  Sera Lok: and half the population of SL.. no biggie… O_O
[11:41:17]  Canipanic Maslow: that video on youtube says it all . its a response to torl;eys video..
[11:41:17]  Chaley May: estates should have everything they need to protect themselves from impersonations
[11:41:18]  Melody Regent: @Jack, since you are insisting on doing this, come hell or high water, then give us an ESTATE TOOL that lets us turn OFF display names from anyone tht enters the sims. We turn it off via ESTATE and the display name will NOT show up
[11:41:19]  Canipanic Maslow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcgUmvcLccE
[11:41:20]  Sera Lok: Sera Lok: ok so if i brand name Sera Lok, you’ll disallow use of it as a display name?
[11:41:28]  AnnMarie Otoole: I don’t see the problem. If you are conducting a transaction you don’t ues display names.
[11:41:29]  Hermit Barber: Zoha: I think that it isn’t going to be a big deal and it will allow many other things to be fixed.
[11:41:32]  Griss Alexandre: People go to the name screen just to see whats there, after all. your numbers are not reality
[11:41:34]  Master Kane: yah like when I got ejected and suspended for saying SHIT in CiG and a rl female used FUCK in there several times AND challenged LL to throw her our
[11:41:37]  Master Kane: yah what ever
[11:41:54]  Canipanic Maslow: relationships can be ruined, money stolen,sure they get banned but ppl lose real $
[11:41:58]  Master Kane: I still want that effing fixed!
[11:42:02]  Sera Lok: . i need to KNOW what protection you offer so i can protect my OWN if you WON’T
[11:42:10]  Jack Linden: Melody, again.. that would just undo the point of the feature. Display Names are not the unique id. The username remains that unique id.. and it is visible throughout the UI.
[11:42:21]  Griss Alexandre: this is a few small issues, that could be resolved in small changes. Not a user name/display name HUGE change
[11:42:31]  Sera Lok: then why aren’t you making it work in v1.23 then Jack?? lol
[11:42:32]  Jack Linden: The only change here is what is over the heads of avatars, and you can choose to see both names there too, if you wish
[11:42:38]  Master Kane: LL suspended my daughrer too for an hour for sending NC back to someone that we all ard and LL suspened her.. and we all still get shit from the asshoole!
[11:42:43]  Melody Regent: If I dont want someone on my sim, I canban them? Why cant I say I dont want a display name on my sim?
[11:42:47]  Master Kane: what is wrong with that picture?!
[11:42:54]  Sera Lok: agrees with Melody
[11:43:01]  Melody Regent: that should not be YOUR right to tell me that, I pay for the sim, I should be able to control MY sim MY way
[11:43:06]  Sera Lok: let me ban people from my sims with display.name Sera.Lok except for me
[11:43:12]  Master Kane: You need better GTEAM people Jack
[11:43:14]  Griss Alexandre: where is the drive for this coming from, if not statistics of why backs out at the name screen?
[11:43:17]  Sera Lok: why in the world would i want them in my sim……
[11:43:17]  Master Kane: plain and simple
[11:43:23]  Jack Linden: Sera, we’re not going to refactor new features into old viewers – that would take far too much resource
[11:43:24]  Sera Lok: that’s not freedome of expression:)
[11:43:25]  Hermit Barber: Melody: Great suggestion. Melody, I have also suggested that estates be given a control permitting full avatar pseudonomity, ie, aside from a Linden, nobody would be able to tell the identity of the people using a pseudonomous display name on that sim (although bans,m payment, etc would still work).
[11:43:26]  Melody Regent: I make my own rules, do you want to control those too?
[11:43:26]  Equinox Pinion: but you will change the creator name with display names jack…why will there not be the unique names in it
[11:43:42]  Sera Lok: oh, i know Jack. but that undoes the whole point of display names if not everyone can see them )
[11:43:42]  Nema Galicia: I see why people would want to change there name a little or display name a litte if they partner or get adopted ect. you can set taht up with fees if you divorce or what ever, the rest I dont see why people just dont use the free titlers
[11:43:45]  Jack Linden: Griss, the blog post explains the reasoning.
[11:43:48]  Driftwood Miles: Is colour being implemented for the Display Names…so that people can be advised to “ignore the red one”
[11:43:57]  Melody Regent: I can turn off the ability to keep anyone from rezzing, that defeats SL too? doesnt it?
[11:44:05]  Melody Regent: I can turn off scripts? doestn that defeat SL?
[11:44:10]  Sera Lok: once again: ok so if i brand name Sera Lok, you’ll disallow use of it as a display name?
[11:44:14]  Melody Regent: how is turning off display names any differnt?
[11:44:16]  Griss Alexandre: I dont think you explained it, other than people stop at the name screen
[11:44:39]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Can’t turn off ~my~ scripts. AO override FTW! =^-^=
[11:44:39]  Jack Linden: Driftwood.. what would red mean in that case?
[11:44:51]  Canipanic Maslow: i could still go in your shop and chase away your ppl with your name .. in and out before they take the time to look closely
[11:44:53]  Sera Lok: i do BUSINESS as Sera Lok. so it’s the same as Linden doing business. Want me to brand myself, Fine, but will you disallowthat as a display name if i do? Please?
[11:44:55]  Driftwood Miles: the colour of the Display name text
[11:44:57]  Canipanic Maslow: the damage will be done
[11:45:01]  Griss Alexandre: is there data on that percentage? and do you know that it was me, when i went to that page from another loccation?
[11:45:19]  Jack Linden: So you want us to portray display names in red as somehow bad?
[11:45:23]  Hermit Barber: Jack: You just responded to a viewer development question. Do you have the latitude to pick and choose what you respond to? Repeats: [11:37:27] Hermit Barber: Jack, I think you missed, [11:22:53] Hermit Barber: Jack: You might have missed the question, what are your responsibilities as ” Exec Director of Product”, and what questions are you able to replay to? It will save us from wasting our time in future.
[11:45:36]  Nameless Moonshadow: It is not true that we need this for rp… group titles and Gorean Meter titles can do what ever we need for rp
[11:45:36]  Driftwood Miles: Geez Jack….I used Red as an example
[11:45:43]  Canipanic Maslow: will all vieweers reflect the color?
[11:45:44]  Nema Galicia: not bad Jack just so others are aware
[11:46:00]  Master Kane: I dont think LL has really thought this out… only thing that I can think of.. is that LL’s wants to use peoples names themselves to go around causing trouble and forcing us out of SL… sorry.. but thats my idea of all this seeing how some lindens act and do things
[11:46:03]  Jack Linden: Hermit, there are hundreds of lines of chat, notecards, IMs etc.. I answer as many as I can
[11:46:03]  Master Kane: im done
[11:46:09]  Chaley May: Well pretty soon SL will be filling with scripts in places dedicated to banning people with impersonating display names.. it will take up lots of resources which would be better handled by LL
[11:46:12]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Oi… Who’s got a problem with the color red? (=_=)
[11:46:34]  Sera Lok: ok so, she wants a simple list of what your responsibilities are at this position so we don’t come here asking questions that won’t get answered.
[11:46:36]  Jack Linden: Drift, if you just mean showing Display Names differently.. yes we’ve talked about it. No conclusion there though.
[11:46:46]  Melody Regent: well, our suggestions are falling on dead ears…again. So here is a new topic that can be ignored…again
[11:46:53]  Sera Lok: once again: ok so if i brand name Sera Lok, you’ll disallow use of it as a display name?
[11:46:54]  Griss Alexandre: No conclusion? what does that mean?
[11:46:56]  Melody Regent: @Jack – You are significantly behind in the announcement on land pricing. You have heard over and over it is coming, even been given dates that come and go at random. The delay is not simply a side note in your lives there at the labs, but a significant delay for those of us, big or small, that run a business here, based on land. Not proceeding with letting us know, after being told you would tell us, is disrespectful to your clients, no matter what kind of money we pay. It is important for you to let all of us know the future of land pricing, not just for peace of mind, but for BUSINESS planning and ongoing growth or stagnancy.
[11:46:58]  Hermit Barber: Jack: Well you have now seen that one. Would you care to reply. What areas are you responsible for? Are they the same as the areas you can answer questions about? If not, what are the differences?
[11:47:08]  Canipanic Maslow: katia keres pays for her name, i was able to change to that name in beta
[11:47:10]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Well.. V1 was yellow. V2 is white. Colors have changed already. (^_^)
[11:47:10]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Melody
[11:47:15]  Driftwood Miles: Ok , thanks
[11:48:04]  Griss Alexandre: If you are unable to listen to, AND CONSIDER, our concerns about this, who is? where does the buck stop?
[11:48:13]  Canipanic Maslow: about how long before a final decision is made jack?
[11:48:18]  Sera Lok: also when do you plan on implementing the atrocity of displaynames onto the main viewer so everyone has to deal with them?
[11:48:19]  Driftwood Miles: Does this replace the group title or is it in addition to?
[11:48:34]  Ardy Lay: Addition
[11:48:36]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Oh, I already do that. (^_^)
[11:48:39]  Jack Linden: Melody, I don’t have an update for you on that. As we’ve said many times, even if there were a change due we would provide 6 months notice. I know we’re late in announcing it – but I don’t have a date for you when the blog post will happen
[11:48:53]  Hermit Barber: Sera: You could trademark Sera Lok and then send LL a demand to stop cooperating in trademark dilution which would indubitably be tortable.
[11:48:57]  Jack Linden: I would assume no change unless you hear otherwise.
[11:49:00]  Imnotgoing Sideways: I have an alt named “Chevy Luv” and his group title is “I drive a”. (^_^)
[11:49:07]  Equinox Pinion: take your time with the pricing jack…as long as you wait as longer we have the gf tier for sure
[11:49:12]  Canipanic Maslow: that video on youtube expresses all this in detail same concerns
[11:49:13]  Sera Lok: mm tort
[11:49:13]  Canipanic Maslow: [11:40] Jack Linden: Master, we’re not going to assume it’s you unless the username matches.
[11:40] Nameless Moonshadow: Jack… why are you here? you are not listening … noone wants this and someone in LL has said ” if we could only capture all those that come and play with names”… This is not the way to do that.
[11:41] Sera Lok: right, just the new users will
[11:41] Sera Lok: and half the population of SL.. no biggie… O_O
[11:41] Canipanic Maslow: that video on youtube says it all . its a response to torl;eys video..
[11:41] Chaley May: estates should have everything they need to protect themselves from impersonations
[11:41] Melody Regent: @Jack, since you are insisting on doing this, come hell or high water, then give us an ESTATE TOOL that lets us turn OFF display names from anyone tht enters the sims. We turn it off via ESTATE and the display name will NOT show up
[11:41] Canipanic Maslow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcgUmvcLccE
[11:41] Sera Lok: Sera Lok: ok
[11:49:13]  Canipanic Maslow:  so if i brand name Sera Lok, you’ll
[11:49:14]  Jack Linden: In addition to, Drift
[11:49:16]  Master Kane: Another way for bots to sneak by LLs.. also all these models lmao.. oh gawd…
[11:49:17]  Melody Regent: NOt going to stop asking becuase we still have our own business to run and your broken word effects ours
[11:49:26]  Canipanic Maslow: oops
[11:49:34]  Canipanic Maslow: lost the video
[11:49:38]  Sera Lok: lol
[11:49:40]  Jean Swashbuckler nods at Equinox
[11:49:40]  Canipanic Maslow: faint
[11:49:52]  Driftwood Miles: k
[11:50:08]  Imnotgoing Sideways: Welcome back Danny. (^_^)
[11:50:19]  Daniel Voyager: ty
[11:50:24]  Sera Lok: so, the answer to all concerned merchants and service providers is… “It won’t be so bad, don’t worry so much?” Just trying to get clear what the short and sweet answer is
[11:50:29]  Jack Linden: Canipanic, if you mean a decision on Display Names – I expect we’ll blog again about the latest changes we’re making and then we’ll look to come to a conclusion on when to go live
[11:50:31]  Sera Lok: (re: display names)
[11:50:46]  Driftwood Miles: When do you think this could go Live on the Main Grid Jack….ball park?
[11:50:58]  Jack Linden: We’re stlil listening to feedback and making what changes we can to make it a good experience
[11:51:10]  Master Kane: yaknow… I see why people turn to griefing now… in all honesty
[11:51:18]  Jack Linden: Driftwood – unsure, it depends on the Viewer release cycle but certainly in Q4
[11:51:21]  Zoha Boa: you ARE NOT LISTENING JACK, WE ARE ASKING SINCE DAY 1 TO PROTECT OUUR BUSINESS NAMES !!
[11:51:23]  Canipanic Maslow: it’s a can of worms for sure.. what were the benefits again?
[11:51:33]  Griss Alexandre: i have to go back to rl work. (took lunch late to be here.)
[11:51:40]  Master Kane: LL doesnt give a crap Zoha.. sell off
[11:51:41]  Sera Lok: once again: era Lok: so, the answer to all concerned merchants and service providers is… “It won’t be so bad, don’t worry so much?” Just trying to get clear what the short and sweet answer is
[11:51:48]  Jack Linden: Zoha, shouting isn’t going to help
[11:51:49]  Hermit Barber: Jack: Why are you avoiding such a basic question as ” What areas are you responsible for? Are they the same as the areas you can answer questions about? If not, what are the differences?” which we know you have seen because you responded earlier, “[11:46:01] Jack Linden: Hermit, there are hundreds of lines of chat, notecards, IMs etc.. I answer as many as I can” to my asking why you had not answered this question before?
[11:51:56]  Zoha Boa: WHAT ELSE WILL HELP THEN ?
[11:52:11]  Master Kane: Sell, put a dent in their pockets
[11:52:13]  Melody Regent: He is upset Jack, why should he not yell, its not like he is being listened to much.
[11:52:13]  Sera Lok: short answer re: display names, “don’t worry be happy?”
[11:52:24]  Sera Lok: ijust want a short and simple and clear answer is all
[11:52:25]  Melody Regent: no I take that back, he is listened to, he is just not being heard
[11:52:36]  Master Kane: agreed Mel
[11:52:47]  Jack Linden: Hermit, the areas I cover are in my profile. I’m involved in most areas of Product, including Land. But I’m no longer involved with support
[11:52:50]  Chaley May: I like Display names… Only i dont like the way LL is handling them.. They seem to have the attitude where they want to wait and see what happens
[11:52:55]  AnnMarie Otoole: Its coming, Sera, File a ticket or an AR if you have a problem.
[11:52:57]  Canipanic Maslow: loveflowersinspring123873 will just select a equally long name
[11:53:11]  Sera Lok: “it’ll be fiiiiiine”
[11:53:13]  Howard Snowfall: i need a work
[11:53:15]  Hermit Barber: Sera: Simple and short and clear is incongruent with Jack.
[11:53:15]  Driftwood Miles: Maybe we could have grandfathered names
[11:53:17]  Sera Lok: lollllll
[11:53:24]  Sera Lok: Hi Howard, I can give you a job:)
[11:53:25]  Howard Snowfall: please
[11:53:28]  Melody Regent: At the end of the day, we know…KNOW display names will be here. we know we have NO CHOICE. We are, however, asking for some protections. SOme ways to protect ourselves and our business
[11:53:31]  Sera Lok: sit over here with me
[11:53:39]  Melody Regent: some of our business Jack have paid you MILLIONS of usd
[11:53:48]  Howard Snowfall: im over the college
[11:53:51]  Canipanic Maslow: how can it be hard to see if someone has that name , you already do that when people sign up
[11:53:54]  Melody Regent: Howard, this is not where you will find the help or a job
[11:53:56]  Sera Lok: exactly…. what Melody said!!
[11:54:03]  Melody Regent: Add display names
[11:54:04]  Melody Regent: GO FOR IT
[11:54:15]  Howard Snowfall: i speeak 4 languages
[11:54:19]  Qie Niangao: See, now, if we had display names, Howard could make some L$s for not changing his display name to Sera Lok. It’s to help out the economy!
[11:54:21]  Melody Regent: Give us a way tp protects ourselves as well
[11:54:24]  Sera Lok: LOL
[11:54:26]  Melody Regent: to*
[11:54:32]  Sera Lok: i know! that’s so much better than camping!!
[11:54:38]  Canipanic Maslow: perdonaly i cant wait to see who wants to be me
[11:54:41]  Canipanic Maslow: lol
[11:54:41]  Howard Snowfall: 100 ld per hour
[11:54:47]  Sera Lok: just pretend you’re someone who’s busted their ass in LL for the last X number of years
[11:54:48]  Melody Regent: howard, go here, they have jobs
[11:54:51]  Melody Regent: at this LM
[11:54:52]  Canipanic Maslow: personally
[11:54:52]  Hermit Barber: Jack: Is “Exec Director of Product” responsible for the viewer disasters? If it does, why can’t you answer some questions about them? If it doesn’t, should we give any weight to your answers to some questions about them? have any
[11:54:54]  Howard Snowfall: im a engenieer
[11:54:54]  Howard Snowfall accepted your inventory offer.
[11:54:55]  Sera Lok: because LL doesn’t have cocncern for that.
[11:55:21]  Driftwood Miles: Jack, new residents STILL have to pick a Username when you add the Display Name feature right?
[11:55:28]  Canipanic Maslow: i think this is called feedback people
[11:55:30]  Sera Lok: you really seem to be missing the point, or else there is some upper directive that won’t let you talk about it
[11:55:37]  Jack Linden: Melody, hence the changes we’ve been making. We have listened and we are responding to the comments. If we don’t change track completely that doesn’t mean we’re not listening or that we’re not taking it seriously. We obviously wouldn’t be doing this if we didn’t think it important
[11:55:48]  Jean Swashbuckler: @Jack, must be ur office hours…My ticket just got resolved lol
[11:55:53]  Sera Lok: so how do we protect ourselves?
[11:55:55]  Sera Lok: ?
[11:56:02]  Zoha Boa: ANd WE aren’t impoortant for you then ?
[11:56:08]  Sera Lok: BEFORE soimething bad happens?
[11:56:20]  Jack Linden: Jean.. spooky!
[11:56:36]  Sera Lok: how do the merchants and service providers who have established business protect themselves from display name fiascos?
[11:56:37]  Nameless Moonshadow: Please Jack … just give us a way to protect our names… our user names…
[11:56:38]  Jean Swashbuckler: lol
[11:56:39]  Melody Regent: We askd you to let us protect our names, in a variety of ways. Let us PAY for it or let us say NO DISPLAY names as a tool. Neither seems like we are asking to eat your first born child. Just protect the hundres of thousands and in some cases, millions of usd we PAY YOU
[11:57:03]  Chaley May: Linden Labs is interested in researching the affects to your businesses.. You are Lab Rats
[11:57:05]  Sera Lok: Nod, it doesn’t seem like that big of a demand, that ‘s what i don’t understand.
[11:57:24]  Sera Lok: LOL except for that Chaley.. that “Research” part of the company name
[11:57:36]  Chaley May: yeah
[11:57:52]  Driftwood Miles: Jack, new residents STILL have to pick a Username when you add the Display Name feature right??
[11:57:54]  Sera Lok: the funny thing is… it’s relatively a small group of peole wanting name protection
[11:57:56]  Jack Linden: Melody, we’ve answered that many times now. Your unique id, remains your unique id. It’s called a username. It wil lbe visible all over the UI. If people choose to see it, they can see it over your head too. If someone abuses names, such as impersonating you.. then abuse report it
[11:58:00]  Master Kane: Oh hell.. thats the name I will use then.. “Lab Research” and see how long that goes
[11:58:01]  Sera Lok: so why not accomodate us?
[11:58:14]  Chaley May: Thats why they dont do things the way normal businesses do.. they make a change and watch the effects
[11:58:16]  Sera Lok: what if we dont SEE the abuse?!
[11:58:21]  Melody Regent: no, you are not, we are asking for excusive protection will pay for…
[11:58:23]  Jack Linden: Drifftwood, just a username yes.
[11:58:24]  Sera Lok: if we are unaware of abuse we CANNOT REPORT IT!
[11:58:35]  Melody Regent: ok, so fine…. you dont want us to be protected from display names
[11:58:36]  Melody Regent:
[11:58:39]  Melody Regent: fine dont protect us
[11:58:48]  Melody Regent: LEAVE LINDEN NAMES OPEN AS WELL!
[11:58:51]  Hermit Barber: /title Just one of Jack Linden’s Lab Rats
[11:58:53]  Sera Lok: short answer i’m hearing is : “so what, we dont’ care about protecting our merchants and service providers”
[11:58:57]  Driftwood Miles: So how does that make the sign up ANY easier??? Whats the huge deal…it is no change!
[11:58:59]  Ardy Lay: Jack, how do we knoe that somebody we never see is using our name and causing other to hate and distrust us?
[11:58:59]  AnnMarie Otoole: But you can see the username, Sera. The sky is NOT falling.
[11:59:00]  Master Kane: So if the “Linden” name is reserved.. whats wrogn with reservign OUR names , jack?
[11:59:08]  Zoha Boa: everyone has a unique ID but you still protect the linden name? why do you do that, there is no need for because we have a unique ID
[11:59:13]  Sera Lok: i don’t think it’s falling, AnnMarie
[11:59:17]  Melody Regent: If it is NO BIG DEAL, dont protect the Linden name
[11:59:21]  Canipanic Maslow: give examples
[11:59:26]  Sera Lok: i’m just annoyed that a simple request by a small number of merchants is going unheard
[11:59:29]  Sera Lok: and dismissed
[11:59:29]  Melody Regent: if you protect the Linden name, then you are lieing that it is a big deal
[11:59:42]  Qie Niangao: (dumb question: is it still possible to buy a registered last name, like “RegentEstates” ? wondering how that can work, post Display names)
[12:00:14]  Jack Linden: Okay, my hour is up i’m afraid. Quite a heated one this week. Many thanks to you all for coming along.
[12:00:22]  Qie Niangao: Thanks, Jack

[11:00:27]  Alexxa Despres: Hi ya MK

[11:00:29]  Master Kane:

[11:00:30]  Driftwood Miles: Hey MK

[11:00:32]  Bronson Blackadder: oh yes the map lagger

[11:00:33]  Luci Koenkamp: hi Jack

[11:00:33]  Alexxa Despres: Hello everyone

[11:00:35]  Driftwood Miles: Hi everyone

[11:00:37]  Master Kane: He zoha

[11:00:40]  Daniel Voyager: hey Jack

[11:00:47]  Master Kane: dam jacks here

[11:00:51]  Master Kane: lets attack him

[11:00:51]  Bronson Blackadder: I had a fuckton of fun lagging out sims the last time you told me

[11:00:54]  Jack Linden: oh jeez, master

[11:00:58]  Motor Loon: have a seat jack and put up ya feet

[11:01:01]  Ciaran Laval: Drift, you were having a wardrobe malfunction back there

[11:01:04]  Zoha Boa: hi everyone

[11:01:06]  Uni Ninetails: Hey char

[11:01:06]  Alexxa Despres: <<doesn’t see Jack but takes everyone’s word for it….. HI Jack

[11:01:07]  Lamorna Proctor: hello everyone

[11:01:08]  Charlene Trudeau: hey

[11:01:14]  Melody Regent: Hello Jack

[11:01:20]  Driftwood Miles: LMAO Ciaran , I thought you didn’t notice haha

[11:01:23]  Motor Loon: he’s hiding here behind the couch

[11:01:24]  Bronson Blackadder: hey Jack welcome back

[11:01:24]  Charlene Trudeau: good to see you, Uni, Melody, Zoha and everyone else I can’t see yet

[11:01:34]  Jack Linden: hey everyone! one sec while stuff rezzes in

[11:01:36]  Ciaran Laval: I thought “Ah full moon soon”

[11:01:44]  Driftwood Miles: LOL too funny!!!

[11:01:52]  Charlene Trudeau removes huds and lowers draw

[11:01:52]  Driftwood Miles: Hey there Jack

[11:02:01]  Bronson Blackadder: quick bombard him with questions while he is disoriented

[11:02:12]  Jack Linden: Hey drift. And ‘no. not yet’.

[11:02:18]  Master Kane: gonna hit ya hard to start with jack… k? here comes

[11:02:24]  Driftwood Miles: LOL

[11:02:25]  Master Kane: #1 – Jack – >> What is happening to Support? We are paying for 24/7 support. That was one of the things that came with buying a region along with (back then) class 5 performance. We are NOT getting this now, or the knowledge of support so, it only makes since to lower our tiers to accomodate us on this. More things are happening AFTER 12PM SLT and there is no way to contact Support or Lindens as all of you say to use F1! We want our moneys worth (or I do).

[11:02:31]  Charlene Trudeau: Actually, I’d like to start with a thank you to the folks working on the world map issue and their prompt atttention once I started a ticket.

[11:02:36]  Driftwood Miles: I love that use of YET though!

[11:03:21]  Charlene Trudeau: I”m old enough to remember not having 24 7 supprt, when it ceased at like 8 or 10 each night and was closed weekends.

[11:03:34]  SayaNicole Cuttita: I’d like to know to masters question too….my sims been down for the past 9 hours thats just sad to me

[11:03:43]  Charlene Trudeau: try having an attack or a rollback issue late friday and not being able to get help until early morning Monday

[11:04:20]  Master Kane: Char.. yep thats the things I am talking about

[11:04:29]  Charlene Trudeau: It is a real problem, Jack, though we do understand staffing late costs, we NEED the support

[11:04:31]  Master Kane: Saya yep.. i agree

[11:04:34]  Jack Linden: Okays, thanks for that Master. I’m not involved on the support side so much now, but I don’t think they are having office hours yet so I can try to talk to it..

[11:05:11]  Master Kane: That is why I am asking here Jack… doesnt seem that these IMPORTANT thing matter to LL and they dont have OHs

[11:05:32]  Charlene Trudeau: Even if its open to Concierge level only thereby making the amount of staff needed minimal.

[11:05:33]  Jack Linden: ..the change to coverage hours is a recent one, and i know support are going through a lot of change right now as they try to get themselves into shape to scale up.

[11:05:40]  Master Kane: And we cannot talk to Linden on the phone ot live chat anymore.. so we ask YOU

[11:05:40]  SayaNicole Cuttita: Even when support is online theres no support at all…Live chat just continues to tell us to submit a ticket…which don’t get answered for months

[11:06:09]  Charlene Trudeau: Expand the number of states you can hire at home personell in, Jack <G>

[11:06:22]  Master Kane: yeah.. explain that to us plewase jack.. you kmnow.. get themselvesin shape.. just tell us that UK is closing and what next….

[11:06:26]  Jack Linden: I know a few folks have told me they are frustrated with it and I’ve passed that on. I don’ t have a fix though – that is down to the support group, but they are very aware that for some issues especially they need to be responsive

[11:06:37]  Luci Koenkamp: I agree I tried to buy abandoned mainland a month ago and the ticket hasn´t been opened

[11:06:45]  Ciaran Laval: You need support to be in-house, not some outsourced firm

[11:06:57]  Master Kane: yes please do pass it along.. I have a email ready for phil… when time comes

[11:07:18]  Master Kane: Luci.. yoru lucky an ONTYNE didnt close it

[11:07:20]  Master Kane: lmao

[11:07:22]  Jack Linden: Will do Master. If you have a specific example, drop that to me so i can pass that on as well

[11:07:32]  Melody Regent: better move love, people keep landing on your head

[11:07:49]  Master Kane: thank Jacks.. appreciate it

[11:07:54]  Luci Koenkamp: its not funny, as if there isn´t enough abandoned mainland already

[11:07:57]  Master Kane: ok #2

[11:07:57]  Master Kane: #2 – Jack –>:> People are LEAVING SL due to the rediculous changes that LL is making, how can LL sit here and say that they are “Gaining in useablitlty and users” ??

[11:08:15]  Nema Galicia: t-y mel

[11:08:52]  Jack Linden: Which decisions particularly?

[11:08:58]  Master Kane: I know quiet a few that have left due to some of these changes.. could it be wise to include all things that LL has planned for its users to see as a whole and not after the facts?

[11:09:01]  Unable to send your message to the chat session with [RECIPIENT], However the server might send it again anyway. Error making request, please try again later.

[11:09:13]  Master Kane: Plenty of blog entries, jack

[11:09:24]  Luci Koenkamp: more will leave when you close Xstreet so soon

[11:09:26]  Driftwood Miles: Is there any indication when pricing is being blogged Jack?

[11:09:32]  Master Kane: Agree Luci

[11:09:46]  Melody Regent: lol, Jack. The lack of customer support, the diplay names, the promise to keep us informed and dont. The secrets behind closed doors. We went to dinner and you said you would call and you never did DAMN YOU. Wait, that was someone else

[11:10:02]  Uni Ninetails: Marketplace isnt ready, i forget the jira but being unable to change the object assigned to a listing is a pain in the ass.

[11:10:05]  Jack Linden: Yeah, I know Master. We have made a significant change in our working practice to allow us to be open about roadmaps etc. We have only just started but you’re going to see a ton more info coming out about what the teams are doing

[11:10:06]  Master Kane: yah mel.. guess we have to spell it out for him hehehe

[11:10:22]  Ciaran Laval: Xstreet closing isn’t as big a concern as people moving to the marketplace and ditching land

[11:10:23]  Charlene Trudeau: oh yeah, do we want to get started on the intermediary steps for replacing the xstreet land store wtih whatever it is you’re doing? (forums?)

[11:10:31]  Jack Linden: ..and you’ll see a lot more early Project Viewers that let you see asingle feature as it’s being worked on

[11:10:37]  Luci Koenkamp: like the market team? They really listen

[11:11:07]  Master Kane: yes.. that would be nice to know jack.. what LL is planning.. (hence.. LL listening – they are not still – they chose to listen to what they want to) and therefore help all at once and not just a few

[11:11:21]  Jack Linden: It was unfortunate that Display Names pre-dates the new way we’re tryingto work, so that one wasn’t able to be as open as early as we’d have liked. But we’re now making sure that we listen and change as needed to ship that in a way that makes sense

[11:11:40]  Jack Linden: The marketplace team have been awesome at taking feedback and iterating on it

[11:11:44]  Melody Regent: dont even get me started on being shafted about the land in the Market place. When will we see that again… IF we see it again

[11:11:58]  Jack Linden: It’s on the backlog Melody, and will be there

[11:12:02]  Luci Koenkamp: yes but they will close Xstreet too early

[11:12:10]  Rene Erlanger: Jack…a question please! – I cannot believe Linden Lab has become so idiotic in the way it has tampered with SEARCH.

I mean seriously….for 7 years SL Businesses have been either buying up or renting land, most of which are on MATURE rated Sims, and considering nearly 70% of SL’s land mass is made up of mature rated SIMs. It also holds true that plenty of these businesses actually are PG in terms of content created and sold e.g most Fashion, hair, Prefabs, most Furniture, Textures, Sculpties, Gadgets, Scripts etc etc……now Linden Lab in their infinite stupidity has decided that the option to untick Mature rating is not a functionable option in About Land and therefore excluded from any PG Searches.

What the hell are LL trying to do?…..is this some back-door strategy to stimulate the land economy of PG rated sims (i.e Mainland in particular) or this because of the proposed Teen Grid Merger?

Totally bizarre…just when you think it couldn’t get any worst…..we get more brain cramp!

[11:12:18]  Melody Regent: o.O

[11:12:40]  Luci Koenkamp: I like the new market but you´ll loose a lot of sales by closing too fast

[11:12:55]  Jack Linden: Luci.. you know, that is a tough call. when to close xstreet. I can tell you that it doesn’t do anyone any good to have two sites running at once. But we felt that was needed so that we can orient merchants and make sure the site is solid.

[11:12:59]  Master Kane: Jack — Oh yah… what happened to fixing all these bugs, jira and stop making more things for people to do and fancy themselves… who really cares about a name at this point… if your car is missing a wheel.. are you going to continue to drive it (you can)? No, your going to get it fixed so that you can SAVE on gas milage.. hence users

[11:13:05]  Jack Linden: But there comes a point when you have to make that jump.

[11:13:24]  Luci Koenkamp: I understand but still I think it´s too soon

[11:13:34]  Luci Koenkamp: give it 2 more weeks

[11:13:37]  Uni Ninetails: Sighs, and i have to relist everything cause of version numbering. *grumbles.

[11:15:03]  Luci Koenkamp: how about mainland support Jack, a few months ago everything went smooth now nothing seems to happen

[11:15:05]  Jack Linden: Master, that work is happening too and in fact much more of that is being done than ever before. A lot of our engineering resource is on fixing the basics

[11:15:05]  Master Kane: Rene.. you’ve noticed that too huh..

[11:15:27]  Rene Erlanger: well- i’d like Jack to answer my question

[11:15:28]  Charlene Trudeau: “…..now Linden Lab in their infinite stupidity has decided that the option to untick Mature rating is not a functionable option in About Land and therefore excluded from any PG Searches. ” This has gone back and forth through various releases over the last five years and is why I used to maintain one PG region on my estate always that was skybeam searchable. Right now I have one privately held homestead that is not an ad for skybeam that is PG. I agree this is a big issue.

[11:15:29]  Master Kane: Jack.. yesw.. thye are being called Channels.. yes I read about them

[11:15:41]  Jack Linden: And Master, we wouldn’t be spending resource on something like Display Names if we didn’t think it was very important.

[11:16:02]  Ciaran Laval: Yes the mature content tickbox is now redundant, which was an exctremely silly move

[11:16:04]  Qie Niangao: Jack, you should do yourself a favor and get the Search team to have office hours. (They also need to find a better approach to maturity-rating authorization, so search.secondlife.com isn’t PG-only)

[11:16:05]  Master Kane: Umm screw display names.. I want my 24/7 support jack… bottom line

[11:16:30]  Giancarlo Takacs: agrees with Master

[11:16:35]  Jack Linden: Rene, I hear you.. it’s something we’ve been talking a lot about. It’s made tricky because of course a Mature region can have just PG stuff in, but that’s impossible for us to know for sure

[11:16:40]  Tigra Mochi: why is the support now only Ontyne and not Linden Concierge, JAck?

[11:16:43]  Master Kane: that or lower my GD tiers

[11:17:02]  Lisa – Regent Land Bot: LandMark giver at MLCC (Regent Estates Home Office) has just been used by Pete Godric !

[11:17:03]  Lamorna Proctor: I guess to summarize people’s concerns, it that Linden Lab’s priorities are wrong

[11:17:06]  Rene Erlanger: Jack….you’ve moved the bleeding goal poast

[11:17:06]  Bronson Blackadder: Screw Display name would be a good display name

[11:17:18]  Rene Erlanger: why is 70% of the gird Matuure rated

[11:17:22]  Jack Linden: Qie, the search team are doing a bunch of work around maturity actually.. we know the way it’s handled right now isn’t good enough

[11:17:26]  Ciaran Laval: Well whilst we’re all supposed to be over 18 Jack,, it ain’t really a big issue and you happily have PG parcels next to mature, so there’s no real issue here about unticked mature parcels appearing in PG search

[11:17:28]  Master Kane: lol bronson

[11:17:53]  Charlene Trudeau: Jack, we need one of those handy tutorials that pop up when someone opens search for the first time ‘current settings are defaulted to PG content only. To see Mature content, check blah blah blah, to see adult content, please age verify and check that box too’

[11:17:56]  Melody Regent: weight should be give the Mature searches if you are going to give weight to anything

[11:18:05]  Jack Linden: Tigra.. all part of the support changes I expect; we’ve long had outsourced support folks and I believe that will continue

[11:18:06]  Rene Erlanger: busiesses have been buying up Matured rated lands for last 7 years!!……in many cases they operate PG rated establishments

[11:18:28]  Rene Erlanger: you cna’t exclude thme now ..out of PG only searches

[11:18:32]  Charlene Trudeau: I’m sure with 16/17 year olds joining the grid you can’t default mature on, but you can educate people as fast as possible what they are missing

[11:18:39]  Jack Linden: Charlene, yeah.. we could probably do one of those UI hints for that. *noted*

[11:18:56]  Master Kane: Rene.. 1 quick easy answer for, bud…. “Sex sales in SL” thats why.. lolol

[11:19:21]  Charlene Trudeau: I think the teens joining the main grid id the impetus behind the latest default change

[11:19:21]  Melody Regent: If you are going to be able to filter the kids anyway, defaulting to mature for adults makes sense, unless you cant really filter the kids like you say

[11:19:55]  Master Kane: char… that is just childish… lol.. i say keep them out until they turn 18 , then come in

[11:20:03]  Jack Linden: Melody.. one of the tough pieces of this is that Mainland is mixed maturity and cameras can travel a looong way.

[11:20:04]  Jack Linden: That’s something the team are looking at

[11:20:13]  Melody Regent: @Jack, what are your SERIOUS estimates of how many kids will be migrating over anyway? What kind of numbers are we really looking at?

[11:20:14]  Charlene Trudeau: true, they can change my graphics settings every time I do a new install, ostensibly based on my graphics card, why not check the box based on the presumed category of person behind the avatar

[11:20:37]  Qie Niangao: Jack: looking at Mainland mixed ratings *how* ?

[11:20:47]  Jack Linden: Melody, honestly I don’t think we know. Certainly a few thousand actives.

[11:20:57]  Master Kane: something are against FTC rules char.. so they may not be able to do soem of those things

[11:21:18]  Charlene Trudeau: Melody, the migrated numbers may not be as important as how many more will come that actually play by the rules and don’t come because they don’t want to be on ‘teen grid’ and are too honest to join main grid

[11:21:24]  Master Kane: Alliez!!! Howdy!

[11:21:30]  Jack Linden: Qie, just with regards to how we would handle 16 and 17 year olds being on a PG rated Mainland region, with a Mature rated region next door

[11:21:36]  Jack Linden: That’s clearly a potential problem

[11:21:44]  Alliez Mysterio: Good to see you Master Kane

[11:21:45]  Qie Niangao: right, but what can be done about it?

[11:21:45]  Charlene Trudeau: my own that will be 15 in December is crying in his cups because he’ll be a year without SL

[11:21:52]  Qie Niangao: keep them off the mainland altogether??

[11:21:59]  Melody Regent: you knew this was coming, why didn’t you make a separate PG region and parcel down the other regions. Mature one region, PG one, Adult one. Saves ont he ‘peeking”

[11:22:07]  Luci Koenkamp: yes send them all to zindra

[11:22:09]  Jack Linden: hey alliez

[11:22:13]  Uni Ninetails: Dont render mature sims to teens? *shrugs

[11:22:19]  Charlene Trudeau: not as bad as having ‘adult’ next door, a problem already cleared

[11:22:19]  Alliez Mysterio: HI Jack

[11:22:38]  Master Kane: Lets all give up our linden homes for the teenies

[11:22:41]  Master Kane: i mean teens

[11:22:48]  Alliez Mysterio: I like mine

[11:22:51]  Alliez Mysterio: lol

[11:22:56]  Qie Niangao: Uni: yeah, that’s what I’d love to hear… together with “privacy pockets” for everybody

[11:22:58]  Master Kane: they can play on that lag fest places

[11:23:01]  Master Kane: hehe

[11:23:02]  Jack Linden: Qie, that’s what we’re looking at. Do we visually mute by maturity so those neighbour regions appear empty, or do we do something else. No decisions yet but we’re looking at it

[11:23:10]  Charlene Trudeau: but honestly, as far as porn goes, in most cases, they can get better free online. Your risk here is sexual/emotional predators, something that is a risk for any social environment on the web, even MMORPG games

[11:23:10]  Master Kane: ok.. im moving in with alliez then

[11:23:14]  Master Kane:

[11:23:15]  Qie Niangao: okay, thanks, Jack

[11:23:25]  Uni Ninetails: dont make them empty. have a placeholder full of linden foliage

[11:23:37]  Gem Island Lot #2: LandMark giver at Venus Gem (Gem Islands lot 2 – 2000L$/week) has just been used by Pete Godric !

[11:23:41]  Luci Koenkamp: you could use something like a region barrier

[11:23:42]  Dale Innis votes for a PG anti-Zindra; keep the kids there.

[11:23:50]  Jack Linden: I think we should all move in with alliez. her lindenhome sounds awesome

[11:23:55]  Sera Lok: i like that idea Dale:)

[11:24:06]  Tigra Mochi: [11:16] Tigra Mochi: why is the support now only Ontyne and not Linden Concierge, JAck?

[11:24:09]  Alliez Mysterio: no room, well we can share I guess

[11:24:09]  Dale Innis: ( we could call it “Ardniz” )

[11:24:13]  Jack Linden: Uni.. like an endless forest? that could be fun

[11:24:15]  Sera Lok: yeah, support is SUCKING big time.

[11:24:16]  Charlene Trudeau: why, Dale? If you think we don’t already have teens ‘cheating’ here now, you’re mistaken

[11:24:16]  Master Kane: lol

[11:24:36]  Master Kane: Agreed Sera…

[11:24:37]  Jack Linden: Hey Tigra, I answered that.. above

[11:24:38]  Sera Lok: tons of misinformation and bad attitude, even when you are nice to them. something is clearly rotten there

[11:24:44]  Uni Ninetails: Jack: Yeah some prefab templates you just slot in where mature regions are

[11:24:46]  Alliez Mysterio: I think we have to give the new company a chance

[11:24:53]  Dale Innis: Is entirely a liability issue. If LL officially allows kids onto mainland, their lawyers will feel obliged to make all mainland PG.

[11:24:57]  Charlene Trudeau: I MMORPG with a group of my residents and some others, none of whom believe my 14 year old is only 14. He’d pass here fine if I was willing to risk my estate to allow him on

[11:24:57]  Sera Lok: when are you getting rid of the ontynes and letting us talk to Lindens again?

[11:25:02]  EriX Oh: my sim is mostly full of such cheaters… – mostly <14 years … – I made already ARs

[11:25:06]  Dale Innis: If LL officially keeps kids in Kid Continent, then not a problem.

[11:25:11]  Sera Lok: at least those of us who pay hundreds of dollars in tier every month to LL.

[11:25:19]  Alliez Mysterio: Company from colorado

[11:25:30]  Alliez Mysterio: They are hiring but not from NT

[11:25:31]  Charlene Trudeau: The problem is, Dale, the Lindens don’t *really* know

[11:25:33]  Alliez Mysterio: NY

[11:25:34]  Luci Koenkamp: a teen continenet would be the best solution

[11:25:40]  Master Kane: JACK——– I called in and talked to an ontyne… about world map being grey… after a few , they told me to contact the region owner… FFS…. I AM the owner and they also told me, the region may be offline.. FFS!

[11:25:44]  Tigra Mochi: I did not see, I am getting nowhere with performance issues on my sims, and when i call its ontynes who refuse to get a linden concierge or any linden fo that mater , the same happens in live chat

[11:25:46]  Luci Koenkamp: there´s enough mainland

[11:25:52]  Ciaran Laval: “Cheating teens” who lie to get here is a whole different kettle of fish to welcoming teens, we’ve already got mature sims having PG parcels excluded from Pg search now, what else is going to have to give

[11:25:55]  Dale Innis: Doesn’t matter what they really know, as long as they have official policy and make good-faith effort to enforce. Doesn’t have to be perfect.

[11:26:01]  Sera Lok: they really do NOT know what they are talking about, 99% of the time. it is SAD

[11:26:05]  Master Kane: thats how bad IT IS!

[11:26:08]  Sera Lok: and then they get RUDE

[11:26:26]  Alliez Mysterio: I found out that is a bug if you use 1.23 but funny thing is that those using 2, still see the sim as gray

[11:26:27]  Sera Lok is done now with her bitchin

[11:26:30]  Master Kane: agreed Sera and close the chat or hang up on you

[11:26:31]  Charlene Trudeau: And, if they close the chat before we can SAVE, we have no back history.

[11:26:34]  Sera Lok: but it’s really BAD

[11:26:36]  Sera Lok: lol

[11:26:41]  Alexxa Despres: I get it on BOTH viewers

[11:26:43]  Charlene Trudeau: Jack, I HATE that we don’t have auto chat logs to our history any more

[11:26:49]  Master Kane: its pretty much fixed now alliez

[11:27:00]  Alliez Mysterio: would someone with version 2 viewer look at dalliez

[11:27:06]  Sera Lok: yep, i’ve been disconnected without my issues resolved. ok now i’m done.

[11:27:11]  Jack Linden: Charlene, really? I thought all the chatlogs were in your support history regardless of whether you save?

[11:27:13]  Charlene Trudeau: That is the worst move in support from a website POV (Ontynes and cut hours top it, of course)

[11:27:18]  Master Kane: umm what do ya wanna know

[11:27:19]  Sera Lok: of course the ontyne reported it as resolved….

[11:27:25]  Charlene Trudeau: not since they redid the website that I saw

[11:27:26]  Luci Koenkamp: they are Jack

[11:27:29]  Charlene Trudeau: are they?

[11:27:32]  Ciaran Laval: Ontynes won’t be around for long by all accounts

[11:27:37]  Charlene Trudeau: ok, I’ll have to look again

[11:27:41]  Rene Erlanger: Jack – not are you killing Busineesse with your Search implemetation…..which has been dragging on for 6 months (Could have built the San Fran Golden Gate Bridge during that time)…….now you are hurting PG businesses that located on Mature sims in good faith….by excluding them totally out of PG only searches.

[11:27:45]  Master Kane: cute, sexy, tall, thin… mhm.. yep

[11:27:48]  Charlene Trudeau: I stand corrected

[11:27:51]  Tigra Mochi: Jack, the onlynes are not trained and do not have the tools to troubleshoot, outsourcing to thejm and not providing concierge level support , then why have concierge?

[11:27:52]  Sera Lok: pleease let that be true. can we talk to Lindens who know about this world please? when we need support?

[11:28:02]  Nema Galicia: I have a few things “broke” but with the non help I get from chat I just live with it and tht makes me not happy with owning sims at all anymore

[11:28:25]  Ciaran Laval: Well not sure we’ll be talking to Lindens Sera, it will apparently be a different outsourced company but maybe the plan has changed

[11:28:34]  Charlene Trudeau: concierge level people should NEVER be passed to the front lines, Jack. There needs to be a direct to concierge level lindens again.

[11:28:37]  Sera Lok: ugh

[11:28:50]  Jack Linden: Rene.. to be fair, yes we have had serious search problems but Search today is substantially improved over 4 months ago and getting better each release. Still a ton to do of course, but we’re definitely getting there

[11:28:51]  Luci Koenkamp: I agree Charlene

[11:28:54]  Ciaran Laval: We’ll never get the right level of richness from an outsourced company

[11:29:00]  Master Kane: Agreed Char!

[11:29:06]  Aargle Zymurgy: I know about Tigra’s problem. another customer of mine had the same sim issue. A Linden employee fixed the problem. Ontyne is presently refusing (for about 6 weeks now as I recall) to fix Tigra’s problem or refer it to someone who can.

[11:29:09]  Sera Lok: i don’t need to be treated like a dummy, i’ve been here 4 years, i know how to ask a support question, and it doesn’t get resolved

[11:29:16]  Tigra Mochi: and JAck, I was told this by an Ontyne, that all they can do to help is restart my sim to try to fix lag, which is not a solution, and some even say they cxant even do that

[11:29:35]  Alliez Mysterio: Any decision yet on tiers for next year?

[11:29:35]  Sera Lok: they stall, they give misinformation, they take an hour to do what talking to Molly would be solved in 2 minutes. with a smile

[11:29:43]  Sera Lok: now it’s “wtf do YOU want”

[11:29:51]  Jack Linden: Ciaran, I’m not sure I agree.. I think you can get that level from an outsourced group but it takes a good deal of work and commitment on both sides

[11:29:52]  Giancarlo Takacs: Or Leo ;D

[11:30:04]  Charlene Trudeau: ok, I see how they are logged, just difficult to tell which are chat logs and which are cases started via web, but they are there. Thanks for correcting me.

[11:30:07]  Sera Lok: sure if they had any idea how the platofrm worked!!!!!!

[11:30:10]  Master Kane: Jack.. what LL has done is this… 1) show favortism to those with more money to buy regions and PISS on the ones that do not. Even those with many regions are being pissed upon… By support.. is this a way to keep your users?

[11:30:41]  Sera Lok: those ontynes are not commited. not the ones i’ve talked to. they could give 2 shits about my problems

[11:30:52]  Rene Erlanger: but it doesn’t deal with the rating system…..some Businesses have been established a number of years on Matures sims selling PG content only……they are excluded from PG search. They just can’t up and relocate…there are considerations to take into account

[11:30:54]  Master Kane: agree sera

[11:30:57]  Uni Ninetails: Jack appreciate an answer to Alliez’s Q please.

[11:30:59]  Michael Timeless: Jack I disagree. Look at your history of outsourcing technology endeavors. Compaq tried it and were out of business (purchased by HP) within two years because their customers lost faith.

[11:31:00]  Jack Linden: Alliez, I don’t currently expect any change but we’ll blog out to the community on that (sadly I don’t know when that will go out though)

[11:31:00]  Melody Regent: [11:29:35] Alliez Mysterio: Any decision yet on tiers for next year? <<<—— This is one more unkept promise that is grossly overdue

[11:31:00]  Ciaran Laval: Jack outsourced companies will be supporting general computing issues, thinking they can handle anything, you need in-house support for a platform like this, it’s not a case of turning it off and on again, there’s a much greater requirment for richness here

[11:31:04]  Sera Lok: yeah, tiers next year?

[11:31:12]  Alliez Mysterio: ty

[11:31:15]  Sera Lok: exactly Ciaran

[11:31:38]  Master Kane: Alliez.. that means they will tell us like 3 months before they take effect.. to keep their user base

[11:31:43]  Master Kane: I say abandon now

[11:32:05]  Jack Linden: ouch Master.

[11:32:09]  Alliez Mysterio: Well just maybe they will drop tiers and sell more sims

[11:32:09]  Master Kane: no straight answers.. no money in der pockets

[11:32:17]  Giancarlo Takacs: right on Master!

[11:32:18]  Master Kane: welll its the truth jack and you know it )

[11:32:22]  Charlene Trudeau: and handling someone who needs to know how to attach their new shoes is a different level of support than what we need, Jack. When we have an issue, its a REAL issue, it goes deeper than your average troubleshooting guide book, and we need people with the kind of experience we have to solve it

[11:32:24]  Alliez Mysterio: That is an idea

[11:32:29]  Tigra Mochi: getting support from an outsourced company who is not trained and/or doesnt have the tools or abilities to troubleshoot, is not service at all

[11:32:36]  Sera Lok: exactly Charlene

[11:32:37]  Luci Koenkamp: that´s tuff Master I dont think that many will follow your advice

[11:32:50]  Sera Lok: at least assign the higher paying users to someone.. like a liason of sorts

[11:32:50]  Master Kane: I am well versed in Business BS to employees!

[11:33:02]  Master Kane: no luci they wont

[11:33:14]  Master Kane: cause they Love their SL whcih is fine!

[11:33:36]  Sera Lok: having your employees make us feel stupid for asking for a sim restart is just……..ugh.

[11:33:39]  Charlene Trudeau: You also need to remember that on our estates, we probably (I know I do) provide a lot of that bullshit basic support to our residents directly, shaving at least some percentage of the low level calls to LL for assistance. I don’t think we ever get credit for that.

[11:33:47]  Luci Koenkamp: if I didn´t love it I wouldn´t be here … but support still sucks bigtime

[11:34:01]  Jack Linden: I don’t disagree with you Charlene, and it does need a richness to the knowledge. That’s incredibly hard (and expensive) to fund but as i’ve said.. the support group are not my area these days; they have great people and I know they care about quality

[11:34:02]  Suchalady Blackheart: mr jack linden i been having crash issues for 2 months

[11:34:11]  Suchalady Blackheart: on all my computers

[11:34:12]  Sera Lok: it was good when the Lindens were doing it, Jack.

[11:34:13]  Alliez Mysterio: I never expected credit I look at it as a cost of doing business

[11:34:14]  Charlene Trudeau: Right, Luci, and if we didn’t love it here, we wouldn’t bother with office hours either, we’d sulk in private or quit and leave.

[11:34:15]  Sera Lok: I was happy

[11:34:20]  Sera Lok: my rpoblems got resolved.

[11:34:27]  Ciaran Laval: Concierge support was superb when the Lindens were doing it

[11:34:31]  Sera Lok: Yup.

[11:34:44]  Alliez Mysterio: The good old day for sure

[11:34:45]  Sera Lok: you took that away, that’s why we disliek the way these ontynes are treating us

[11:34:45]  Master Kane: Agreed Ciaran

[11:34:47]  Melody Regent: [11:29:35] Alliez Mysterio: Any decision yet on tiers for next year? <<<—— This is one more unkept promise that is grossly overdue

[11:34:55]  Aargle Zymurgy: yes, back when concurrency was rising steadily

[11:34:58]  Alliez Mysterio: Melody he ans

[11:35:02]  Jack Linden: Melody, I replied above

[11:35:08]  Sera Lok: he did? lol

[11:35:12]  Alliez Mysterio: yes

[11:35:13]  Melody Regent: I am scrolling… I dont see it

[11:35:27]  Sera Lok: [11:31] Jack Linden: Alliez, I don’t currently expect any change but we’ll blog out to the community on that (sadly I don’t know when that will go out though)

[11:35:29]  Sera Lok: foudn it

[11:35:30]  Master Kane: basically mel.. no not till 3 months before

[11:35:32]  Master Kane:

[11:35:34]  Tigra Mochi: and other sim owners are here right now JAck, becasue there is notbody else to turn to , we are getting stonewalled dealing with serious perrformance issues on our sims and being told either they cant or wont do anything, or that everything looks fine from an Ontyne who doesnt even know how to look up Region settings

[11:35:44]  Alliez Mysterio: ty Sera

[11:35:46]  Melody Regent: thank you

[11:36:12]  Sera Lok: i’d feel a lot better about all the other bullshit happening right now if i got good support when i needed it

[11:36:21]  Master Kane: Tigra.. dont forget “file a ticket” which they close anyways!

[11:36:27]  Sera Lok: now i get the third degree just referencing a ticket and asking it to be looked at!

[11:36:31]  Dennis Lagan: Jack, i think , when you are late with your message about tier, we could now already assume everything stays the same till february. you told us half a year, so make sure it stays that period. if you are not in time, to bad, the deal is extended silently.

[11:36:36]  Alliez Mysterio: Sera why not do a ticket then call direct to LL

[11:36:37]  Nema Galicia: I think a goodf idea Jack would to bring the LInden in charege of help to your enxt meeting

[11:36:39]  EriX Oh: something, that annoys ME really, why I can’t LL give me higher support (as Estate Manager)… when sims are stuck ,or other problems … – II’m only basic account holder

[11:36:44]  Sera Lok: i don’t like to call

[11:36:54]  Sera Lok: i file a ticket, then contact live chat. it worked great before ontynes

[11:37:01]  Jack Linden: Dennis, yeah we have committed to 6 months notice on any changes. That’s a good point

[11:37:06]  Luci Koenkamp: true Sera

[11:37:07]  Alliez Mysterio: Well that might be a way to solve your problelm

[11:37:10]  Alliez Mysterio: problem

[11:37:23]  Sera Lok: no, i have heard more than 1 story about being spoken to rudely on the phone

[11:37:30]  Sera Lok: so i’m not even going there.

[11:37:34]  Melody Regent: @Jack – You have heard us ask over and over and over to add back land to the Market place and you told us was in beta. Why do we not have land in beta and what is the time frame to give this